Thoughts on ageing, When is it time ti call it quits? Options

[rjames]

The moral of the story is that when you have a long history with a car it becomes a very personal thing and it should NEVER be sold as it is part of your life.

Ah hell. Sounds like it owns you, which I totally understand. I have three hobbies that own me much of the time. I am fairly young (at least in my head) at 40, and still have a passion for all of them, so that's ok. But the moment I don't have that passion, or the moment that I feel they are keeping me from really enjoying my life, I really hope I'll have the strength to let go of them. If I can do it I think it will be very freeing, actually.

Pat, I don't know you, but I've seen another fairly recent post from you pretty much asking the same question you're asking now. Sounds to me like your asking a question that you already know the answer to, but can't bring yourself to admit it, so you're hoping one of us will talk you into it. Listen to your inner voice, and do what your afraid to do. Inner voices usually know what's best for us.

Besides, if you regret your decision, there's plenty of 914s out there you could buy if you really wanted another one.

Either way, I hope you stay a regular here.

Best of luck with your decision. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Porsche Rescue]

I too am of the age.....born 1941. I too have recently acquired floaters (likely not as bad as yours yet, but my doc. says "part of aging and everyone who lives long enough will enjoy them"). I too have lost a good deal of my interest in my Porsche habit which began in 1968. I sold all my old Porsches a year ago and was going to live with two cars like a normal person. That lasted 4 months. Then a one-owner 914 appeared on Craigs list. It needs some TLC which I am appoaching at a far slower pace than in the past. But it is in the garage and I play and drive when the mood strikes (kind of like sex at my age). Excuse my amateur attempt at psychology Pat, but it sounds to me like you are wrestling with the issues of age rather than your cars. Relax, let it come naturally. I doubt you need the cash from your cars all that much. Enjoy them as you feel like it. And remember, as I try to, enjoy each day to the fullest.

[carr914]

Hi Pat, I've owned a lot of cars and have never regretted selling any of them, but I never have owned a car over 14 years, most a year or two. I now have a Factory 914-6 that I never intend to get rid of.

I have regretted seeing my friends let cars go. I about cried when Steve (smg914) let his 914-6 that he & Janie had owned for 34 years, go. He was buying his M-471GT and his long-time 6 went to a friend, but the history Steve & Janie had in that car is not replaceable.

I like the idea of loaning your car to a Museum - it would be safe and still be yours.

T.C.

[JeffBowlsby]

I have always thought it was a best to have several interests...thats what I do to avoid becoming too wrapped-up with only one interest, and I bounce back and forthe between them as needed. You will never be able to replace the cars or their memories, so avoid doing anything drastic unless you have considered it for a long time...maybe a year. I liek the loan-out to a museum or car dealership idea... let others enjoy the car and see if you can live with out it under your nose.

Other than that, go chase those other things you always wanted to do...live life as if this was your last day on earth...have no regrets. Come back to us if you feel the need...most of us will be here awhile.

[MrKona]

Pat,

It sounds like your limiting yourself to options at extreme opposite ends of the spectrum; either spend a lot of time and money on the car, or get rid of it entirely.

How about something in the middle? I too like the idea of loaning your original car to a museum. Keep it in your name, find a new way to enjoy it, show it off... Loan it out to a local Porsche dealership as we've seen in another recent thread.

And while you're enjoying it in a different way, and not feeling anchored to it, go enjoy your other hobbies... work on that train layout.

I really enjoy working on my 914 and feel an extreme sense of accomplishment the more I learn about this car. However, my dreams with this car are finite... I have no plans on ever being a multiple 914 owner. There are too many other things I want to do. I'm already eying plans for a 12' wooden canoe that will sit in the garage next to the 914 one day. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I hope whatever decision you make is the right one for you.

- Bryan

[gms]

Pat,
I am sorry to hear that you are feeling this way however if the spark is gone you have to do what feels right. I feel there are a lot of great suggestions here and this might be redundant. I would suggest a temporary separation to start with so you can resume your hobby if the “feeling” returns. I personally have taken small sabbaticals from my 914s and have returned with the same passion that I had felt before. I can understand how you feel about not being able to work on the car and I can only imagine your frustration. I know one day each of us will reach a point when physical limitations will end our tinkering and we will each handle it differently. I have always had a project or three on the back burner so when I am tired of one car I move to another, maybe you have the 37 year itch? If you do leave we will miss your diehard CW attitude and comments!
Sincerely,

[PanelBilly]

I think you should find someone who impresses you as worthy of working on the car for you. I'm not suggesting you send it to a shop, but find a kid who has some skills that need to be honed and "let" him work on the car. Stand over him and insist that everything be performed to your standard. If he can't handle the work get rid of him and find another. I'd think there's lots of kids to choose from and I would look at the highschool autoshop class for starters.

I wouldn't pay them a cent. I think you can find a kid who will want to learn because they have the passion for cars and the work. It might take a bit of patience on your part and the understanding that he will make mistakes. Your going to pass something on maybe more important than the car itself. Your going to preserve a part of your passion for perfection, by giving it to someone else. Maybe the kid would pick it up without you, but we learn by copying our elders.

[1970 Neun vierzehn]

OK, here it is, the TOUGH LOVE response.

Pat: "I want the truth!"

1970 Neun vierzehn: "You can't handle the truth". (Or can you?)

Pat, your problem is precipitated by several factors, which individually have not caused your malaise with regards to your 914 and 911, but collectively have undermined your automotive (Porsche) enthusiasm.

Let me ask, for the sake of our fellow Forum friends, some questions that even though I know full well the answers, your candid responses to will reveal reasons for your manifest disinterest and lethargic attitude toward your enthusiast cars.

1. Once upon a time, you and I would have lengthy discussions about the latest issues of R&T, Automobile, C&D, Autoweek, and PCA Panorama. What do you subscibe to now? Do you even read "Pano" anymore?

2. Since you moved to Philadelphia, what 12-13 years ago, how many miles have you put on your 914? Ten, twenty?

3. Since you moved to Philadelphia, how many PCA events, 914 World get-togethers, or special interest/collector/sports car events (Hershey, Carlisle, etc.) have you attended?

4.What (this is one of my favorite questions) are your daily drivers? Once upon a time your D/Ds were a Rabbit, a GTi, various Audis, a Scirocco, Passats. And now you drive what?

5. You claim that your body is getting too old for repair and maintenance on your Porsches. That "you need to do it yourself". Pat, think Tom Oerther, Bud West, Jerry Wolf, Howard Rapp, Dick Weiss, John Meyer, Tom Stegman. All these guys (and myself) are (or were) at least as old as you and their enthusiasm for their respective Porsches did not wane as they either got older or no longer "wrenched" on their own cars. I might also add that all the above mentioned Porsche enthusiasts drove their cars AND did not have BORING cars as daily drivers.

6.We all know (or at least a lot of us do) that you harbor a disregard for the real or imagined arrogance that PORSCHE AG has displayed in going so far upmarket with their cars. It also annoys me somewhat to see the marque that was once the provenance of hard core driving enthusiasts, road racing adherents, discreet professionals, and connoisseurs of excellent craftsmanship and (though sometimes quirky and offbeat) engineering, be hijacked by so many elite, crass and unappreciative individuals whose only interest in their PORSCHE is as a
bauble with which to flaunt their wealth and material success. You've said that you have no interest in new, and late model PORSCHES. Does it follow then that you must not, therefore, admire the marque (Cayman aside), squelch your enthusiasm, and by association, diminish your own regard for your own PORSCHES?

If you take yourself out of the loop of reinforcement with regards to a hobby, be it a car, a motorcycle, a model railroad, a bicycling passion, a guitar pursuit, a record collection, etc. and don't immerse yourself with passion and seek affirmation and support from those with whom you share your enthusiasm, your affinity and affection for that endeavor will no doubt wither. (I can't avoid the cliche here...............) Use it, or lose it!

Your dear and sincere friend,
Paul

[Pat Garvey]

OK, here it is, the TOUGH LOVE response.

Pat: "I want the truth!"

1970 Neun vierzehn: "You can't handle the truth". (Or can you?)

Pat, your problem is precipitated by several factors, which individually have not caused your malaise with regards to your 914 and 911, but collectively have undermined your automotive (Porsche) enthusiasm.

Let me ask, for the sake of our fellow Forum friends, some questions that even though I know full well the answers, your candid responses to will reveal reasons for your manifest disinterest and lethargic attitude toward your enthusiast cars.

1. Once upon a time, you and I would have lengthy discussions about the latest issues of R&T, Automobile, C&D, Autoweek, and PCA Panorama. What do you subscibe to now? Do you even read "Pano" anymore?

2. Since you moved to Philadelphia, what 12-13 years ago, how many miles have you put on your 914? Ten, twenty?

3. Since you moved to Philadelphia, how many PCA events, 914 World get-togethers, or special interest/collector/sports car events (Hershey, Carlisle, etc.) have you attended?

4.What (this is one of my favorite questions) are your daily drivers? Once upon a time your D/Ds were a Rabbit, a GTi, various Audis, a Scirocco, Passats. And now you drive what?

5. You claim that your body is getting too old for repair and maintenance on your Porsches. That "you need to do it yourself". Pat, think Tom Oerther, Bud West, Jerry Wolf, Howard Rapp, Dick Weiss, John Meyer, Tom Stegman. All these guys (and myself) are (or were) at least as old as you and their enthusiasm for their respective Porsches did not wane as they either got older or no longer "wrenched" on their own cars. I might also add that all the above mentioned Porsche enthusiasts drove their cars AND did not have BORING cars as daily drivers.

6.We all know (or at least a lot of us do) that you harbor a disregard for the real or imagined arrogance that PORSCHE AG has displayed in going so far upmarket with their cars. It also annoys me somewhat to see the marque that was once the provenance of hard core driving enthusiasts, road racing adherents, discreet professionals, and connoisseurs of excellent craftsmanship and (though sometimes quirky and offbeat) engineering, be hijacked by so many elite, crass and unappreciative individuals whose only interest in their PORSCHE is as a
bauble with which to flaunt their wealth and material success. You've said that you have no interest in new, and late model PORSCHES. Does it follow then that you must not, therefore, admire the marque (Cayman aside), squelch your enthusiasm, and by association, diminish your own regard for your own PORSCHES?

If you take yourself out of the loop of reinforcement with regards to a hobby, be it a car, a motorcycle, a model railroad, a bicycling passion, a guitar pursuit, a record collection, etc. and don't immerse yourself with passion and seek affirmation and support from those with whom you share your enthusiasm, your affinity and affection for that endeavor will no doubt wither. (I can't avoid the cliche here...............) Use it, or lose it!

Your dear and sincere friend,
Paul

OK, Mister "Tough Love", here we go (you asked, remember):
Responses. May be lengthy.

1. I DO read Pano religiously evry month, several time. Haven't come up with anything noteworthy in several years. Why? Because the majority focus is on DE, racing, and contemorary Porsches that no shadetree mechanic can work on. The ultimate "duh" came from a recent Parade concours redo, where the owner of a Boxster S didn't even know how to get at the engine to try to clean it - he won his class for crap sakes!! Gives me a whole new feeling of faith in Parade concours judges!

I also enjoy Hemmings Sports & Exotics every month. Read it even more times than Pano (Lamo). I quit reading Autoweek 20 years ago, because they sold out. Same goes for R&T and CD - loser pubs. Never got into Automobile.

2. Since I'v moved to Philly I've put 24 miles on my 914, and about 4k miles on the 911.

3. None. Hershey is always cold & wet and I don't need to buy or sell anything. Carlisle - same.

4. My personal D/D driver is a 2003 Mercury Sable. The other D/D is a 2008 Mercury Milan Premier. Both cars have been faultless. I mean that. My extended warranty on the Sable is about to expire, with never a claim. The Milan is almost fun to drive in a spirited manner. Both are competent, and suit our needs.

After being burned to the tune of 15k in repairs, we abandoned VW, and hey will never see our asses in one of thier showrooms again. Fun to drive, when they run. Way overpriced.

Look, I drive 3 miles to work. Other than a VW product, anything should work. Janice drives 5 miles to work - see last sentence end.

And, who are you to talk? You drive a Honda mini-truck, and a VW GTI that you've had for years, with 12k miles on it!

I fail to see the point here!

5. Bud West, my hero who died too early, was a wrench lawyer, as well as a down-to-earth guy. Dick Weiss is a hero to many, many people. Has the hands of an artist, and the skills of a master. Tom Oerther is close behind Dick, but farms out most of his heavy wotk these days. Both of the last 2 are well beyond retirement age. Dick is special & I don't even attempt to understand his motivation. Tom Stegman is a revered collector, though I doubt he's turned awrench in 30 years - nice to be rich, though I love the guy.

6. No! In no way at all. Look, I don't like the FACT that Porsche has sold out to the masses, like BMW did in the 80's to the gold chain crowd. What I dislike most about Porsche is that they make cares designed for housewives (Cayenne) and do-do's who don't even know how to access the engine, much less check the oil. I don't like $300 oil changes. I don't like pimple-faced bozos in the parts department who don't know a pushrod from a dildo! I particularly dislike "new" Porsche people. You know, those who have "discovered" Porsche, but can't pronounce it. These are the same people who've never owned a car in thier live (most, not all), and don't "own" a Porsche now - the leasing company does. Posers!

I love my Porsches! I have many scars, skinned knuckles and tetanus shots to prove it. I'm just a little burned out right now.

Now, after this little diatribe - what was your point, Paulie!

[TJB/914]

OK, here it is, the TOUGH LOVE response.

Pat: "I want the truth!"

1970 Neun vierzehn: "You can't handle the truth". (Or can you?)

Pat, your problem is precipitated by several factors, which individually have not caused your malaise with regards to your 914 and 911, but collectively have undermined your automotive (Porsche) enthusiasm.

Let me ask, for the sake of our fellow Forum friends, some questions that even though I know full well the answers, your candid responses to will reveal reasons for your manifest disinterest and lethargic attitude toward your enthusiast cars.

1. Once upon a time, you and I would have lengthy discussions about the latest issues of R&T, Automobile, C&D, Autoweek, and PCA Panorama. What do you subscibe to now? Do you even read "Pano" anymore?

2. Since you moved to Philadelphia, what 12-13 years ago, how many miles have you put on your 914? Ten, twenty?

3. Since you moved to Philadelphia, how many PCA events, 914 World get-togethers, or special interest/collector/sports car events (Hershey, Carlisle, etc.) have you attended?

4.What (this is one of my favorite questions) are your daily drivers? Once upon a time your D/Ds were a Rabbit, a GTi, various Audis, a Scirocco, Passats. And now you drive what?

5. You claim that your body is getting too old for repair and maintenance on your Porsches. That "you need to do it yourself". Pat, think Tom Oerther, Bud West, Jerry Wolf, Howard Rapp, Dick Weiss, John Meyer, Tom Stegman. All these guys (and myself) are (or were) at least as old as you and their enthusiasm for their respective Porsches did not wane as they either got older or no longer "wrenched" on their own cars. I might also add that all the above mentioned Porsche enthusiasts drove their cars AND did not have BORING cars as daily drivers.

6.We all know (or at least a lot of us do) that you harbor a disregard for the real or imagined arrogance that PORSCHE AG has displayed in going so far upmarket with their cars. It also annoys me somewhat to see the marque that was once the provenance of hard core driving enthusiasts, road racing adherents, discreet professionals, and connoisseurs of excellent craftsmanship and (though sometimes quirky and offbeat) engineering, be hijacked by so many elite, crass and unappreciative individuals whose only interest in their PORSCHE is as a
bauble with which to flaunt their wealth and material success. You've said that you have no interest in new, and late model PORSCHES. Does it follow then that you must not, therefore, admire the marque (Cayman aside), squelch your enthusiasm, and by association, diminish your own regard for your own PORSCHES?

If you take yourself out of the loop of reinforcement with regards to a hobby, be it a car, a motorcycle, a model railroad, a bicycling passion, a guitar pursuit, a record collection, etc. and don't immerse yourself with passion and seek affirmation and support from those with whom you share your enthusiasm, your affinity and affection for that endeavor will no doubt wither. (I can't avoid the cliche here...............) Use it, or lose it!

Your dear and sincere friend,
Paul

OK, Mister "Tough Love", here we go (you asked, remember):
Responses. May be lengthy.

1. I DO read Pano religiously evry month, several time. Haven't come up with anything noteworthy in several years. Why? Because the majority focus is on DE, racing, and contemorary Porsches that no shadetree mechanic can work on. The ultimate "duh" came from a recent Parade concours redo, where the owner of a Boxster S didn't even know how to get at the engine to try to clean it - he won his class for crap sakes!! Gives me a whole new feeling of faith in Parade concours judges!

I also enjoy Hemmings Sports & Exotics every month. Read it even more times than Pano (Lamo). I quit reading Autoweek 20 years ago, because they sold out. Same goes for R&T and CD - loser pubs. Never got into Automobile.

2. Since I'v moved to Philly I've put 24 miles on my 914, and about 4k miles on the 911.

3. None. Hershey is always cold & wet and I don't need to buy or sell anything. Carlisle - same.

4. My personal D/D driver is a 2003 Mercury Sable. The other D/D is a 2008 Mercury Milan Premier. Both cars have been faultless. I mean that. My extended warranty on the Sable is about to expire, with never a claim. The Milan is almost fun to drive in a spirited manner. Both are competent, and suit our needs.

After being burned to the tune of 15k in repairs, we abandoned VW, and hey will never see our asses in one of thier showrooms again. Fun to drive, when they run. Way overpriced.

Look, I drive 3 miles to work. Other than a VW product, anything should work. Janice drives 5 miles to work - see last sentence end.

And, who are you to talk? You drive a Honda mini-truck, and a VW GTI that you've had for years, with 12k miles on it!

I fail to see the point here!

5. Bud West, my hero who died too early, was a wrench lawyer, as well as a down-to-earth guy. Dick Weiss is a hero to many, many people. Has the hands of an artist, and the skills of a master. Tom Oerther is close behind Dick, but farms out most of his heavy wotk these days. Both of the last 2 are well beyond retirement age. Dick is special & I don't even attempt to understand his motivation. Tom Stegman is a revered collector, though I doubt he's turned awrench in 30 years - nice to be rich, though I love the guy.

6. No! In no way at all. Look, I don't like the FACT that Porsche has sold out to the masses, like BMW did in the 80's to the gold chain crowd. What I dislike most about Porsche is that they make cares designed for housewives (Cayenne) and do-do's who don't even know how to access the engine, much less check the oil. I don't like $300 oil changes. I don't like pimple-faced bozos in the parts department who don't know a pushrod from a dildo! I particularly dislike "new" Porsche people. You know, those who have "discovered" Porsche, but can't pronounce it. These are the same people who've never owned a car in thier live (most, not all), and don't "own" a Porsche now - the leasing company does. Posers!

I love my Porsches! I have many scars, skinned knuckles and tetanus shots to prove it. I'm just a little burned out right now.

Now, after this little diatribe - what was your point, Paulie!

Good going Paul, I believe there is still life in ole Pat. I was worried he sounded like he was going to die & all this attention sparked him back to life. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif)

Pat, Take if easy on yourself we want you on this forum..
Reminds me of something. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif)
Take a tape measure and count every inch as one year of your life. Assume you will live to 90?? Now put it up the side of the wall & say your 65 years old. You now have 15" to live. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) Enjoy every inch (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif)

Tom (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[TJB/914]

Sorry, Pat.

I just screwed you out of 10 inches of your life. Typo error.

T

[scotty b]

Lost the passion? Maybe it's time for a change.

[tod914]

If this don't restore you passion, nothing will. And it's a Yugo! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving-girl.gif)

[914runnow]

I keep buying new parts, but never get around to installing them. Hell, I don't even need them!


Should I get out? I'm inclined to do so. Can something re-awake the fire? I wonder.

I'm on the brink.
[/quote]
Guess I will play the 'Bad Guy'.........
Sounds as if it is time...to part ways with your toyz...we will out grow them or out age them....Physically OR mentally......at some point in time......
Sell your 914 to someone in Europe..so your attachment is across the pond....
(seems it ways heavy on your mind).....
Next use the sale monies for a vacay -hot tub- deck- cruise- in home theatre ..
You get the picture...Something you will use or enjoy....NOW !!
Plus gain some more parking space AND mind space by these vehicles being vacated from your day to day/ hour to hour.......
No Wouldah> Shouldah> Couldah....Just go forward and enjoy life.....

[1970 Neun vierzehn]

Lost the passion?

You'd lose your enthusiasm too, Scotty, if all you drove to work, ran errands with, and went on vacation in was this....................

[scotty b]

I can't imagine what it must be like to drive such a boring car every day (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) At least my slug is a stick (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

[Pat Garvey]

[quote name='1970 Neun vierzehn' date='Mar 29 2009, 12:58 PM' post='1151442']
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(scotty b @ Mar 29 2009, 07:42 AM) </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Lost the passion?
[/quote]

You'd lose your enthusiasm too, Scotty, if all you drove to work, ran errands with, and went on vacation in was this....................
[/quote]
Wrong color dickweed!

Oh, and no pic of your Honda Xb? Now that's exciting!

[Pat Garvey]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(scotty b @ Mar 29 2009, 01:45 PM) </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
I can't imagine what it must be like to drive such a boring car every day (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) At least my slug is a stick (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)
[/quote]
Yes it is!

And my slug can whip your slugs ass!

[Pat Garvey]

[quote name='914runnow' date='Mar 29 2009, 12:36 PM' post='1151433']
I keep buying new parts, but never get around to installing them. Hell, I don't even need them!


Should I get out? I'm inclined to do so. Can something re-awake the fire? I wonder.

I'm on the brink.
[/quote]
Guess I will play the 'Bad Guy'.........
Sounds as if it is time...to part ways with your toyz...we will out grow them or out age them....Physically OR mentally......at some point in time......
Sell your 914 to someone in Europe..so your attachment is across the pond....
(seems it ways heavy on your mind).....
Next use the sale monies for a vacay -hot tub- deck- cruise- in home theatre ..
You get the picture...Something you will use or enjoy....NOW !!
Plus gain some more parking space AND mind space by these vehicles being vacated from your day to day/ hour to hour.......
No Wouldah> Shouldah> Couldah....Just go forward and enjoy life.....
[/quote]

You aren't the bad guy, and I understand what you're saying. But I already have those things (vacy, hot tub, deck, etc.). Had them for years & even they have lost my interest. Parking space would be nice. I haven't had my car in the garage since 1979!

No, I think I'll give it one more year, though the 911 must go. I'll pretty up the 914 this year, drive it all summer, and see what happens in the fall. Your Euro sale thing is interesting!

Anyone need a nice 73T with shifting prob's. Oh man, I'll miss that car.
Pat

[auerbach]

Pat, change your focus and take a break.

I'm 57, overweight (ask Evil), out of shape, suffering with two corneal transplants (30 years ago and on their way out) and a cateract. I hate my clients and don't have enough time to do the things that I really want to do.

About a month ago, I decided to move my immediate obsession from my 914 to tracking my Targa. This will probably be one of the last seasons that I will be able to do it so now my "desire" has been rekindled. So much so that I went to Birmingham Ala last week to get on the track and "back in the mood" to race.

Please don't look at your car as an obligation. It's a work of art that will always be there for you. Once it's gone, it's gone and that hurt is something that can't be healed.

If you can think of your car as your wife, try a seperation agreement. Live seperate and apart for some time, and think about dating either her (the 914) or someone else. But remember to keep making the Alimony Payments, her lawyer can be a real bastard. :-)