 Brake pads, any real difference? |
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| bpu699 |
 May 31 2007, 01:17 PM
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#1
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Newbie  Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 28-June 06 From: wisconsin Member No.: 6,323  |
I might take my 914 to the track. Brakes are mediocre, and I have read as many threads as possible regarding this issue. Car has new rotors, pads, fluid, caliper rebuild, etc.
Pads, I believe, are "mintex" as replaced by the prior owner. Car stops adequately in everyday traffic, barely adequately on the highway. The brakes do not lock up, ever. Previous owner bled the system multiple times, replaced the lines, etc. So, would porterfield pads make a BIG difference??? Most of the threads mention that the stock system is "great", and can be locked up, assuming you have a properly working system and porterfield pads. Would changing the pads make a world of difference, or is it a waste of time? The porterfield pads will run 300$ or so for all 4 wheels. The BMW front brake upgrade will run the same. Which option is better??? |
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| rmital |
May 31 2007, 01:34 PM
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#2
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Northeast optimist Group: Members Posts: 1,947 Joined: 12-December 05 From: Park Ridge, NJ Member No.: 5,268 |
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| dflesburg |
May 31 2007, 01:37 PM
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#3
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,720 Joined: 6-April 04 From: Warm and Cheerful Centerville Ohio Member No.: 1,896 Region Association: None |
performance pads are better.
I run hawk pads on my supercharged mustang, much better than stock, john and i were laughing last night about trying to stop that thing is like trying to stop a train... |
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| Aaron Cox |
May 31 2007, 01:43 PM
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#4
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Professional Lawn Dart Group: Retired Admin Posts: 24,541 Joined: 1-February 03 From: OC Member No.: 219 Region Association: Southern California |
porterfield R4s (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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| TravisNeff |
May 31 2007, 01:54 PM
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#5
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,082 Joined: 20-March 03 From: Mesa, AZ Member No.: 447 Region Association: Southwest Region 
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I think you can find Porterfield R4s for about 140 or so, I can't find my link for it though. Some shop in the bay are I think.
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| bpu699 |
May 31 2007, 01:57 PM
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#6
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Newbie Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 28-June 06 From: wisconsin Member No.: 6,323 |
QUOTE(Aaron Cox @ May 31 2007, 11:43 AM)  Can you clarify this. Would changing pads likely make a difference between being able to lock the brakes and not? Would I truly appreciate a difference in stopping distances? If the difference in changing pads is subtle, I suspect that changing to the bmwcalipers would be the way to go. Has any one JUST changed pads, and then noticed a "WOW" difference? Or is the difference in changing pads more of an issue of fade resistance on the track? The car will spend 99% of its time on the street, perhaps 3 track events a year... |
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| TravisNeff |
May 31 2007, 02:20 PM
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#7
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,082 Joined: 20-March 03 From: Mesa, AZ Member No.: 447 Region Association: Southwest Region
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As for not being able to lock up the brakes, you need to bleed, bleed & bleed the system. Speedbleeders make bleeding a whole lot faster and easier.
As for pad changes, I can't comment - but I have heard from a lot of people that the Porterfield pads are a great improvement. |
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| Demick |
May 31 2007, 02:38 PM
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#8
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Ernie made me do it! Group: Benefactors Posts: 2,312 Joined: 6-February 03 From: Pleasanton, CA Member No.: 257  |
You should be able to lock your stock brakes without that much difficulty. If you can't, then something is wrong in your braking system. Fix that first before looking for better pads to bandaid the problem.
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| Matt Meyer |
May 31 2007, 02:46 PM
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#9
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Überlurker Group: Members Posts: 216 Joined: 2-December 03 From: Eastern Washington Member No.: 1,411 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
What size are your tires/wheels?
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| Joe Ricard |
May 31 2007, 03:02 PM
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#10
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CUMONIWANNARACEU Group: Members Posts: 6,811 Joined: 5-January 03 From: Gautier, MS Member No.: 92 |
Track lapping? don't bother with Porterfield R4S pads these are for street and Autocross. meaning they work great (infact awesome) in that capacity.
What you want for Track is the Porterfield R4. Need heat to stop but will not fade with rotor temps north of 650 degrees. Ford super duty DOT3 fluid changed out the day before the event. Boiling point of 535 degrees dry. and cheaper than them fancy racing fluids. This I can tell you as a matter of fact and "your milage will not vary" |
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| Eric_Shea |
May 31 2007, 03:33 PM
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#11
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PMB Performance Group: Admin Posts: 19,275 Joined: 3-September 03 From: Salt Lake City, UT Member No.: 1,110 Region Association: Rocky Mountains  |
Stolen and "modified" text:
"Mintex brake pads have a silver metallic formulation that gives the brakes a distinctly shitty feel while eliminating stopping power, brake squeal and dust." Do NOT use semi-metallic pads on "any" 914. For most applications what resellers list as OEM (Textar, Jurid, Pagid etc.) organic pads are usually best. You don't need Porterfields to "lock-up" your brakes. You simply need decent pads, especially if what you said is true: new rotors, pads, fluid, caliper rebuild, etc. For high performance applications I agree with the Porterfield street recommendations. Those Mintex pads are killing you... BMW calipers would be money and time wasted. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) |
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| Eric_Shea |
May 31 2007, 03:36 PM
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#12
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PMB Performance Group: Admin Posts: 19,275 Joined: 3-September 03 From: Salt Lake City, UT Member No.: 1,110 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
QUOTE Track lapping? don't bother with Porterfield R4S pads these are for street and Autocross. meaning they work great (infact awesome) in that capacity. What you want for Track is the Porterfield R4. Need heat to stop but will not fade with rotor temps north of 650 degrees. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) with her. Although... 99% street (as stated) I would go with the street pads. The one's Joe is talking about need to heat up to work properly. Not good for a street or autocross car. |
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| RoadGlue |
May 31 2007, 03:43 PM
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#13
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Sonoma County Gear Head Group: Admin Posts: 2,033 Joined: 8-January 03 From: Santa Rosa, CA Member No.: 108 Region Association: Northern California
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QUOTE(Eric_Shea @ May 31 2007, 01:36 PM) The one's Joe is talking about need to heat up to work properly. Not good for a street or autocross car. I run straight R4 pads and they work just fine when cold. My only complaints are that they can squeal loudly at times and make a lot of dust. Carbon's hard, so it can sound like metal on metal. Fun (annoying). They're fine for street cars, |
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| Rand |
May 31 2007, 03:46 PM
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#14
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Cross Member Group: Members Posts: 7,409 Joined: 8-February 05 From: OR Member No.: 3,573 Region Association: None |
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| Joe Ricard |
May 31 2007, 03:56 PM
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#15
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CUMONIWANNARACEU Group: Members Posts: 6,811 Joined: 5-January 03 From: Gautier, MS Member No.: 92 |
OK, well then I guess you will have to pick through all the bull and then go do exactly what you think is right.
But please do us all a favor . Keep the track pads on the track or never drive behind me. |
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| RoadGlue |
May 31 2007, 04:00 PM
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#16
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Sonoma County Gear Head Group: Admin Posts: 2,033 Joined: 8-January 03 From: Santa Rosa, CA Member No.: 108 Region Association: Northern California
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QUOTE(Joe Ricard @ May 31 2007, 01:56 PM) OK, well then I guess you will have to pick through all the bull and then go do exactly what you think is right. But please do us all a favor . Keep the track pads on the track or never drive behind me. I bought the R4 pads directly from Rich Bontempi and he claims he has never had any trouble with them on his customer's street cars. "Lots of people use the R4 on the street for normal driving. They stop quickly, don't need to be hot to work well, and then will work great when you go to any track event, or drive hard on the street. That's the only Porterfield that I stock." I've been running these pads since early April, 99% on the street and up at Thunderhill. I have a stop light and a stop sign less than a block from my door and I've never had any trouble stopping. Have you used R4 pads on the street? I'm guessing not. If you're coming to the WCR, I'll happily let you drive my car to see for yourself. Cheers, |
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| Eric_Shea |
May 31 2007, 04:10 PM
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#17
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PMB Performance Group: Admin Posts: 19,275 Joined: 3-September 03 From: Salt Lake City, UT Member No.: 1,110 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
I think we're all confused.
Are you taking it to a track (as stated), or, is it 99% street (as stated)? Better yet, what kind of a track events? A simple DE with PCA or other sanctioning body at a big track would probably be OK for a couple of laps with good pads (not Mintex). An autocross track would be fine with decent organic pads or some nice Porterfields. Again, either way, I'd recommend dropping your el cheapo Mintex pads and getting some run of the mill organic pads "at least". Adjusting the rear venting clearance can help as well. I'd venture to say 90% of the cars out there haven't set them properly. |
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| ConeDodger |
May 31 2007, 04:26 PM
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#18
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Apex killer! Group: Members Posts: 23,586 Joined: 31-December 04 From: Tahoe Area Member No.: 3,380 Region Association: Northern California
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Eric is too kind. If I see the words "BMW Caliper" and "upgrade" used in the same sentence I will become violent. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)
Even with the mintex pads you should be able to "lock up" your brakes. Mine are good with Mintex pads. Of course, mine are PMB rebuilds and everyone knows that brake calipers rebuilt by polygamists are better... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) Yes Eric, I will get rid of the Mintex pads... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) |
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| Eric_Shea |
May 31 2007, 04:33 PM
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#19
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PMB Performance Group: Admin Posts: 19,275 Joined: 3-September 03 From: Salt Lake City, UT Member No.: 1,110 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Just wait til ya get some real pads in there.
Really scares the wives (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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| ConeDodger |
May 31 2007, 04:45 PM
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#20
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Apex killer! Group: Members Posts: 23,586 Joined: 31-December 04 From: Tahoe Area Member No.: 3,380 Region Association: Northern California
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QUOTE(Eric_Shea @ May 31 2007, 03:33 PM) Just wait til ya get some real pads in there. Really scares the wives (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) The PMB rebuilds you did for me are probably going to go up for sale. Harvey Wiedman is doing some RSR wheels for me and I am going 5 lug. I need to get some struts and place an order with you for some trailing arms pretty quick though... |
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