Wheels and Tires, Let's get this discussion centralized Options

[Tom_T]

Well, if you've trudged through all these pages of posts on wheels & tires, by now you know that you'd really LOVE to put a brand new roadworthy set of those fine grippy & period correct Dunlop SP57's on your 914 - & on your 60's-80's 911 & 912 too! Sooooo....... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

Well if you've always wanted to re-shoe your concours baby, garage queen or really nice driver - or any 914 - in the OEM Dunlop SP57 Tires, here's a chance to weigh in on what they're worth to you, in order to try to interest Dunlop in doing a limited production run at their UK vintage tire plant. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/type.gif)

Go here:
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=115150&st=

Doowit!!!!
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)



(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving-girl.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

[jetdriver]

I have a 75 Appearance group 1.8 with a set of Eppies (sp?) currently on the car.
I have the original rims that came with the car, and am begining to restore them.
I have been told that they came with Hub Caps. If so, does anyone have a picture or know where to buy an original set of hubcaps? If so, what is the price range?

Much appreciated.

Thank you!

Tom

[RFoulds]

Tom and Pat would know for sure, but I am 90% sure the 1975 steel wheel had no hubcaps.
First, are you sure they are the correct wheels for that car? Check with PCNA and get the Certificate of Authenticity. it should say which wheel option was on car when delivered. If it is an appearance group package, I would think it had Fuchs on it when delivered.
But, if for some reason it came with steel wheels, the later cars, 1973(?) an on had steel wheels with small center caps, not hubcaps or beauty rings. Like my avatar.
,

[Porsche Rescue]

Steel '75 wheels did not have hubcaps, only a black plastic cap in the center and plastic covers on the lug bolt heads.

[Tom_T]

I have a 75 Appearance group 1.8 with a set of Eppies (sp?) currently on the car.
I have the original rims that came with the car, and am begining to restore them.
I have been told that they came with Hub Caps. If so, does anyone have a picture or know where to buy an original set of hubcaps? If so, what is the price range?

Much appreciated.

Thank you!

Tom

Tom - (IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)

PS ... I'm over in Orange & several here are around OC!
PCA has an informal Porsches & Doughnuts at Krispy Kreme parking lot at The Block shopping center in Orange off the 22 at State College/City Center exit every 3rd Sat. am 8:30-10-ish. PM or email to me if you're going to show up & I'll meet you there.

IIRC the 75 1.8 would've either been the steel "star mag look" wheels that RFoulds showed restored in his earlier post in this topic - no hub caps were used (70-72 had hub caps prior to the intro of the mag look steelies). By using the mag look steelie, they eliminated the need to include the extra 4 hubcap parts & saved costs, while giving customers a more desired wheel style (same look as on Super Beetles).

However, I thought that usually the Appearance Group included the optional allow wheels as part of the package, but that may have changed as they started decoupling options for more profit & to offset DM to $ exchange rate escalation.

The OO could've done an item delete on the alloy wheels to get a price break - if they were included in the App. Grp., or the dealer could've swapped out alloys for steelies on another customers car, and then either sold it at an adjusted/lower price without them (or maybe just not told the buyer they were "missing" - as they did with many 914's spare being swapped for a steelie without telling the customer.

Otherwise the orig. buyer had the option for upgrade to either Mahle 4-lug "Baby Gas Burner" alloys, Pedrini alloys (if still available in 74/75 when your 1.8 was originally sold), or the Fuchs 2L style alloys - at extra cost.

You should check your 914's original window sticker or dealer sales invoice from when it was originally sold new for what was included on it, or if you don't have that, then contact Porsche PCNA to get a COA which should list what was included if it had optional wheels beyond the App. Grp. If only App. Grp., then it will only list that & other 75 owners will need to chime in on what theirs' included.

You can look at other COAs from 75 MY at Jeff Bowlsby's website here -
http://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/WindowStickers.htm

FYI - 73-76 Wheel Options:

73-76 Mag Style Steel Wheels (standard fitment):


73-76 Fuchs 2L 4-lug Alloy:


73-76 Mahle 4-lug Alloy:


73-74 -75? -76? Pedrini 4-lug Alloy:


Note that the Fuchs & Mahles include the OE center caps to cover the hubs' grease caps (some call those "hub caps").

.

..... and .....

This was the wheel & hubcap look from 70-72 MYs:


... Hey!!!! ..... I'm talking about the hub cap & wheels here - not the "Baby Moons"!
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[Tom_T]

Tom and Pat would know for sure, but I am 90% sure the 1975 steel wheel had no hubcaps.
First, are you sure they are the correct wheels for that car? Check with PCNA and get the Certificate of Authenticity. it should say which wheel option was on car when delivered. If it is an appearance group package, I would think it had Fuchs on it when delivered.
But, if for some reason it came with steel wheels, the later cars, 1973(?) an on had steel wheels with small center caps, not hubcaps or beauty rings. Like my avatar.
,

The App Grp for 1.7 & 1.8s came "standard" with either Pedrini or Mahle 4-lugs, but they could also order them with the Fuchs/App. Grp. set-up or have the dealer swap them (as Pat G. has related from when he bought his 72 914/4).

The 2.0's App Grp came with the 2L Fuchs - except the painted Mahles on 74 LEs, but the buyer could opt for Mahle or Pedrini instead.

BTW - joining PCA saves you something like $20 off the COA, & if you have the window sticker & send a copy to them - then PCNA will discount it more, so you save almost half of the $42 annual fee - plus PCA gets 20% off from dealers several times a year around SoCal (some dealers may do it always) - so there's the rest of the fee "saved"! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Anyone have a pic of the 73-76 Steelie's black center cap & lug caps they can post here for him? I don't have anything handy. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[Tom_T]

EDITED - DELETE

[Pat Garvey]

Tom and Pat would know for sure, but I am 90% sure the 1975 steel wheel had no hubcaps.
First, are you sure they are the correct wheels for that car? Check with PCNA and get the Certificate of Authenticity. it should say which wheel option was on car when delivered. If it is an appearance group package, I would think it had Fuchs on it when delivered.
But, if for some reason it came with steel wheels, the later cars, 1973(?) an on had steel wheels with small center caps, not hubcaps or beauty rings. Like my avatar.
,

The App Grp for 1.7 & 1.8s came "standard" with either Pedrini or Mahle 4-lugs, but they could also order them with the Fuchs/App. Grp. set-up or have the dealer swap them (as Pat G. has related from when he bought his 72 914/4).

The 2.0's App Grp came with the 2L Fuchs - except the painted Mahles on 74 LEs, but the buyer could opt for Mahle or Pedrini instead.

BTW - joining PCA saves you something like $20 off the COA, & if you have the window sticker & send a copy to them - then PCNA will discount it more, so you save almost half of the $42 annual fee - plus PCA gets 20% off from dealers several times a year around SoCal (some dealers may do it always) - so there's the rest of the fee "saved"! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Anyone have a pic of the 73-76 Steelie's black center cap & lug caps they can post here for him? I don't have anything handy. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

OK, I think there's a little confusion here.

Tom, 1.7 cars with app grp got wider non-styled steelies. Alloy wheels were an option above everything else. The 1.8 cars with app grp also did not recieve alloys as parts of the package. On 1.7's and 1.8's alloys were always an additional option, no matter which alloy.

The "star" type steelies did have a black dust cap. The earlier steelies did not, because they had a hubcap. Of course, all had bearing caps underneath.
Pat

[Tom_T]

OK, I think there's a little confusion here.

Tom, 1.7 cars with app grp got wider non-styled steelies. Alloy wheels were an option above everything else. The 1.8 cars with app grp also did not recieve alloys as parts of the package. On 1.7's and 1.8's alloys were always an additional option, no matter which alloy.

The "star" type steelies did have a black dust cap. The earlier steelies did not, because they had a hubcap. Of course, all had bearing caps underneath.
Pat

Thanx for clarifying Pat. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Since for the 73 MY on the standard steel wheel was the 5.5" wide x 15" - so I was thinking that at least the 73 MY 1.7s had the alloys included in the App. Grp., but wasn't sure for 74-76, nor 70-72 since they still had the 15" x 4.5" steelies standard then. If I find where I got that idea, then I'll post the info. here.

In any case, as I & the others noted to "the other Tom from HB" above, he needs to verify with the window sticker, dealer invoice &/or COA what wheels were originally on his 75 1.8 & restore those, or resource the OE ones noted if that is not the ones he has.

Similarly, as I'd said here before, my 73 2.0 that I bought used in Dec. 75 had Rivieras & a steel spare when I got it - instead of the Fuchs 2L alloys it came with from the factory, so I had to research & verify that, then resource a set of Fuchs 2Ls. Sometimes POs or dealers just changed wheels from the OE fitment! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[Pat Garvey]

OK, I think there's a little confusion here.

Tom, 1.7 cars with app grp got wider non-styled steelies. Alloy wheels were an option above everything else. The 1.8 cars with app grp also did not recieve alloys as parts of the package. On 1.7's and 1.8's alloys were always an additional option, no matter which alloy.

The "star" type steelies did have a black dust cap. The earlier steelies did not, because they had a hubcap. Of course, all had bearing caps underneath.
Pat

Thanx for clarifying Pat. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Since for the 73 MY on the standard steel wheel was the 5.5" wide x 15" - so I was thinking that at least the 73 MY 1.7s had the alloys included in the App. Grp., but wasn't sure for 74-76, nor 70-72 since they still had the 15" x 4.5" steelies standard then. If I find where I got that idea, then I'll post the info. here.

In any case, as I & the others noted to "the other Tom from HB" above, he needs to verify with the window sticker, dealer invoice &/or COA what wheels were originally on his 75 1.8 & restore those, or resource the OE ones noted if that is not the ones he has.

Similarly, as I'd said here before, my 73 2.0 that I bought used in Dec. 75 had Rivieras & a steel spare when I got it - instead of the Fuchs 2L alloys it came with from the factory, so I had to research & verify that, then resource a set of Fuchs 2Ls. Sometimes POs or dealers just changed wheels from the OE fitment! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Yeah Tom, I've posted this previously (long time ago) but when I took delivery of my 72 the 73 2.0's were were just dribbling in. The dealer offered to swap my steelies for "takeoffs" from the 2.0's at a price, as I recall, of 200 bucks. I was at my limit at $4295 & really didn't like them that much at the time. Good deal then, but my originality would have been ruined. Many of the Porsche/Audi dealers of the day were sleezebags. Wait a minute, has that changed?
Pat

[Tom_T]

Many of the Porsche/Audi dealers of the day were sleezebags. Wait a minute, has that changed?
Pat

Yeah Pat, now they're just "Porsche" dealers, having dropped the "...+Audi"! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I had a chance to peruse the window stickers 73-76 on Jeff's site the other nite, and they all listed the 5.5x15 steel wheels under the Appearance Group if optioned on that 1.7 or 1.8. So they weren't included under Appearance Group for 1.7/1.8 - and IIRC not for some MY late-73 & for 74-76 2.0s either.

I think it was the Performance/Sport Group of options which had the sway bars F&R and Alloy wheels in the USA (Euro/RoW also added the H4 headlights to the Sport Group) that I was remembering would've been including the alloys.

In any case, an owner will need the Munroney widow sticker (or dealer invoice if it lists the options & groups) or a COA to confirm what was on the 914 originally, then hope that the PCNA staff read & interpreted the option codes correctly on the COA! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

EDITED 3-24-12

[Pat Garvey]

Many of the Porsche/Audi dealers of the day were sleezebags. Wait a minute, has that changed?
Pat

Yeah Pat, now they're just "Porsche" dealers, having dropped the "...+Audi"! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I had a chance to peruse the window stickers 73-76 on Jeff's site the other nite, and they all listed the 5.5x15 steel wheels under the Appearance Group if optioned on that 1.7 or 1.8. So they weren't included under Appearance Group for 1.7/1.8 - and IIRC not for 2.0s either.

I think it was the Performance/Sport Group of options which had the sway bars F&R and Alloy wheels in the USA (Euro/RoW also added the H4 headlights to the Sport Group) that I was remembering would've been including the alloys.

In any case, an owner will need the Munroney widow sticker (or dealer invoice if it lists the options & groups) or a COA to confirm what was on the 914 originally, then hope that the PCNA staff read & interpreted the option codes correctly on the COA! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Otherwise you end up with Pat's 72 914/4 COA's infamous "Norwegian Options" - (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

They didn't use Monroney stickers in those days. In fact, the window sticker and dealer installed sticker was all hey had. They weren't regulated at all.

[Tom_T]

EDITED - DELETE

[1970 Neun vierzehn]

They didn't use Monroney stickers in those days. In fact, the window sticker and dealer installed sticker was all hey had. They weren't regulated at all.

I cannot speak for Pat's 1972 purchase specifically, but the Monroney Label , or sticker, became a requirement of manufacturers to afix to new cars in the late 1950s. By the time 1970 rolled around, the manufacturer's window sticker was at least a decade old practice. The first new car that I purchased in the latter part of 1970, a 1971 Toyota Corolla, had the Monroney Sticker on the window.

[Tom_T]

EDITED - DELETE

[StarBear]

Seeking some replacement tire advice - finally about to replace my 15-yr old Conti Contacts with some new rubber. They're not really worn as don't drive it too much any more (and never in rain or snow) but don't feel very safe driving on such old tires. Have '74 1.8L w/ Appearance Group and Fuchs alloys.
Looking at Conti ProContacts at 195SR65/15 and see very wide diversity of reviews. Only use it for occasional (<750 mi/yr), local driving - nothing hard or long, so looking for comfortable ride and good handling in dry weather and not too expensive. Not too worried about tire noise (who can hear the tires on these cars anyway?)
Would these be a good/fair choice? Other superior suggestions given the driving habits and not wanting to spend gobs of money?
Thanks!

[Pat Garvey]

They didn't use Monroney stickers in those days. In fact, the window sticker and dealer installed sticker was all hey had. They weren't regulated at all.

I cannot speak for Pat's 1972 purchase specifically, but the Monroney Label , or sticker, became a requirement of manufacturers to afix to new cars in the late 1950s. By the time 1970 rolled around, the manufacturer's window sticker was at least a decade old practice. The first new car that I purchased in the latter part of 1970, a 1971 Toyota Corolla, had the Monroney Sticker on the window.

I think Paul is correct. However, at the time I bought my 72, I lived in Kentucky. That state had a sales tax based on the window sticker, regardless of what you paid for the vehicle (same today? Don't know). So my window sticker was forciblt sent to the state of KY, where it probably resides today, to determine the sales tax on the 914. Never saw it after the day I bought the car! Mayube Ky changed subsequently because I have the window sticker from the '88 Audi 90 that I bought. Both cars purchased in Cincinnati, mind you. That's the way KY worked - maximize revenue. But this only applied to new vehicles.

In 1974 I bought a '70 911E Sporto from a fellow in Tennesse. The hydro struts were collapsed, so he reported the sales value to KY as $1500. That's what I paid sales tax on. Speed forward.....to 1992. Bought my 73 911T from a friend in Ohio. Though it had no problems, we agreed that the RSR F&R bumpers detracted from it's taxable value. As in the first case, The market value was reduced. I paid taxes based on a $4600 value assigned by the original owner. In both cases I paid way more than the stated value by the seller. My feeling in all cases is that Kentucky sales tax should be based on the sales value - period. I was robbed on the 914, but made out on the 911's. Every other car that I bought new I was ripped off on. Every other used car (924) I made out on. Maybe it just works out over the long run!
Pat

[RFoulds]

Seeking some replacement tire advice - finally about to replace my 15-yr old Conti Contacts with some new rubber. They're not really worn as don't drive it too much any more (and never in rain or snow) but don't feel very safe driving on such old tires. Have '74 1.8L w/ Appearance Group and Fuchs alloys.
Looking at Conti ProContacts at 195SR65/15 and see very wide diversity of reviews. Only use it for occasional (<750 mi/yr), local driving - nothing hard or long, so looking for comfortable ride and good handling in dry weather and not too expensive. Not too worried about tire noise (who can hear the tires on these cars anyway?)
Would these be a good/fair choice? Other superior suggestions given the driving habits and not wanting to spend gobs of money?
Thanks!

Top 3 tires I would look at are:
Kumho KR2, $72 each. Great tire for the price. very grippy
Bridgestone Pole Position, RE960AS, $85, sticky, good treadwear rating
DunlopSP60, $72, old school look good treadwear.

also, just saw Sumitomo HTR200 on sale at Tirerack for $68. great deal!

[Tom_T]

Seeking some replacement tire advice - finally about to replace my 15-yr old Conti Contacts with some new rubber. They're not really worn as don't drive it too much any more (and never in rain or snow) but don't feel very safe driving on such old tires. Have '74 1.8L w/ Appearance Group and Fuchs alloys.
Looking at Conti ProContacts at 195SR65/15 and see very wide diversity of reviews. Only use it for occasional (<750 mi/yr), local driving - nothing hard or long, so looking for comfortable ride and good handling in dry weather and not too expensive. Not too worried about tire noise (who can hear the tires on these cars anyway?)
Would these be a good/fair choice? Other superior suggestions given the driving habits and not wanting to spend gobs of money?
Thanks!

Top 3 tires I would look at are:
Kumho KR2, $72 each. Great tire for the price. very grippy
Bridgestone Pole Position, RE960AS, $85, sticky, good treadwear rating
DunlopSP60, $72, old school look good treadwear.

also, just saw Sumitomo HTR200 on sale at Tirerack for $68. great deal!

If you're looking for the vintage look & size, Lucas, Coker, etc. still sell the Michelin XZX 165SR15 which are a good balance of handling & mileage, also Kumho & Bridgestone/Firestone sell a 165SR15 are similar & less pricey.

[RichardFDR]

So, I have eight wheels for a 914. One set of four lug Fuchs with black paint on them and one shiny set of other ones that are gas burners I think, also with black paint. Am I correct in thinking neither is factory spec? Of the two sets I prefer the Fuchs. How best can I restore them to new, or should I ask that question in another thread?
Many thanks
Richard