possible oil starvation when driving., noticed this at Hershey.. Help! Options

[VaccaRabite]

So, they car has VERY few miles on it, under 5.

At starting on idle, pressure goes up to ~40.

Start driving, its fine for the fist little bit, then the pressure goes to 0 and the light comes on. If I rev with no load (out of gear, stopped), pressure comes back up.

As soon as the engine gets under load, pressure seems to take a dive.

I am not leaving any oil slicks, and there is oil in the engine (checked many many times.)

Oil smells a bit gassy, but thats probably due to the rings not being seated, as I have not been able to drive the car to seat them, and my carbs are still a little rich.

I am using the VDO dual sender on a steel flex hose to the oil pressure sender outlet.

I took the sender off and cranked the motor (no ignition) and got oil coming out of the hose. Not shooting out of the hose, but oil was moving through it.

I had put teflon tape on the end to prevent leaks, but that has been removed.

Oil pump is supposed to be a high volume pump.


Mike thinks it may just be low oil in the engine, and the dipstick is not original. We need the measurements of a stock /4 dipstick.

Mike is sooooo damn cool and I wish I was more like him. I have such a man crush (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

[VaccaRabite]

Oh ya, what is the measurement of the dipstick holder from the engine to the top of the holder??? Mine looks JB welded in and aftermarket.

[wilchek]

Tube is 161mm long. It should stick out of the case for 150 mm. Saw the car yesterday Zach it is looking good. Sorry we didn't stop but we had to get back to pick up the little one from the inlaws.

[Cap'n Krusty]

A fresh engine takes a little over 4 quarts. If you put 4 quarts in it, you have enough oil. If not, then you should have counted them. Oil level, unless it's REALLY low, shouldn't affect your oil pressure. Clearances are the most likely problem. Of course, your "high volume" oil pump may be at the root of your dilemma.

The Cap'n, "the stock oil pump guy".

[CliffBraun]

A fresh engine takes a little over 4 quarts. If you put 4 quarts in it, you have enough oil. If not, then you should have counted them. Oil level, unless it's REALLY low, shouldn't affect your oil pressure. Clearances are the most likely problem. Of course, your "high volume" oil pump may be at the root of your dilemma.

The Cap'n, "the stock oil pump guy".

I'm going with this, although my oil pump isn't stock. I had a stock 2.0 with a horrendous vacuum leak that I accidentally ran down to like a quart of oil right before we took it out (was still running as good as it ever did, problend FTW). I also don't trust those relocated pressure senders, mine was always acting up (not that they can't work, mine was just always wonky.)

[jsayre914]

so who didnt develop a car problem at hershey.??

guy next to me noticed his rear wheels were both rubbing.

i noticed my car dosnt want to start anymore

zach has a oil starvation problem

the white car (apon arrival) was grindin and smelling very clutchy

anyone eles??

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

and i thought it was just me

[Cap'n Krusty]

A fresh engine takes a little over 4 quarts. If you put 4 quarts in it, you have enough oil. If not, then you should have counted them. Oil level, unless it's REALLY low, shouldn't affect your oil pressure. Clearances are the most likely problem. Of course, your "high volume" oil pump may be at the root of your dilemma.

The Cap'n, "the stock oil pump guy".

I'm going with this, although my oil pump isn't stock. I had a stock 2.0 with a horrendous vacuum leak that I accidentally ran down to like a quart of oil right before we took it out (was still running as good as it ever did, problend FTW). I also don't trust those relocated pressure senders, mine was always acting up (not that they can't work, mine was just always wonky.)

Is the sender unit properly grounded? The Cap'n

[VaccaRabite]

So, fixed some problems, but not others.

The aftermarket dipstick and tube was NOWHERE near right. I drained the oil and put in 4.5 fresh quarts of Brad Penn 20w-50 (I have a tuna can).

When I poured the old oil out, it was only 2.5 quarts, so I was clearly low.

started the engine and idled it - no oil pressure. removed the VDO sender from the hose and could not get oil out of the hose with the engine idling.

Checked under the car to make sure there were not 4.5 quarts of fresh engine oil under there, and it was dry.

Then I got called in for baby duty. I was pretty frustrated anyhow.

The engine idles nicely. If the engine idles, then the pump is turning. If the pump is turning, I should have oil coming out the hose to the VDO sender. So, why don't I?

Zach

[VaccaRabite]

> - Schadek 30mm oil pump

This is the pump that is in my engine. Are they prone to failure?

Only way I am getting no pressure right now is to the the oil pump not turning, right?

Or I guess it could be backing out of its housing somehow, but that would be pretty darned unlikely w/o a big puddle of oil to accompany it.

Zach

[scotty b]

Debris somewhere in the passages

Pressure valve is stuck

you have a midgets finger jammed in the oil circuit somewhere


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[Cap'n Krusty]

"If the engine idles, then the pump is turning." Oh? Not if it's the wrong pump ........... Or if it's broken.

The Cap'n

[orange914]

Debris somewhere in the passages

Pressure valve is stuck

you have a midgets finger jammed in the oil circuit somewhere


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

the 30mm h.v. pump thing...

i used a new mellings 30mm in mine and was concerned about all the hot oil pressure issues i'd heard about and also the heat problem so many claimed where due to h.v. pumps. what your saying sounds like it could be a bounding releif valve or weak spring

in the past i've used an aftermarket oil bypass spring and valve on a 76' bus that helped hot oil pressure.

again when i built my 2056 i was concerned with the h.v. issues but mostly the heat because when the oil pressure bleeds off oil it also bypasses the oil cooler, thus temp's go up. i shimmed the primary bypass spring with .040 shims. we've put about 100 miles on and have great hot and cold oil pressure along with a very cool running engine, even on last summers 100*+ days. i really think it has to do with the relife valve being in sync with the h.v. pump issue (along with the 9550 cam). did you by chance put the thin oil pump gasket inbetween the outer cover and pump?

what pressure do you start off with and what pressure and at what tempature does it drop?

[Dr Evil]

Mike thinks it may just be low oil in the engine, and the dipstick is not original. We need the measurements of a stock /4 dipstick.

Mike is sooooo damn cool and I wish I was more like him. I have such a man crush (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) I knew it! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

[VaccaRabite]

the 30mm h.v. pump thing...

i used a new mellings 30mm in mine and was concerned about all the hot oil pressure issues i'd heard about and also the heat problem so many claimed where due to h.v. pumps. what your saying sounds like it could be a bounding releif valve or weak spring

again when i built my 2056 i was concerned with the h.v. issues but mostly the heat because when the oil pressure bleeds off oil it also bypasses the oil cooler, thus temp's go up. i shimmed the primary bypass spring with .040 shims. we've put about 100 miles on and have great hot and cold oil pressure along with a very cool running engine, even on last summers 100*+ days. i really think it has to do with the relife valve being in sync with the h.v. pump issue (along with the 9550 cam). did you by chance put the thin oil pump gasket inbetween the outer cover and pump?

what pressure do you start off with and what pressure and at what tempature does it drop?

Temps: not high enough to matter, I think. Head temps under 200. Literally, I have less then 5 miles on the motor. I have not put it under load enough to seat the rings yet. I drove the car maybe a mile in Hershey, when I noticed the problem.

After fiddling with it at home, I drove it about 300 yards when I went from 40 pounds to 0 pounds. That was due to not having enough oil in the engine, due to the after market dipstick being wrong on the oil fill line.

Looking at the diagram on Page 20 of the Haynes manual, I should have a dierct path from the pump to the pressure gauge sender. Course, that may be incorrect.

Zach

[type47]

so who didnt develop a car problem at hershey.??

anyone eles??

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

and i thought it was just me

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I thought I would be good and install an oil pressure gauge with the remote hose and dual sender. ... leaked like a seive! Leaked so bad that Root couldn't follow me because he got oil on his windshield! Had to swap back the original sender and didn't leak a drop on the way home. My oil pressure was way high I thought, around 55 psi cruising at about 70.

[r_towle]

"If the engine idles, then the pump is turning." Oh? Not if it's the wrong pump ........... Or if it's broken.

The Cap'n

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Ever see an engine blow at a vw show.
Some of them last a long time, with no oil.

Check the pump.

Rich

[Dr Evil]

What is the usual failure mode on the /4 oil pump? His pressure was up and then down and then up (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) I do think it is the pump, though.

[r_towle]

It was up, then down...now zero.
Tang can break off if it was crooked, wrong length, jammed.

You gotta measure all the clearances..
depth of pump, size of tang..length of tang.

I have seen pumps that dont reach far enough, and some that the body it to deep so when you tighten down the pump, it bind and breaks the tang.

Rich

[Dr Evil]

I bet a Melling will fix this.

[r_towle]

why not just use a stock pump?

Rich