Hey all,
I've been lurking for a couple weeks now reading all of these interesting topics and enjoying those threads where you folks are kind enough to share your builds. I am a car fan in general with a '66 mustang that I am just about ready to put on the road for the summer. Like any other project there is always more to do but I am ready to start looking for another project and I have a real fondness for the 914 and its unique looks. I like that it is both a coop and a convertible with the targa roof. I like the style and the unique look of the car. I love that you can't find one on every corner. It seems to be a very simple set up as far as working on it goes.
With that said I have some questions for anyone that would like to comment.
1. What kind of costs would a 914 project take? What I mean is that I am used to the costs associated with a classic Mustang. This a Porsche after all and I can just imagine parts and items being 3x as much as I might be used. The associated costs of parts might very well make this a no go.
2. I really like the idea that these 914s can handle pretty well and even do double duty as a driver and a weekend racer. Although I don't have plans for that sort of thing, I like the idea that if I chose a 914 could easily do this. From what I have seen on this site many folks put in a different motor. Why is that? Is there something wrong with the stock motors to where one can not get power out of it?
3. Availability of parts. Nothing sucks more than being close to finishing something up and not being able to get a part. Is that the case with 914s?
4. Are there any part supplier catalogs that I could order (free hopefully) to take a look and see what can and can't be gotten for these cars and the costs? This could be a big help with question 3.
5. What are the basic restore/mod projects (sway bars is one I read about) for a 914 to bring it up to modern day par? You know the 'if you have one you should do this this and that first thing.
The other project cars on my radar are: Miata (I know its not old), VW Super Beetle, Triumph TR-6, Datsun 510, Datsun 240z, and Alfa Spyder.
Anything else I should know or be aware of if I decide to jump in to another project with a 914? I appreciate your time and all comments and suggestions.
Thanks very much.
Full Version: Getting Started, is the 914 the right car?
QUOTE(rmousir @ Mar 9 2011, 02:18 PM) 
I like that it is both a coop and a convertible with the targa roof.
Welcome. I'm sure there are a number of 914s around which have chickens roosting in them. I'll leave it for others to answer your questions in a more serious manner.
Let me answer question #2.
As someone who converted to a sbc and has no intention to putting a porsche engine in their car the reason is simple. Cost. To rebuild the T4 engine correctly is ~ 5k, sure you can do a low dollar rebuild and get it on the road, but 5k gives you a good 125 or so Hp engine which feels pretty good in these cars. To rebuild a 6 is probably going to be closer to 8k, but im not really familiar with that number. To do a rebuild on a sbc is ~ 1.5k Then the conversion parts are ~ 3k and this leaves you with a very powerful and reliable engine that transforms the car into one heck of a vehicle.
Most people do engine conversions because the car is just such a cool car and they would like more power and modern reliability/gas mileage. The subaru engine is a popular conversion now because it is really a great engine and gives good power, reliablility without sacrificing mileage.
The stock motors can certainly push out plenty of power, north of 200hp is attainable on 4 cylinder but it takes quite a bit of money (north of 10k) unless you turbocharge it, and even then you have to prepare the engine for the turbo so ~2-3k in engine work and another 2k or so in turbo equipment and such..
5. The first things to do are to get it back to proper working order. This includes the chassis. These cars are known for rust and that needs to be priority #1. The brakes, engine, trani, electrical ect. are all things that should be either rebuilt or serviced before going through with any mods. On a stock vehicle the only real mods that it needs are suspension mods (sway bars, shocks, springs), and decent tires. Then putting an exhaust that gives the car the sound you want is always on the top priority list when I get a car. Finally maybe a smaller steering wheel, and either some good seats or some racing harnesses to keep you locked in are pretty much all the car needs to keep you smiling through the twisties. The brakes on the car are fine, they just need to be serviced properly (rebuilt) and bled properly. However good semi racing brake pads are certainly something that should not be overlooked and are always very important.
Good luck!
As someone who converted to a sbc and has no intention to putting a porsche engine in their car the reason is simple. Cost. To rebuild the T4 engine correctly is ~ 5k, sure you can do a low dollar rebuild and get it on the road, but 5k gives you a good 125 or so Hp engine which feels pretty good in these cars. To rebuild a 6 is probably going to be closer to 8k, but im not really familiar with that number. To do a rebuild on a sbc is ~ 1.5k Then the conversion parts are ~ 3k and this leaves you with a very powerful and reliable engine that transforms the car into one heck of a vehicle.
Most people do engine conversions because the car is just such a cool car and they would like more power and modern reliability/gas mileage. The subaru engine is a popular conversion now because it is really a great engine and gives good power, reliablility without sacrificing mileage.
The stock motors can certainly push out plenty of power, north of 200hp is attainable on 4 cylinder but it takes quite a bit of money (north of 10k) unless you turbocharge it, and even then you have to prepare the engine for the turbo so ~2-3k in engine work and another 2k or so in turbo equipment and such..
5. The first things to do are to get it back to proper working order. This includes the chassis. These cars are known for rust and that needs to be priority #1. The brakes, engine, trani, electrical ect. are all things that should be either rebuilt or serviced before going through with any mods. On a stock vehicle the only real mods that it needs are suspension mods (sway bars, shocks, springs), and decent tires. Then putting an exhaust that gives the car the sound you want is always on the top priority list when I get a car. Finally maybe a smaller steering wheel, and either some good seats or some racing harnesses to keep you locked in are pretty much all the car needs to keep you smiling through the twisties. The brakes on the car are fine, they just need to be serviced properly (rebuilt) and bled properly. However good semi racing brake pads are certainly something that should not be overlooked and are always very important.
Good luck!
QUOTE(rmousir @ Mar 9 2011, 01:18 PM)
Hey all,
I've been lurking for a couple weeks now reading all of these interesting topics and enjoying those threads where you folks are kind enough to share your builds. I am a car fan in general with a '66 mustang that I am just about ready to put on the road for the summer. Like any other project there is always more to do but I am ready to start looking for another project and I have a real fondness for the 914 and its unique looks. I like that it is both a coop and a convertible with the targa roof. I like the style and the unique look of the car. I love that you can't find one on every corner. It seems to be a very simple set up as far as working on it goes.
With that said I have some questions for anyone that would like to comment.
1. What kind of costs would a 914 project take? What I mean is that I am used to the costs associated with a classic Mustang. This a Porsche after all and I can just imagine parts and items being 3x as much as I might be used. The associated costs of parts might very well make this a no go.
The labor to restore a classic mustang or a 914 will be the same but plan on the 914 parts (due to the fact that they only made 116,000 as compared to over 2 million mustangs, to be four times as expensive. 914 restoration is no cheap venture but a very rewarding one as the 914 is a 500% better car than the mustang in every way
2. I really like the idea that these 914s can handle pretty well and even do double duty as a driver and a weekend racer. Although I don't have plans for that sort of thing, I like the idea that if I chose a 914 could easily do this. From what I have seen on this site many folks put in a different motor. Why is that? Is there something wrong with the stock motors to where one can not get power out of it?
The stock engine has very sufficient power especially the 2.0 however every guy wants more. There are so many engines that will fit that even though it involves a lot of labor and fabrication, the high horsepower engines are cheap. We would not recommend switching engines what so ever as it destroys the nature of the beast and the modified car will never give you a return on the time and money invested. NEVER
3. Availability of parts. Nothing sucks more than being close to finishing something up and not being able to get a part. Is that the case with 914s?
Parts are readily available and many of the members here are vendors as well. The joy of 914 restoration is accentuated by the ease instant availability of parts
4. Are there any part supplier catalogs that I could order (free hopefully) to take a look and see what can and can't be gotten for these cars and the costs? This could be a big help with question 3.
There is one and best 914 printed catalog out there and it is great.
5. What are the basic restore/mod projects (sway bars is one I read about) for a 914 to bring it up to modern day par? You know the 'if you have one you should do this this and that first thing.
The car in stock dress is great. Wider tires and or wheels along with new springs and bilstein gas shocks are really all you need. Sway bars are purely optional after you have had time to enjoy your 914 and get a good feel for it. CERTAINLY not necessary
The other project cars on my radar are: Miata (I know its not old), VW Super Beetle, Triumph TR-6, Datsun 510, Datsun 240z, and Alfa Spyder.
Nice cars but not one will hold a candle to a 914.
Anything else I should know or be aware of if I decide to jump in to another project with a 914? I appreciate your time and all comments and suggestions.
Watch the battery area. Even the most straight rust free 914 will be rusted in the battery area. Although the repair parts are readily available and in reproduction inexpensive, the repair is very time consuming and not for the amateur.
Buy the best 914 you can. There are still original examples with very very low miles out there for 25,000 that are a better buy than a 500 dollar rusted multiple painted worn out interior car missing parts. However the fun is in the restoration, and that is what keeps all of us 914 fanatics going, continuing to save another 914 and preserve the marque.
Thanks very much.
Engine rebuilds are expensive, but many parts are easy to come by. This is especially true to parts that are common to VW's - you'll find a lot of good deals by buying, for instance, Relays for a VW Bus - which happen to be exactly the same part, only cheaper. 
$7500 - Go buy a nice 914 that doesn't "need" anything, but could use tinkering (Becuase tinkering is fun) and drive it.
Depends on the person, I don't have the resources anymore to buy a $1500 914, put $6k into it along with the thousands of hours required for my dumb-ass to get it all back together.
Spend the money up front, buy one that's as done as possible and enjoy it.
Depends on the person, I don't have the resources anymore to buy a $1500 914, put $6k into it along with the thousands of hours required for my dumb-ass to get it all back together.
Spend the money up front, buy one that's as done as possible and enjoy it.
Some of the parts can be expensive, like new bumpers or bumper pads, some interior parts, and such. Mechanical parts aren't terribly expensive. You will like this car more than the alpha or Super beetle for sure. Others IDK. Look for rust as said before. #1 problem.
i agree with andrew about engine swaps. good power can be had from porsche 4 & 6 cylinder motors but, at considerable expense. as i've recently learned on this forum, corvair motors are a less expensive alternative that also don't require cooling system fabrication.
yup, parts will be more expensive than your mustangs but, still cheap compared to 911 parts or other european exotics that a good 914 could run circles around. if you haven't driven one yet, even an old worn out one, you're in for a surprise. "go kart like handling" is kind of cliche but, in this case, it's true!
i also agree with root werks in that you should buy the best car you can, with a keen eye towards staying away from rust!
one unmentioned thing to push you in the direction of getting a 914; participation in the BEST FORUM EVER!
yup, parts will be more expensive than your mustangs but, still cheap compared to 911 parts or other european exotics that a good 914 could run circles around. if you haven't driven one yet, even an old worn out one, you're in for a surprise. "go kart like handling" is kind of cliche but, in this case, it's true!
i also agree with root werks in that you should buy the best car you can, with a keen eye towards staying away from rust!
one unmentioned thing to push you in the direction of getting a 914; participation in the BEST FORUM EVER!
Get a 914
RMOUSIR-
Where are you located in Ohio? I'm in Plain City (outside of Columbus) if you want to get together.
Where are you located in Ohio? I'm in Plain City (outside of Columbus) if you want to get together.
funny how many mustang owners generate toward 914's, you'll find alot of us here. in stock form the 914 will eat up mustangs in handling... the same can not be said about stock power though
1 cost can be higher than what you may be used to with your mustang, but like what was said, spend the $ upfront and get a solid driver to start with.
2 the engine build can an expensive experiance. to do it right and end up with 125 hp, the average guy will spend $5k easy. but 125 hp to 2000 lbs puts it into a fun driver power to weight range. and if done right you can see 30 mpg. if you had to deal with a new engine i would seriously at least consider a modern engine swap.
3 parts avalibility is great, like others have said alot interchanges with vw. you'll most likely be able to find anything you need here on classified
4 check with auto atlanta on a parts supply. they will send a c/d catalog. like any other business some like and some dislike them.
1 cost can be higher than what you may be used to with your mustang, but like what was said, spend the $ upfront and get a solid driver to start with.
2 the engine build can an expensive experiance. to do it right and end up with 125 hp, the average guy will spend $5k easy. but 125 hp to 2000 lbs puts it into a fun driver power to weight range. and if done right you can see 30 mpg. if you had to deal with a new engine i would seriously at least consider a modern engine swap.
3 parts avalibility is great, like others have said alot interchanges with vw. you'll most likely be able to find anything you need here on classified
4 check with auto atlanta on a parts supply. they will send a c/d catalog. like any other business some like and some dislike them.
Spend allot of time reading through this forum. It's amazing how much good info is buried in here. If you read enough you'll answer all of your questions and know more about these little cars than you ever thought you would. Oh, and you'll end up with questions you haven't even thought of yet.
No offense George, but get one of your guys to show you how to use the qoute feature please.
<---I have to agree with everyone else...buy the best one you can afford, unless you want a big and expensive project. Take someone who knows these cars with you to look at it if possible.
Get a running car with a great body first - no rust... And you can do a lot to the rest of the car at almost any budget. Since the cars are 40 years old your driver can be rebuilt one piece at a time. Breaks. Clutch. Suspension. Etc.
The CURSE of 914's is being on Jack stand forever. Do a search for some of the total rebuild projects here to see what I mean.
The CURSE of 914's is being on Jack stand forever. Do a search for some of the total rebuild projects here to see what I mean.
I would lean towards a nice suby powered 914. Find a solid chassis as mentioned above. Then do a suby conversion. It can be done under 3k with you doing alot of the work. That is just the conversion & not including buying the right chassis. If you are patient even cheaper but you have to keep your eye's open & get the right parts once. Obviously you can go crazy with a suby build also. You can get up closer to 10k pretty easily. That is pying for alot of work & big hp turbo motor. I like keeping it simple & staying away froma turbo. You can build a ej25SOHC to push 2-250 on pump gas. You like tinkering so doing a motor swap shouldn't be to huge an undertaking. Best way is to find a suby that was wrecked but has everything you need. Look for a 2000 or newer suby with the ej25SOHC motor. Just my preferance though & I haven't even finished my first suby conversion 
. So I am far from an expert or even competant 
. I will be soon though 
. So I am far from an expert or even competant . I will be soon though
George's AA has a pretty good website for parts. He used to send a catalog out (some years he charged for it, some he didn't, as I recall). Pelican (see my sig for a link) has an excellent on-line catalog. GPR are good guys, but I don't know what kind of catalog (if any!) they have. (Been a while since I have checked out the competition.)
As far as I can tell, everybody here loves GPR. Many people really like Pelican Parts. Some love Auto Atlanta, some love to hate them.
--DD
As far as I can tell, everybody here loves GPR. Many people really like Pelican Parts. Some love Auto Atlanta, some love to hate them.
--DD
QUOTE(Lennies914 @ Mar 9 2011, 09:45 PM)
Spend allot of time reading through this forum. It's amazing how much good info is buried in here. If you read enough you'll answer all of your questions and know more about these little cars than you ever thought you would. Oh, and you'll end up with questions you haven't even thought of yet.
I spent about 3 hours last night surfing through this forum. Some very nice work is being done here.
QUOTE(tornik550 @ Mar 9 2011, 08:37 PM)
RMOUSIR- Where are you located in Ohio? I'm in Plain City (outside of Columbus) if you want to get together.
I am in Batavia which is basically the east side of Cincinnati. If I ever get a 914 or go look at one a meet up would be fine.
I have lots more reading to do. I appreciate the input it is great to see such good support. That was one reason why I bought my mustang. The support on the forum reassured me that I could take on the challenge of a mustang. A good forum is probably the #1 tool to have. It is good to see that this forum is already paying off.
I am going to continue reading and maybe even start keeping a eye out for 914 sale adds to see what I can find them gong for. My initial thought is a complete tear down and restore/mod build. When I got my current project car I didn't know anything and now that I have gotten through all of that I will do the next project better. A frame up build. That is where the idea of a 914 comes in.
On these Subaru motor swaps, do the motors bolt in? Or do we need to modify the frame/mounts? I will do some searches tonight on this forum to find some treads. I am sure that all the details will be there.
It looks like I am a bit ahead of you so I will share my experiences to date.
I have been reading here and on the club for about 5 months now and have actively been looking for about 4 months. My initial budget was $5k, but not finding what I was looking for at that price I upped my budget to $7k including shipping.
The enthusiasts here and on the club have some very nice cars - some in great shape to begin with and others that were project cars made right. As someone who understands the value of enthusiasm and dedication to a marquee, I want to buy a car from an enthusiast, but the problem for me is that you guys don’t sell that many completed cars that often!
Above somebody mentioned a $7500 car that doesn’t need anything. I have found this car to be as elusive as Bigfoot. I have read the stories and seen the pictures, but when you look at what is on the market right now today I find reality quite different.
Outside of the enthusiast website members and their cars, my experience so far has been that cars advertised in this price range that are “restored” and “needs nothing” are poorly repaired cars that need quite a bit and are really only $5k cars at best. These cars have honestly had $5k to $10k put into them and they still need work or rework!
I expect that any car will need attention and $$ spent and I am not talking about putting the car in concours condition, I am talking about having a safe, drivable car that performs as it should, looks good from 10’ and where the metal and mechanical repairs that were done were done well.
This is NOT what I am finding for $6-7k!
I am starting to lean toward a no structural rust, no patch panel, original or older paint, just so I can be sure of what I bought and how the money gets spent, but am trying to avoid a full blown project car and it has to be at a price that leaves me enough money to get it on the road – talk about a narrow line to walk!
I have mostly enjoyed the search so far - I have made some friends, learned a lot and I love looking at cars and talking about them, but I have also been sorely disappointed by cars that I really thought I was coming home with (until I actually looked at them or had them looked at for me).
If you decide to jump in - good luck with your search!
I have been reading here and on the club for about 5 months now and have actively been looking for about 4 months. My initial budget was $5k, but not finding what I was looking for at that price I upped my budget to $7k including shipping.
The enthusiasts here and on the club have some very nice cars - some in great shape to begin with and others that were project cars made right. As someone who understands the value of enthusiasm and dedication to a marquee, I want to buy a car from an enthusiast, but the problem for me is that you guys don’t sell that many completed cars that often!
Above somebody mentioned a $7500 car that doesn’t need anything. I have found this car to be as elusive as Bigfoot. I have read the stories and seen the pictures, but when you look at what is on the market right now today I find reality quite different.
Outside of the enthusiast website members and their cars, my experience so far has been that cars advertised in this price range that are “restored” and “needs nothing” are poorly repaired cars that need quite a bit and are really only $5k cars at best. These cars have honestly had $5k to $10k put into them and they still need work or rework!
I expect that any car will need attention and $$ spent and I am not talking about putting the car in concours condition, I am talking about having a safe, drivable car that performs as it should, looks good from 10’ and where the metal and mechanical repairs that were done were done well.
This is NOT what I am finding for $6-7k!
I am starting to lean toward a no structural rust, no patch panel, original or older paint, just so I can be sure of what I bought and how the money gets spent, but am trying to avoid a full blown project car and it has to be at a price that leaves me enough money to get it on the road – talk about a narrow line to walk!
I have mostly enjoyed the search so far - I have made some friends, learned a lot and I love looking at cars and talking about them, but I have also been sorely disappointed by cars that I really thought I was coming home with (until I actually looked at them or had them looked at for me).
If you decide to jump in - good luck with your search!
Scott and rmousir, you're both close enough to my area that maybe this will be of interest? I have no affiliation, but it sounds like it could take a $500 tranny/clutch repair job to make this a solid driver.
Maybe you can ask Type47, jmuriz, or another local to help you out with a PPI... I'm close enough, but not smart enough! Only been in this for 18 months and didn't do a good PPI on mine, but I seem to have been pretty lucky.
Maybe you can ask Type47, jmuriz, or another local to help you out with a PPI... I'm close enough, but not smart enough! Only been in this for 18 months and didn't do a good PPI on mine, but I seem to have been pretty lucky.
Thanks Flip, I had seen that post before pictures were added and assumed (maybe incorrectly) that it must be very rough at that price.
A PPI by somebody in the area would be a must for me as "no rust to speak of" may be a matter of how talkative you are instead of how much rust there is!
Looks good though - nice interior too.
Anybody near by who can take a look?
A PPI by somebody in the area would be a must for me as "no rust to speak of" may be a matter of how talkative you are instead of how much rust there is!
Looks good though - nice interior too.
Anybody near by who can take a look?
Although I have been a member here since the begining I too was once a Mustang rat! I bought my 914 when my 67 Mustang Convertable wouldn't make it around what I thought was just an agressive corner! Even lowered with suspension and sway bars it plowed like a truck! After I wrecked it I was test driving a 914 with a 471 flare package and went around the corner twice as fast!!
Sold!!! It didn't matter how much the car cost I just had to have it!I have owned at least 13 teens now and everyone of them has been a different experience! I still learn something every time I get another one!
Jump in and avoid the rust!! Everything else is fairly straight forward, replace, rebuild, clean & fabricate!
Ask Lennies914, he bought his first 914 just last year! Now I think he is on #4 or 5!
Thanks very much for the tips and the warm welcome guys.
I love my mustang, but don't get me wrong I know its not a corner carver. I have tweaked the suspension so it does better than a stocker and I enjoy it for what it is. It has some power though.
So the 914 has some things going for it.
-Great forum
-style
-go cart like handling
It has some things not going for it
-to have any sort of power it looks like a engine swap or a costly rebuild.
-finding nice examples for what I think is a fair price is difficult (sorry but I am thrifty or 'cheap' according to one guy I know).
As for doing the work, I am looking forward to that for my next car. I have my current car ready for the road. I don't mind a car that needs stripped down and rebuilt. It sounds like I won't have a problem finding one that requires that, however I want a complete car that is pretty much all there so I have a good start.
I am also looking at some other cars to keep my options open. I haven't committed to one yet but if someone here has a car they want to drop off at my house with a clear title I would be happy to take the no charge car and give it a good home where it will be saved.
I love my mustang, but don't get me wrong I know its not a corner carver. I have tweaked the suspension so it does better than a stocker and I enjoy it for what it is. It has some power though.
So the 914 has some things going for it.
-Great forum
-style
-go cart like handling
It has some things not going for it
-to have any sort of power it looks like a engine swap or a costly rebuild.
-finding nice examples for what I think is a fair price is difficult (sorry but I am thrifty or 'cheap' according to one guy I know).
As for doing the work, I am looking forward to that for my next car. I have my current car ready for the road. I don't mind a car that needs stripped down and rebuilt. It sounds like I won't have a problem finding one that requires that, however I want a complete car that is pretty much all there so I have a good start.
I am also looking at some other cars to keep my options open. I haven't committed to one yet but if someone here has a car they want to drop off at my house with a clear title I would be happy to take the no charge car and give it a good home where it will be saved.
QUOTE
-finding nice examples for what I think is a fair price is difficult (sorry but I am thrifty or 'cheap' according to one guy I know).
Bingo! I am not thrifty or cheap I am "resourceful and value oriented"
FYI I have heard that the Ford 289 bolts directly to the transmission in the 914 without an adaptor!
QUOTE
(sorry but I am thrifty or 'cheap' according to one guy I know).
Well... you now have a new moniker and, sounds like you'll fit right in with the rest of the CSOB's here.
QUOTE
1. What kind of costs would a 914 project take? What I mean is that I am used to the costs associated with a classic Mustang. This a Porsche after all and I can just imagine parts and items being 3x as much as I might be used. The associated costs of parts might very well make this a no go.
How thorough do you want to be? It can be as much as a Rustoleum roller job (search is your friend) and a bunch of free parts from the gang here or... it can be a full on ground up restoration with nothin but new or NOS parts. It really depends on you and what you start with. That said, I don't see 914 parts any more or less expensive than Mustang parts.
QUOTE
2. I really like the idea that these 914s can handle pretty well and even do double duty as a driver and a weekend racer. Although I don't have plans for that sort of thing, I like the idea that if I chose a 914 could easily do this. From what I have seen on this site many folks put in a different motor. Why is that? Is there something wrong with the stock motors to where one can not get power out of it?
Probably been answered a million times alread (didn't really read through the thread). It's difficult to get real power out of a T4 without spending real money. I think it's fairly easy to get 120 with bolt on stuff (P&C, Cams and Exhaust) but, when you want real power... it comes at a cost, both moniterily and reliability. There's an alure to bolting in the factory's answer or... some smokin modern Suby solution. It's a fairly easy car to bolt anything into.
QUOTE
3. Availability of parts. Nothing sucks more than being close to finishing something up and not being able to get a part. Is that the case with 914s?
I almost stated this in #1. Hang out in the classified section. You'll find everything from Mud Flaps to 3.6 engines. You'll be able to get a handle on these things fairly easily.
QUOTE
4. Are there any part supplier catalogs that I could order (free hopefully) to take a look and see what can and can't be gotten for these cars and the costs? This could be a big help with question 3.
Your best resource is "HERE". The knowledge of these people here far exceeds the need for a catalog. Both GPR and Pelican parts are some of the very best vendors out there. Honest as the day is long, 914 owners themselves and very FAIR pricing. There are those to stay away from but, I'll let you decide on that... all I'll add is "trust what others tell you here.
QUOTE
5. What are the basic restore/mod projects (sway bars is one I read about) for a 914 to bring it up to modern day par? You know the 'if you have one you should do this this and that first thing.
No. There are no "basic" mod/restore projects that accomplish this. There are things you can do (like sway bars) that were done back in 1970 that should have been done to all the cars. That's a great one BTW. Others include, get your brakes up to snuff, get excellent shocks and get some great tires. You'll be amazed at how your car can change with a suspension "spruce-up". Modern day par involves 3.2 or 3.6 engine, power this, power that... others have done it but, I don't see it ever fitting into the "basic" category.
QUOTE
The other project cars on my radar are: Miata (I know its not old), VW Super Beetle, Triumph TR-6, Datsun 510, Datsun 240z, and Alfa Spyder.
Based upon your criteria in your original post I think you can narrow it down to 3 or 4. 914 (my favorite of the group), Miata (Slits favorite... I hear Brant's fond of them also) the 240 and the Alfa. That said, from what I read, you have all of the qualifications of a 914Geek (I have a real fondness for the 914 and its unique looks. I like that it is both a coop and a convertible with the targa roof. I like the style and the unique look of the car. I love that you can't find one on every corner. It seems to be a very simple set up as far as working on it goes.)
QUOTE
Anything else I should know or be aware of if I decide to jump in to another project with a 914? I appreciate your time and all comments and suggestions.
Every one has rust. Welding skills can save you money. I've found welding is like playing guitar. A few can do it really well. A bunch are hacks and should probably put it down, and a bunch more just like to watch others do it. To do it right costs money. To do a Super Beetle right costs money. Do it because you love it, not because you expect to rake in a ton of dough someday when you decide to sell it. Use the board for any and every resource you can ask or think about. Someone here has done it already...
QUOTE(Jeffs9146 @ Mar 10 2011, 06:53 PM)
FYI I have heard that the Ford 289 bolts directly to the transmission in the 914 without an adaptor!
Now that is something that I have some back ground in.
I am pretty sure I would want more power. There isn't much that sounds better than a good old American V8! I bet that would be fun to hear it from a German car. Now I guess I have to do some more reading. If I go with the 914 I have to sweet talk the wife, she already said no about getting one.
I saw that someone mentioned welding skills. I have some. And I might add that for anyone who isn't a pro, that is what grinders are for. Every one has to start some where.
QUOTE(rmousir @ Mar 10 2011, 10:56 PM)
QUOTE(Jeffs9146 @ Mar 10 2011, 06:53 PM)
FYI I have heard that the Ford 289 bolts directly to the transmission in the 914 without an adaptor!
Now that is something that I have some back ground in.
I am pretty sure I would want more power. There isn't much that sounds better than a good old American V8! I bet that would be fun to hear it from a German car. Now I guess I have to do some more reading. If I go with the 914 I have to sweet talk the wife, she already said no about getting one.
I saw that someone mentioned welding skills. I have some. And I might add that for anyone who isn't a pro, that is what grinders are for. Every one has to start some where.
I would also agree on finding a relatively rust free body and then modifying it as you wish. It took me 7 years to find the right 914. I am still mulling engine options, but I really like the LS1/LS2 conversion. Seems the 3.2 is a bit expensive.
I must also say, that my wife purchased the car for me as a birthday gift.
Yay me!!
Hope you find the "one!"
-Jim
I know it has already been said numerous times, but it can't be stressed enough. RUST is the main fault about the 914. I know when I first started looking and was warned about rust, I figured no big deal, any classic car has rust prone areas to watch for. The 914 is extremely terrible. I won't get into the specific areas, but some seaching will reveal horror stories.
Whenever a 914 is listed as rust free, don't believe it unless you see it with your own eyes. They usually mean no rust is visible on the exterior body of the car.
Whenever a 914 is listed as rust free, don't believe it unless you see it with your own eyes. They usually mean no rust is visible on the exterior body of the car.
(In my best Clint Eastwood voice:)
"Well, you gotta ask yourself one question, do you like Jackstands punk? Well do ya?"
"Well, you gotta ask yourself one question, do you like Jackstands punk? Well do ya?"
QUOTE(moparrob @ Mar 15 2011, 11:53 PM)
(In my best Clint Eastwood voice:)
"Well, you gotta ask yourself one question, do you like Jackstands punk? Well do ya?"
Jack stands are no problem but if I go this route I will do the rotissory. So I don't see any problems there.
Two comments
1) Be patient. There are nice clean examples of 14s out there, needing SOME work, but decent drivers with lots of potential for upgrades and cosmetics.
Find a decent example, and take it for a drive. See how it fits, and suits your needs/wants..... That may not be the best advice, cuz you may initially feel it is underpowered, and that you want more "go".
2) That leads to the next comment, and one of my favorite sayings.
"It is more fun to drive a slow car fast, than a fast car slow".
May be poor grammar, but it says it all. There aren't that many times that we really get to let our cars stretch out and run....(at least if we don't have track time, or live somewhere where the constabulary aren't eager to slow us down...and that gets downright discouraging)
I have a 76 930. I have had it for about 20 years. It is a great car. It is a FAST car (not so fast anymore, given the new cars being produced, but still plenty fast).
It is fun to drive....but I have to take 30-60 minutes to get out of town, to "somewhere" where I hope I won't get nailed for doing ridiculous speeds, and lose the car to the authorities....
On the flip side, in many, many ways, the 14 is a way more fun car to drive. The seating position, the feeling of lightness and involvement, the engine noise right behind you, and...the "tossible" go cart handling.
The "other cars" you are considering (with the exception of the Miata) are all cool cars, but as rusty as the 14.
None of them have the Targa top, the mid engine....etc...
Buy a decent, driveable 14...buy the best you can, with the finances you are stuck with.....don't get caught up with bling factors offered with the sale...just get a good, honest car....live with it for a year...or two....then decide what upgrades are important to you.
That brings me back to "be patient". Before the internet, we had to rely on what was immediately available, or if you were lucky, a "friend knew a friend who was selling their cherry car...".
I bought a rust bucket back in 1981, not thinking a car would rust in 7 years. WRONG. I did what I could to make it look decent. It did, but I didn't have the skills or the time to do it absolutely right, and since I bought a good car about 5 years ago (on the internet...a good clean tired original 6), I cut the old one up for parts.
Just before buying my "current good car" I bought a clean 74 1.8 ...on ebay....in Washington State...turned out is was a Calif car, with a tired body, rust only in the battery tray area...had planned on doing a GT clone type tribute.
It was too clean to cut up (and I had by then learned that there are clean cars out there for those who are patient) so stored it for 5 years, to give to my daughter once she got out of High School. It is a blast to drive....(I get to borrow it while my 6 slowly is resurrected)
Yes, the Toyotas pass her/us...but they aren't having nearly as much fun...(of course, NOW it is in the shop getting a decent respray, and battery box...and out of commission)...
Odds are, if you buy one....you'll buy another....and another....
Would like to know how many owners are out there who own more than one...and I'd bet most have OWNED more than one. It's like crack, except perfectly legal, and I'm assuming a whole lot more fun.
BTW
You are way ahead of where I was in the hunt. You have already found this site....with owners who are passionate about their cars, and willing to help. They also sell their cars....and odds are theirs will be better cars than found elsewhere (I got lucky with my 2 ebay purchases) and odds are the owners will be more forthcoming re the condition of their cars...
Buy one (from them, or elsewhere), and you'll get a lot of support from this group...it's a good one.
Have fun
1) Be patient. There are nice clean examples of 14s out there, needing SOME work, but decent drivers with lots of potential for upgrades and cosmetics.
Find a decent example, and take it for a drive. See how it fits, and suits your needs/wants..... That may not be the best advice, cuz you may initially feel it is underpowered, and that you want more "go".
2) That leads to the next comment, and one of my favorite sayings.
"It is more fun to drive a slow car fast, than a fast car slow".
May be poor grammar, but it says it all. There aren't that many times that we really get to let our cars stretch out and run....(at least if we don't have track time, or live somewhere where the constabulary aren't eager to slow us down...and that gets downright discouraging)
I have a 76 930. I have had it for about 20 years. It is a great car. It is a FAST car (not so fast anymore, given the new cars being produced, but still plenty fast).
It is fun to drive....but I have to take 30-60 minutes to get out of town, to "somewhere" where I hope I won't get nailed for doing ridiculous speeds, and lose the car to the authorities....
On the flip side, in many, many ways, the 14 is a way more fun car to drive. The seating position, the feeling of lightness and involvement, the engine noise right behind you, and...the "tossible" go cart handling.
The "other cars" you are considering (with the exception of the Miata) are all cool cars, but as rusty as the 14.
None of them have the Targa top, the mid engine....etc...
Buy a decent, driveable 14...buy the best you can, with the finances you are stuck with.....don't get caught up with bling factors offered with the sale...just get a good, honest car....live with it for a year...or two....then decide what upgrades are important to you.
That brings me back to "be patient". Before the internet, we had to rely on what was immediately available, or if you were lucky, a "friend knew a friend who was selling their cherry car...".
I bought a rust bucket back in 1981, not thinking a car would rust in 7 years. WRONG. I did what I could to make it look decent. It did, but I didn't have the skills or the time to do it absolutely right, and since I bought a good car about 5 years ago (on the internet...a good clean tired original 6), I cut the old one up for parts.
Just before buying my "current good car" I bought a clean 74 1.8 ...on ebay....in Washington State...turned out is was a Calif car, with a tired body, rust only in the battery tray area...had planned on doing a GT clone type tribute.
It was too clean to cut up (and I had by then learned that there are clean cars out there for those who are patient) so stored it for 5 years, to give to my daughter once she got out of High School. It is a blast to drive....(I get to borrow it while my 6 slowly is resurrected)
Yes, the Toyotas pass her/us...but they aren't having nearly as much fun...(of course, NOW it is in the shop getting a decent respray, and battery box...and out of commission)...
Odds are, if you buy one....you'll buy another....and another....
Would like to know how many owners are out there who own more than one...and I'd bet most have OWNED more than one. It's like crack, except perfectly legal, and I'm assuming a whole lot more fun.
BTW
You are way ahead of where I was in the hunt. You have already found this site....with owners who are passionate about their cars, and willing to help. They also sell their cars....and odds are theirs will be better cars than found elsewhere (I got lucky with my 2 ebay purchases) and odds are the owners will be more forthcoming re the condition of their cars...
Buy one (from them, or elsewhere), and you'll get a lot of support from this group...it's a good one.
Have fun
QUOTE(porbmw @ Mar 16 2011, 01:45 PM)
Odds are, if you buy one....you'll buy another....and another....
Would like to know how many owners are out there who own more than one...and I'd bet most have OWNED more than one. It's like crack, except perfectly legal, and I'm assuming a whole lot more fun.
Once upon a time, there was a Poll that asked how many 914s you currently own. I just spent way too long searching for it, but couldn't find it. In any case, I remember about 40% of the responses said "one" - so yes, you're right about owning multiple.
Speaking of polls, here's one I conducted that might be useful to a prospective owner.
I was where you are about a year ago. I read just enough on here to know that you need to start out with as little rust as possible. I found a car from camp914.com He usually has a few cars for sale, sometimes he has ones that aren't on his website. Just one more place to look for your "rust free" starter car. My car was in pretty good shape except for the battery tray. I'm having that work done at the shop as I'm not much of a metal work guy.
QUOTE(flipb @ Mar 16 2011, 02:34 PM)
QUOTE(porbmw @ Mar 16 2011, 01:45 PM)
Odds are, if you buy one....you'll buy another....and another....
Would like to know how many owners are out there who own more than one...and I'd bet most have OWNED more than one. It's like crack, except perfectly legal, and I'm assuming a whole lot more fun.
Once upon a time, there was a Poll that asked how many 914s you currently own. I just spent way too long searching for it, but couldn't find it. In any case, I remember about 40% of the responses said "one" - so yes, you're right about owning multiple.
Speaking of polls, here's one I conducted that might be useful to a prospective owner.
Just bumping this as a finally found the poll about how many 914's you own.
QUOTE(vsg914 @ Mar 9 2011, 07:48 PM)
No offense George, but get one of your guys to show you how to use the qoute feature please.
I was thinking the same thing. Trying to figure out what George was adding to that post was more difficult than repairing a hell hole. And he owns a forum? Sorry rmousir, sometimes things get a little off topic around here. But that's another great point... The 914 seems to bring together an amazing community, especially here on "World." Guys (and some gals) who love to enjoy the camaraderie as much as the car. And who often get together to help each other out.
As you've read, the most cost-effective route is to buy a car that doesn't need work.
On the other hand, a lot of us like to work on these things.
Personally, I would rather work on sheet metal than engines. So I'd rather do some rust repair, (cut, fab, weld) than rebuild a power plant.
Did you mention what your budget is? And if you like to work on car projects, what kind of work do you like and dislike? I'd say the answer to those will be important in deciding which car to buy.
QUOTE(porbmw @ Mar 16 2011, 01:45 PM)
You are way ahead of where I was in the hunt. You have already found this site....with owners who are passionate about their cars, and willing to help. They also sell their cars....and odds are theirs will be better cars than found elsewhere (I got lucky with my 2 ebay purchases) and odds are the owners will be more forthcoming re the condition of their cars...
Buy one (from them, or elsewhere), and you'll get a lot of support from this group...it's a good one.
Have fun
A good forum is with as much as a tool box full of tools. It just helps out so much. I use many forums for my '66 mustang. From what I have seen this forum is great. I am going to be very patient and make sure that my next project car is the right car and that I get a good one.
QUOTE(Rand @ Mar 17 2011, 12:51 PM)
Did you mention what your budget is? And if you like to work on car projects, what kind of work do you like and dislike? I'd say the answer to those will be important in deciding which car to buy.
Right now I haven't decided what I will spend to get started. That really depends on which car since they all seem to have their own market and availability in my area. I will travel to get a good example so I am not worried about distance. As for the kind of work I like to do believe it or not I really enjoy the work that it takes to do a old car like this. I think if I found the right deal and figured it was worth the work I would even save a rust bucket. It all depends on time, price, money, etc. The details.
With that in mind, are all the body panels available for all the repairs or do you guys sort of just make your own? I was able to get some free catalogs for the vw rides but still didn't find any for the 914s. I did look at a few sites thought.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.