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> Wheels and Tires, Let's get this discussion centralized
Pat Garvey
post May 12 2007, 08:25 PM
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QUOTE(Dan (Almaden Valley) @ May 12 2007, 12:37 AM) *

here are mine after hand polishing

Dan, those are gorgeous! Question, though. Assuming you've polished off the anodizing, how frequently do you think repolishing will be necessary? This is NOT a slam BTW, I'm just curious.
Pat
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robby750
post May 17 2007, 10:18 PM
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QUOTE(Pat Garvey @ May 12 2007, 09:25 PM) *

QUOTE(Dan (Almaden Valley) @ May 12 2007, 12:37 AM) *

here are mine after hand polishing

Dan, those are gorgeous! Question, though. Assuming you've polished off the anodizing, how frequently do you think repolishing will be necessary? This is NOT a slam BTW, I'm just curious.
Pat

I polished the spokes on mine and they only require touch up about once a year. Probably less than an hour to do them all.
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nowlings
post Jun 21 2007, 05:31 PM
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In reference to the 4 bolt fuchs, I notice that in most that I look at there are either no center caps (missing), or a cheap looking plain (plastic chrome?) cap on them. Are the Porsche crest caps that you use on the 911 fuchs also interchangeable to this 4 bolt style or does it require a different type center cap. I'm still new to 914s and learning something new every day. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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1970 Neun vierzehn
post Jun 21 2007, 05:44 PM
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(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)

The center caps used on 5 bolt Fuchs alloys are not interchangable with those with the 4 bolt fitment. And yes, it does seem that most of the time that they are shown, those metal center caps seem to be dented. Those of us who have a set of perfect center caps guard them closely (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
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nowlings
post Jun 21 2007, 05:55 PM
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QUOTE(1970 Neun vierzehn @ Jun 21 2007, 04:44 PM) *

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)

The center caps used on 5 bolt Fuchs alloys are not interchangable with those with the 4 bolt fitment. And yes, it does seem that most of the time that they are shown, those metal center caps seem to be dented. Those of us who have a set of perfect center caps guard them closely (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Thanks for the info.. Are there any Porsche Crest center caps available aftermarket that you know of from one of the vendors out there?
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Pat Garvey
post Jun 21 2007, 06:01 PM
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QUOTE(nowlings @ Jun 21 2007, 05:55 PM) *

QUOTE(1970 Neun vierzehn @ Jun 21 2007, 04:44 PM) *

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)

The center caps used on 5 bolt Fuchs alloys are not interchangable with those with the 4 bolt fitment. And yes, it does seem that most of the time that they are shown, those metal center caps seem to be dented. Those of us who have a set of perfect center caps guard them closely (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Thanks for the info.. Are there any Porsche Crest center caps available aftermarket that you know of from one of the vendors out there?

I think Perf Products has/had some that are stick on. Don't know if they still do, or how long they last. May give them a try, though.
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nowlings
post Jun 21 2007, 06:12 PM
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QUOTE(Pat Garvey @ Jun 21 2007, 05:01 PM) *

QUOTE(nowlings @ Jun 21 2007, 05:55 PM) *

QUOTE(1970 Neun vierzehn @ Jun 21 2007, 04:44 PM) *

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)

The center caps used on 5 bolt Fuchs alloys are not interchangable with those with the 4 bolt fitment. And yes, it does seem that most of the time that they are shown, those metal center caps seem to be dented. Those of us who have a set of perfect center caps guard them closely (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Thanks for the info.. Are there any Porsche Crest center caps available aftermarket that you know of from one of the vendors out there?

I think Perf Products has/had some that are stick on. Don't know if they still do, or how long they last. May give them a try, though.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Thanks for the lead Pat...I just found a Performance product catalog and I checked online. Yes, they do have the crest caps...For $74.95 each! Good news is that they are on sale now, so a set will only cost a little over $250.00 plus tax. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sheeplove.gif) I guess this is what the market is on these things.
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Pat Garvey
post Jun 21 2007, 06:17 PM
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QUOTE(nowlings @ Jun 21 2007, 06:12 PM) *

QUOTE(Pat Garvey @ Jun 21 2007, 05:01 PM) *

QUOTE(nowlings @ Jun 21 2007, 05:55 PM) *

QUOTE(1970 Neun vierzehn @ Jun 21 2007, 04:44 PM) *

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)

The center caps used on 5 bolt Fuchs alloys are not interchangable with those with the 4 bolt fitment. And yes, it does seem that most of the time that they are shown, those metal center caps seem to be dented. Those of us who have a set of perfect center caps guard them closely (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Thanks for the info.. Are there any Porsche Crest center caps available aftermarket that you know of from one of the vendors out there?

I think Perf Products has/had some that are stick on. Don't know if they still do, or how long they last. May give them a try, though.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Thanks for the lead Pat...I just found a Performance product catalog and I checked online. Yes, they do have the crest caps...For $74.95 each! Good news is that they are on sale now, so a set will only cost a little over $250.00 plus tax. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sheeplove.gif) I guess this is what the market is on these things.


GULP! Hope you want them badly!
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Pat Garvey
post Aug 6 2007, 09:34 PM
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Ok, we have several threads going that have been hijacked to "We Be Tires for CW's". Let's start fresh here, so it's all in one place.

Here's the gist! Many of us want appropriate tires for our CW 914's. To do so, requires a HUGE outlay for tires that were designed 35 or more years ago. Yeah, they're available, but the price can be outrageous (IS outrageous, in my estimation).

So what can we do about it?

Let's rehash the side threads here, so all can see easilly.

As I see it, the primary questions are:

1. Are vintage tires available? And I'm talking about original sizes. Where? How much? What are the advantages/disadvantages of these tires?
2. Are contemporary tires available in vintage sizes? Same questions as in #1.
3. Who's doing what about this situation? Are you caving to current tires, etc.? Why/why not?
4. Are the concours advantages to remanufactured vintage-sized tires worth worth the cost, from a performance/safety point of view versus maintaing purity?
Pat
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Jasfsmith
post Aug 7 2007, 12:52 PM
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QUOTE(Pat Garvey @ Aug 6 2007, 11:34 PM) *

Ok, we have several threads going that have been hijacked to "We Be Tires for CW's". Let's start fresh here, so it's all in one place.


As I see it, the primary questions are:

1. Are vintage tires available? And I'm talking about original sizes. Where? How much? What are the advantages/disadvantages of these tires?
2. Are contemporary tires available in vintage sizes? Same questions as in #1.
3. Who's doing what about this situation? Are you caving to current tires, etc.? Why/why not?
4. Are the concours advantages to remanufactured vintage-sized tires worth worth the cost, from a performance/safety point of view versus maintaing purity?
Pat


First thing is to establish what constitutes the original tire provided by Porsche. From what I can find:

914-4's came with either 4 1/2" J x 15 with 155SR15 tires
or 5 1/2" J x 15 with 165HR15 tires
914-6's came with 5 1/2" J x 15 with 165HR15 tires
or 5 1/2" J x 14 with 185HR14 tires

The combination of of rim size and tire offering appears to be independent of whether it is a steel wheel or alloy.

I know Michelin ZX (155SR15), XAS (165HR15) and XWX (185HR14) appeared on delivered cars in the US. I can recall both a Dunlop and Continental tire also appearing but for the life of me I cannot recall the model name that they offered.

My point is, nowhere can I find mention of the tire brand provided, either is spec books or advertisements.

Vredstein Sprint was a favorite during the '70's as a replacement tire. Uniroyal, Firestone, BF Goodrich and Goodyear all had matching tire sizes.

Both XAS (165HR15) and Vredstein (155SR15 and 165HR15) are available from Coker Tire at $191, $79 and $89 respectively.

Having run several lower profile "contemporary" tires, and currently the XAS's, only disadvantage I have found is the "skinny" vs. "wide" appearance. On the plus side, with the XAS's, my speedometer finally is correct, and the ride is less harsh. If I were autox'ing, I'd want the lower profile for sure. Cost of the XAS is high compared to the majority of contemporary tires running around $85-$90.

There are other tires of the period that would fit, however they do not have the correct speed rating.

Contenporary tires I've found that match include BFGoodrich Radial TA (155SR15) at $62.

I opted to go the XAS route as my spare wheel has the original 165HR15 XAS on it and I am not likely to campaign my 914-6 is any autocrosses. That and an eBay deal that I could not refuse (seller purchased the Coker Tires and must have decided that they were to "skinny" for his liking.)

From a performance and safety point of view, I don't see any problem with using the Coker Tires, as it is my understanding that the tires are today's construction techniques with the original molds used for tread and sidewalls. The HR speed rating is certainly adequate for my needs.

How far you go in respect to obtaining a Concours advantage is open to question. If I hadn't had the original spare, I most likely would have opted for the Vredstein to save some cash.

If I had a VERY prepared car underside, I might have opted for the contemporary tires, and acknowledge that I may receive a demerit or point reduction during a Concours judging.

Knowing what class your going to be entered in may also enter into your decision on which way to go. Only in the Preservation Class would I think it necessary to have the original tire size of whatever brand that is available.
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Johny Blackstain
post Aug 7 2007, 06:05 PM
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If James is correct in his post above it would seem the Vredestein would be the appropriate tire for me @ Concours. They have a 165HR15 & would appear to be period correct.

James, you are aware though that the Michelin XAS is a tubed tire & will not fit onto a Mahle or a Fuchs? The only tubeless Michelin available is the XZX, @ $131.00/per (Coker), & SR rated. Also, my Kardex says I have to have HR tires so there is documentation that says what tires the car came w/ besides the tank sticker. To preserve a car properly would involve not only the right size but the right rating.

I've chosen to go w/ the OEM gambit- "Dunlop SP 57" 165HR15 was my original tire. "Dunlop SP Sport A2+" 195/65HR15 is what she'll have in Charolette. Both are HR rated & both are the "SP" model from Dunlop. I am planning on bringing my Kardex, Bill of Sale & COA to Charolette, as required? Should I bring my old "SP57" as well?

I would also presume from James's posting that the Kuhmo 165/80HR15 available from "The Tire Rack" @ $32.00/per is the best choice for every CW except those in preservation, because Kuhmo was not around in 1976.


BTW- sick as a dog... summertime flu has got me again. I can go outside in shorts & a T shirt in winter & not get sick. In & out of AC into the Southern heat is murder on my body. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)


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Pat Garvey
post Aug 7 2007, 08:06 PM
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I'm awaiting additional responses. But, at this point I'm thinking I won't go original spec.

Why? Because by late fall of this year or next spring my 914 will be driveable to my expectations. That means that all mechanical parts (including the calipers) will be in "as new" condition. Other than the brakes, things will only be refurbished - not rebuilt. From 2008 on, I plan on using my 914 as it was used in the eraly years. I'll drive it to work, I'll drive it to restaurants - I'll use it. It'll still be a CW car, but it's going to be used in good weather - no more garge queen! Life's too short & I've made my decision.

So, I'm about to cave on tires. Though I'll probably get some decent street tires for my chromes, I'll still need some CW tires for the steelies.

Someone tell me more about the Kumho's, because I think size will win over "name" at Charlotte.
Pat
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Johny Blackstain
post Aug 7 2007, 08:12 PM
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Pat- here is the link to the Kuhmos on The Tire Rack. I have Kuhmos on my truck & love them. These are TR rated, not SR or HR but @ $32.00/per I would think they're worth it. Rather suspicious that they're on backorder, no?

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?ti...yes&place=0
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Porsche Rescue
post Aug 7 2007, 08:54 PM
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I once put the Kuhmos on a 66 911 with stock 4.5" chromes and they were fine in both appearance and handling.
James, I recall new 914's (four only) coming with the S rated Michelin ZX. Could be wrong, but wondering if the H tire was a "six" thing or LE thing.
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Pat Garvey
post Aug 7 2007, 09:19 PM
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QUOTE(Johny Blackstain @ Aug 7 2007, 08:12 PM) *

Pat- here is the link to the Kuhmos on The Tire Rack. I have Kuhmos on my truck & love them. These are TR rated, not SR or HR but @ $32.00/per I would think they're worth it. Rather suspicious that they're on backorder, no?

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?ti...yes&place=0


Al,

Know what scares me? Two things:

1. Haven't bought 914 tires in 28 years ( think about it - where were you when I bought my last set)
2. Tthough I know of the brand, know nothing about the quality.
3. Will they be accepted, regardless of proper sizing by concours judges?
4. They are just way too cheap - why?
Pat
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Johny Blackstain
post Aug 7 2007, 09:33 PM
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QUOTE(Pat Garvey @ Aug 7 2007, 11:19 PM) *

Al,

Know what scares me? Two things:

1. Haven't bought 914 tires in 28 years ( think about it - where were you when I bought my last set)
2. Tthough I know of the brand, know nothing about the quality.
3. Will they be accepted, regardless of proper sizing by concours judges?
4. They are just way too cheap - why?
Pat


Pat- 28 yrs ago I was 16, in high school & Pop had replaced 4 of the 5 Dunlops w/ Avanti tires (IMG:style_emoticons/default/barf.gif) . Kuhmo is a new guy on the block regarding tires so they're trying to undercut everyone's prices. I have "Kuhmo Ecsta AST's" on the truck & they rock, honestly. Wearing well, good grip & because of the size (245/50HR16) transfer most of my available power to the road. I have no idea if Kuhmos would be accepted in Preservation but see no reason at all why they would not be accepted in all the other divisions.
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Jasfsmith
post Aug 8 2007, 08:14 AM
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QUOTE(Johny Blackstain @ Aug 7 2007, 08:05 PM) *


James, you are aware though that the Michelin XAS is a tubed tire & will not fit onto a Mahle or a Fuchs? The only tubeless Michelin available is the XZX, @ $131.00/per (Coker), & SR rated. Also, my Kardex says I have to have HR tires so there is documentation that says what tires the car came w/ besides the tank sticker. To preserve a car properly would involve not only the right size but the right rating.

I've chosen to go w/ the OEM gambit- "Dunlop SP 57" 165HR15 was my original tire. "Dunlop SP Sport A2+" 195/65HR15 is what she'll have in Charolette. Both are HR rated & both are the "SP" model from Dunlop. I am planning on bringing my Kardex, Bill of Sale & COA to Charolette, as required? Should I bring my old "SP57" as well?



Yes, I am aware that XAS are tube type (a pain to balance and more $$). My Mahle's (5 bolt) accept them without any problems. I've not found any restrictions to tubetype tires and Mahles/Fuchs anywhere.

As I theorize, to be period correct, the tire must have the correct size (width and profile, and speed rating. In my case the ZXZ would not meet the speed rating.

The use of 195/65HR15 in my opinion would not meet the original spec as the width and profile is different than the 165HR15 that your sticker indicates. I'm not sure what good bringing an old "SP57" when you have newer profile "A2's" mounted, other than pointing out that you have different tires. <grin>

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Jasfsmith
post Aug 8 2007, 08:22 AM
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QUOTE(Pat Garvey @ Aug 7 2007, 10:06 PM) *

I'm awaiting additional responses. But, at this point I'm thinking I won't go original spec.

Why? Because by late fall of this year or next spring my 914 will be driveable to my expectations. That means that all mechanical parts (including the calipers) will be in "as new" condition. Other than the brakes, things will only be refurbished - not rebuilt. From 2008 on, I plan on using my 914 as it was used in the eraly years. I'll drive it to work, I'll drive it to restaurants - I'll use it. It'll still be a CW car, but it's going to be used in good weather - no more garge queen! Life's too short & I've made my decision.

So, I'm about to cave on tires. Though I'll probably get some decent street tires for my chromes, I'll still need some CW tires for the steelies.

Someone tell me more about the Kumho's, because I think size will win over "name" at Charlotte.
Pat


I have a set of Concours Fuchs (5 1/2" x 14) with low profile tyres on them for a similar purpose (the Mahle's intended for show and the Fuch's for go). Unfortunately, I find it a pain to swap them over, and the Mahle's are on most of the time.
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Jasfsmith
post Aug 8 2007, 08:29 AM
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QUOTE(Porsche Rescue @ Aug 7 2007, 10:54 PM) *

I once put the Kuhmos on a 66 911 with stock 4.5" chromes and they were fine in both appearance and handling.
James, I recall new 914's (four only) coming with the S rated Michelin ZX. Could be wrong, but wondering if the H tire was a "six" thing or LE thing.


Early steel wheels on the 914-4 were 4 1/2"x15" shod with 155SR15 tyres. Late style steel wheels were 5 1/2"x15" with 165HR tyres. The optional alloys (when offered) were 5 1/2"x15" with 165HR's.

All 914-6 (other than the M optioned) were 5 1/2"x15" steel with 165HR or 5 1/2"x15" alloy with 165HR and 5 1/2"x14" alloy with 185HR15 tyres. The M otion I believe were all shipped with 6" wide Fuchs and had 185/70 series tyres (XWX?). At least as far as I can tell (reviewing the few Owner's manuals I have, tyre literature I've stashed, and the factory manual). Perhaps someone could confirm my findings.
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Jasfsmith
post Aug 8 2007, 08:41 AM
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QUOTE(Johny Blackstain @ Aug 7 2007, 08:05 PM) *

If James is correct in his post above it would seem the Vredestein would be the appropriate tire for me @ Concours. They have a 165HR15 & would appear to be period correct.

....

I would also presume from James's posting that the Kuhmo 165/80HR15 available from "The Tire Rack" @ $32.00/per is the best choice for every CW except those in preservation, because Kuhmo was not around in 1976.

BTW- sick as a dog... summertime flu has got me again. I can go outside in shorts & a T shirt in winter & not get sick. In & out of AC into the Southern heat is murder on my body. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)


Vredestein would be a correct chose. I also recall that many hotshoes raved about them at autox's back then. I suspect it had more todo with the rubber compound than tread design.

Your assumption about the Kuhmo's is not quite right. As it has been pointed out, the tire is a TR rated not HR. TR's were not offered during the production period.
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