http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-car...2-914-6-fs.html

This appears to be a 72 and sure looks to have all the correct signs its a real 6. Even has the undercoating on the shock towers. It has a 914-4 vin number.

Its not a real 6! It could be chopped front 4 and back 6 but it is not legaly a 6!

I don't know much but the whole story seems fishy to me. Nothing about it sounds right.

I'd say check for signs of a front end graft.

I was wondering about a front end graft as well. Looks to be green orig paint through out though.

Did the sixes ever have ac as an option, front trunk seems to be cut for a condenser.

Seems like an odd bird.

Link for 914/6 info
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=74301
- it should have a flat /6, 2.0L motor (doh!)
- firewall center engine mount
- no /4 mounts
- factory oil-tank
- different relay board
- "hook" for the oil-line on drivers side rear long
- 911 style ignition switch and column for '70/'71 models
- *no* hole in the front trunk for the /4 air hose to the spare tire
- black "tar" around the front upper shock towers
- different windshield washer bottle
- electric washer pump
- real 5-lug axles
- "914-6" badge
- handthrottle in front of the shifter
- different throttle cable routing, using a tranny mounted pivot
- different paint code on the karman badge
- different VIN, starting with "914" (doh! again)
- no rain-tray under engine lid.
- Dash top has no center vent

some more stuff
Brakes were mentioned as being different. To elaborate further, the /6 has a 19mm MC and the /4's have a 17mm. The /6's have vented front rotors and larger calipers in the front right from the 911T. The /4's are solid rotors and smaller calipers. The rear rotors and calipers on a /6 are larger and unique /6 components. They are not interchangeable with a /4 without a major overhaul.
The e-brake system is shared between the /6 and /4 for the early years.

Visually, don't forget that the steering column on a six is unique to itself. Other than the horn pad everything is different including the 3 speed wiper arm on the right side of the column. The early /4's have a knob on the dash panel.

And we can't forget the gauges. Nothing is shared with any of the /4's.

At the time of introduction, any of the 5-1/2 inch wheels (steel, chrome, Fuchs 14" and Mahle's) supplied by Porsche for a 911 would fit the /6. Remember the best tire size of the day for Porsche was a 185/70.

Also, the transmissions were different. The /6 had 3 different gears. 2nd, 3rd, and 5th.

The more I look at that the more it REALLY puzzles me. I'm maybe shooting for stolen six with a VIN swap. Even the VIN has the green though.

Everything about that car says "six" except the VIN tags.

Wow...

I asked the seller to post the chassis number stamped in the trunk floor.

Freaking weird. From reading the tech articles it says its a "six" but sounds screwy.

I see all kinds of very questionable things in these pictures. This seems to me to be a conversion or a cutup.

I have seen many strange things, but unless this was going back to Germany, it would have a hard time passing muster for a World Teener that has owned one in 6 or 4 version for a while.

We all see strange things, and I agree that the frontend VIN is 72, but there is no center dash vent.

Strange flesh at best. It will be interesting to see if Eric gets a response.

It came onto Samba.com today or at least very recently.

John

As far as I can see it seems to have whats on that orig 6 list.

I can see the hand throttle and unique gauges, no center vent etc...

I guess only the car knows what happened to it self...

Must have been a rebuilder from way back?

I remember seeing this one on the Sambe a while ago.

If you look at teh vin tag in the nose it looks to have been removed and re rivited back on.

Wonder about the door jam decal. I imagine long gone.

Good call on the rear trunk vin, but it looks like in one photo the floor might be gone or replaced. It looks to be black from under side shot??

Pretty sure I've seen this one for sale before, a couple of years ago. IIRC the seller at that time said it was an early conversion with all the correct six parts. No one seemed to bite on it though.

Did a 6 have 2 fuel lines ? See the pic with the fuel pump connection and 2 plastic fuel lines - one plugged up??

yes. Recirculating system with internal regulator.

The same car sold on Pelican last year for ~$5,500. I talked to the guy. He's a small shop that resells cars. I think these are even the same pics from the previous sale. It was pretty much decided that this was a rebuilt 6 on 4 chassis.

Makes sense if you total your 6 to rebuild on a 4 chassis. I don't think anyone is claiming it's a real 6.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-914...92-914-6-a.html

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-car...roject-car.html

Right tach, wrong speedo on that car.

I have a /6 with a /4 front end graft. Every component on the car is a /6. Titled as a /6. The two previous owners stated what happened to the car when advertised for sale, so there were no "unknowns" about the car. The graft is very clear (and done very well) when the carpets are removed. Sale price was based on that history. No monkey business to try and remove/hide/change the /4 VIN on the front fender. It is what it is ....... FUN!

I agree chock lever is there thats a good clue..but the rear bumper is wrong, prolly swapped

This car would be a fun one to strip down to metal to see just what happened way back when.

The rear floor looks like it was added ? the grime does'nt seem to match the rest of the chassis?

When I lived in LA I did 2 swaps from rusty and otherwise compromised 6s into 4 chassis. Bought one of the 6s from Otto. Crashed in the front. Lotta work, but I did EVERYTHING, even the wiper harness connection under the dash. This could easily be a car done like that. Not one of mine, though.

Good point.

Interesting car for sure...lots of cool parts on it.

Personally, I'd love to have the left-hand key and steering wheel column of a real 6...but I think the $$ needed to do so is prohibitive. Heck I'd settle for just the left-hand key, but I don't know of a cheap way.

It "would" be a fun project for sure. Hell, if it runs & drives it's almost worth
that price for the FUN factor alone....

To me it looks like the "green" around the VIN is just primer. It doesn't seem to match the green you see in other places.

I'd be looking for signs of welding around the VIN tag. This may well be a /6 tub that had a VIN swap. In which case the stolen six becomes plausible.

I almost bought it last year for $6K. Probably would have been worth it for all the 6 parts but It just didn't seem worth the hassle to get it from OK.

More here:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-914...92-914-6-a.html


and here:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-914...2-914-6-fs.html

yep..
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-car...roject-car.html

Nothing about this car would make me think it is anything but a 914/4 with parts from a 1970 914/6 installed in it.

If it were that simple, I think it would have been picked apart right away. I had a second look because Eric and Andy weren't being so dismissive.

The tar around the front strut towers and the hanger for the oil line are pretty good reasons to think it might be something more than a simple conversion.

It would be cool to find out more.

I think in the old for-sale thread that the owner said the green on the VIN did match the green on the rest of the car? It doesn't look like it from the photo, but we all know that photos can show colors differently, especially if we're looking at them on line.

--DD

If it was the 70's and I wanted a 4 to look like a 6, it would be easy to move the oil line hanger to the new chassis and the tar on the front strut towers might have still been available at the dealer or at least something similar. There are some who go to great length to make their GT's look like the real ones. It would be easy to make a 4 look like a 6 with both cars sitting next to each other. It's hard for me to believe a 4 vin was switched into a 6 when it's so much easier (and believable) to switch the parts from a 6 into a 4.

Even if this is somehow a real 6, it would be a mess to register and insure as a real 6 and then have to file a claim or resell. It could be a factory GT and without the correct vin or at least proof of the correct vin, it's now just a 4 shell.

Just my lame opinion

THe strut tower "tar" was used on early 914 and continuedd to be used on the 911's long afterwards so I wouldn't rely on that as being solid evidence of a 6 or no 6. Could a buyer have gone to the dealer in 72 and asked that a stock 4 on the lot be converted to a six? Just a thought. Or possibly a dealer had a new wrecked six that they did the conversion on themselves. It's not at all unheard of for a dealership to have a test drive go wrong.

I think the main thing I'd like to see is the welding on the oil line hanger.

Best answer yet

I've worked on/seen a grey market 6 tub. There would be a pair of holes in the drivers fender well. They're not there.

I was going to reply with basically what Joe said. The welds on the engine mount and oil line bracket would be telling.

I've seen a lot of conversions and... Someone always misses one little thing somewhere. I just don't see anything missing, from the original looking strut tops (never seen that on a 4) to the dash, DME, hook, oil tank, engine mount etc.

I'd love to lay eyes on the car. The rear trunk numbers are missing... Very hard to say now without seeing the mounts and the areas where the numbers are/were.

Some states will get you a title for anything...

I've seen a lot of conversions and... Someone always misses one little thing somewhere. I just don't see anything missing, from the original looking strut tops (never seen that on a 4) to the dash, DME, hook, oil tank, engine mount etc.

Even the front trunk, cut for a/c. Wait, that's not right....

The engine is from a 914/6 built in June 1970 with a VIN of 914.043.2200 +/- 100
The upper fire wall appears to be from a 1970-71 (without retractable seat belts)
Click to view attachment

What 914-6 would not have been legal in the States prior to 1974

The plot thickens ...

So we know for a fact that the rear firewall is *not* from a '72.

4722917585 is about half way through the '72 model year and at that point they all had retractable seat-belts.

The picture of the firewall clearly shows that this is an earlier tub, which would be in line with the '70 VIN range Glenn posted.

Would somebody just buy it so we can disect it and settle it once and for all!

I thought I read once that the 6 wipers park to the right not the left.

Someone should have bought it when Cory sold it for $6K, this guy used pretty much Cory JJump's ad that I linked too, but without the #s. Looks like he bought the car for $6K at the most, but may have had trouble getting paper work straight, and desided to sell it for $10,500. If he had the answers, that would be one thing, but he doesn't seem to even have any updated pix
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-car...2-914-6-fs.html

I remember thinking about trying to get this when Cory had it.

So, is everyone going to put down $$ to buy it? I figure if we get 10 guys to put down a $1000 each where everyone has a 1/10 interest...

The '72 VIN puts that as being built within the month of 05/72, many months after the introduction of retractable belts.
Without additional pics or confirmation from the owner of the windshield VIN tag along with the door jamb plate and the chassis number, we still can't be 100% sure. But, given what I see here, IMHO, I am 98% sure this is a real /6 chassis.

Don

ALSO the rear valance had a hole which the tailpipe ran through. Unlike the 4's which had only a slot.

The AC hole is probably from the donor 4 front clip. I bet there is evidence some where of the graft.

I think it is a real six salvage with a 4 nose welded on. IMHO...

Too bad, that's a 30K value hit...

I was under the impression that any /6 built in '72 had the /4 steering wheel set up?
My money is on a vin swap with a stolen /6 and a clean, wrecked /4!

Yes. But this is a '72 /4 VIN on what appears to be an early '70 /6 chassis.

No, I am not convinced this is a front clip. Here's why. Looking at the underside of the front fenders that look forward on both sides of the car you can see Irish Green in several places. Everything looks straight and original. If there had been any metal damage requiring a front clip replacement, why would it still be green and seemingly untouched and original?
Look at the stamping plate photo long and hard as it does not fit the standard flat surface these numbers are stamped into at Karmann. This pic shows a surface that follows the contour of the inner fender and not a raised flat surface which is much more pronounced on any 914. I see a line just below the numbers and suspect a good craftsman was able to butt weld that VIN into the fender following the contour, grind it smooth and prep it with the light green primer and paint the car the color of choice. Pretty simple really for anyone with the right talent and tools to do. The rest of the numbered plates or stickers can be replaced or done away with.
Anyway, that's how I see it, IMOHO.
Don

That is a re-popped floor. Notice the circles are not cut out and do not have the metal plugs installed. This means the chassis number in the trunk is gone.

No numbers