Fatmat or Dynamat, How much do I need to buy? Options

[r_towle]

oh btw my neighbor works at the factory where they make this so i get it cheap. if it works im thinking about making pre cut pieces...

Is it asphault based? If it is roofing material, then it probably is.

If so, you might want to rethink it. All the better soundproofing is going away from asphault due to its failure rate. If your car sits in the summer sun, your solution may melt and come off the car.

Zach

I will try to be brief...but it gets harder as I get older.

Ice and Water shield (grace chemicals) is butyl based and its actually uncured rubber. This allows it to stretch around the nail heads and it sticks like glue and eventually is impossible to remove with a little bit of heat.

Sound deadening is done with two approaches.
One is to thicken the base metal and therefore elimintate vibration noise that is transfered via the panel. This is why trunk floors and floorboards are not just flat...they would vibrate to much. This is also why most door panels have some thickening done in the middle of the panel to negate the vibration.

The second thing to stop is sound waves. Sound waves travel at a certain frequency like waves. These waves have certain spacing between crests. Certain waves can be stopped by certain materials. Not all waves will be stopped by one material...
So, use rubber to not only thicken the base material, but this will also stop a certain number of waves...so it halts a certain sound spectrum.
Now, use aluminum glued to the top of the rubber.
This stops certain waves that the rubber wont stop.

Its not perfect, but by using both rubber and aluminum foil you will stop more sound waves.

I have used Ice and Water shield and it really does work fine, but I am not an audiofile guy looking for a setup for audio system that is smoking hot.

Use Ice and Water shield for simple sound deadening, it works great.
It has no aluminum layer, so it will not block the additional sound waves that aluminum does block.

There is alot more to look at, but you can cover both sides of the firewall with ice and water shield and it will be very very quiet.

Rich

[PRS914-6]

...but it gets harder as I get older.

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[r_towle]

...but it gets harder as I get older.

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Tis what your wife said last time she dropped by.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[VaccaRabite]

Thanks for the down-low on that Ice and Water seal.

Zach

[Mark Henry]

On the asphalt melting issue...car companys have been using it for years and still are.
I'm going to look at the ice and water stuff when I do the bug floor.

[VaccaRabite]

On the asphalt melting issue...car companys have been using it for years and still are.
I'm going to look at the ice and water stuff when I do the bug floor.

You live in Canada. It does not get warm enough there to melt water, let alone asphalt. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Zach

[r_towle]

Mark...

Two types of rubber (you may not be able to get Grace Chemical stuff)
Its easy to spot.

Cured rubber is what an inner tube is...its dry.
Uncured rubber is soft and can be rolled into a ball, made into any shape you want...then once cured...hold that shape.

The Ice and Water shield is just uncured rubber...with a significant glue on one side that makes it stick to air, you, your hair (that one sucks) or pretty much anything...its really sticky.

Touch one sticky face to the other stick face and you will learn what the work sticky really means....it fuses together instantly.

One way to get it to work is freeze it...(leave it outside)
Put it on a frozen surface (cold car, no heat in shop that day)
You will buy a little bit of time to move it around.
Then use a heat gun and it will fuse with the panel forever...

I have a porch roof I built that I used the stuff on.
I changed a portion of that roof and no matter what I used I could not get the stuff to seperate from the wood substrate...its amazing stuff.

Same treatment goes for Dynamat...but I suspect the glue is more forgiving with Dynamat given its intended application.

Rich

[retrofit]

Mark...

Two types of rubber (you may not be able to get Grace Chemical stuff)
Its easy to spot.

Cured rubber is what an inner tube is...its dry.
Uncured rubber is soft and can be rolled into a ball, made into any shape you want...then once cured...hold that shape.

The Ice and Water shield is just uncured rubber...with a significant glue on one side that makes it stick to air, you, your hair (that one sucks) or pretty much anything...its really sticky.

Touch one sticky face to the other stick face and you will learn what the work sticky really means....it fuses together instantly.

One way to get it to work is freeze it...(leave it outside)
Put it on a frozen surface (cold car, no heat in shop that day)
You will buy a little bit of time to move it around.
Then use a heat gun and it will fuse with the panel forever...

I have a porch roof I built that I used the stuff on.
I changed a portion of that roof and no matter what I used I could not get the stuff to seperate from the wood substrate...its amazing stuff.

Same treatment goes for Dynamat...but I suspect the glue is more forgiving with Dynamat given its intended application.

Rich

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif) I went into Home Depot today just to see if they carried a similar product. Surprise, surprise, they carry Quick Roof. Packaged in a roll that is 6" x 25' or 12 1/2 sq ft per roll, out the door for $15.00 at $1.20 per sq ft. Cheap! And, it does have the aluminum top sheet so you are getting a multidimensional product. I'm going to install it in my '74 2.0 and the '95 Chev dually.
Allen

[Dominic]

Zach,
Here is a picture of the firewall (engine side) that I did in Dynamat super, I had good results with it. Of course it does not look original any longer.
Dominic

[stateofidleness]

well i tried looking for you, but the search function has always returned 8973 pages of results for me so...

there's a member with a beautiful orange 914 (flared) that has pictures with dynamat installed.

the title of the thread was something about (how low can you go).. don't remember exactly, but it was showing it rolling out of the shop in the sun!

im sure somewhere here knows and can post the pic or link!

[Dr Evil]

I am finally getting the hang of the search function. The link was the second one on the page if you entered the phrase in parenthesis (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...how+low+can+you

[stateofidleness]

you > me

thank you sir!

[Wilhelm]

I'm going to do some type of sound deadener as well. I just don't want to get back into the rusty postion I was before with water trapped below the tar paper or whatever was in place before. So I see as my options as epoxy priming and using some catylzed paint to really seal the floor before I put anything over it or... I really think I'm going to do spray-in bedliner to the floor which I think will both deaden sound and create a nice fish pond for me.

[Dr Evil]

I coated my whole cabin with POR-15 before I put the sound deadener pain (water based) on the floor and fire wall. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[carr914]

Zach, Did you get your Raamat? I ordered some after reading this thread Aug 22nd and still haven't gotten anything.

T.C.

[VaccaRabite]

I got it, but it took about 10 days to get to me.

I'm about 3/4 done installing it - assuming I don't break down and do the doors. It is really sticky stuff.

Zach

[charliew]

In the 60's I redid a 39 chev and made a floor covering from asphalt 30lb. roofing and tin foil in layers, glueing it with black mastic, it really made it sound a lot quieter. It was the best I could come up with at the time. In texas it wasn't any cooler then than now.
I wonder why you would add a roll cage and also put in sound proofing which must add a lot of weight?
How much did the raamat kit weigh?

[VaccaRabite]

I don't have a roll bar. ???

Anyway, the shipping weight was 36 pounds, maybe 40. I have no intentions of putting all of it on. Just the floor and firewall. It will be about 1/2 the roll, so between 18 and 20 pounds. Slightly more if I end up doing the doors (and I currently am not, but may in the future.)

Zach

[charliew]

The guy with pictures of the vw had the roll cage.
I just called a friend who does early corvettes and he uses 72 sq. ft. and says it cost 440.00 for dynamat. He said from Eastwood where he gets free shipping for a yearly fee.
It looks like the raammat and the ensolite with two cans of adhesive is about 170.00, Thats 1 roll of raammat 62.5 sq. ft., 3 yds ensolite 36.00 and two cans adhesive 16.00 not counting freight.
Thanks for the link

[VaccaRabite]

^^^^
unless you are sealing the doors, you don't need the ensolite or the adhesive spray. Raammat is seriously sticky stuff. Wear disposable gloves, and put on a fresh pair often.

I would suggest a roller, though. I am going to get one to go over my work. Its hard to get the mat to stick in all the nooks and crannies w/o one - even though Raammat says that you don't need one.

Zach