Posted this on the Bird Board too

The idle adjustment on my 74 2.0 D-jet is screwed in all the way. Idle is at 1100 when fully warm. AAR disconnected & plugged. Used starting fluid to check for vacuum leaks... there ain't none! Spent the better part of an hour sprayin here & there but
nadda:( Valves adjusted, timing spot on, Pertronics)

I was running an 044 ECU with an 043 MPS and the original 012 CHT. I switched them out and used the components from the old 1.7...

037 ECU, 049 MPS and the year old CHT but I can't remember what its number is!

What else can be causing this to idle 200 rpms high? Sometimes it's up to 1500 at a stop light? The AAR works and when it's connected it won't idle in the 1500 to 1800 range like its supposed to when it's cold. It starts hard, gotta keep my foot on the gas to keep it up to 1500+ then runs good after 5 minutes or so.

I'm perplexed:rolleyes: Any ideas?

Maybe I should just drive it & be content, eh?

Be content... its better than 1k to high.....

*cough*

The throttle return spring is stretched out... or the arm is hanging... or it something else mechanical..

What did you find?


M

Maybe there is a Fat Tire bottle cap stuck in the throttle body, not allowing it to close....maybe?

Bruce: Gosh, thats what mine does, and I'm really happy to have it running. I though thats just the way it is.
Joe

Uhh.... is there a possibility that my newish PIECE OF SHIT is actually running better than the national average?



FUCK NO! But it's always nice to know that your cars suck too.




M

thanks guys.... guess I'm destined to be content, eh?

BUT........

I awoke this morning (better than not awaking! ) with a revelation

If the AAR is plugged into the plennum (basically) to the same chamber only on different sides, it stands to reason that it won't raise idle due to it's not getting outside air into the engine, right? Mine is plugged into the port by the cold start valve and then the other side is in the plennum almost exactly opposite of that in the lower side of the plennum, which to me would be the same chambers. Is the plennum split up into different chambers? I gots me some vacuum lines hooked up wrong, I bet. I look & look at the drawings & pictures of the lines but it jes'don't make sence sometimes.....

but at least I awoke

.........b

Another revelation...

Does the right side of the AAR plug into the air cleaner???

....b

Bruce,

Maybe your timing is retarded just a little. It doesn't take much to kick up the rpm.

Phil

Bruce... the side closest to the driver plug into the phegm... plehgln... the pleghlu..

<_<

The other tube, pointing more towards the passenger side plugs into one of those forward doohickeys on the air crean... the ail clrae.. the...

The box.

Yes.

A plugged AAR is bassically one that is discoed from the AIR BOX, and TAPE OVER THAT..

The plegnum... the phlemgun.. the... aww shucks.. is where the air goes, unmetered.


M

Ya! wha'chu said
it was funnier when I put a Georgian accent wit it

My revelation was eye opening since it happened when I opened my eyes this morning!!!

Thanks Miles

...b

Well, when spraying carb cleaner won't find the leak, I have to pull the hoses and look at the ends. If the hose is cloth covered, sometimes it will soak the fluid and you will not notice any change in the idle. As a matter of fact, that is what I do about yearly any more just to save trouble. Also I look around and under the inlet plenum to see if there are anay cracks or holes as both of ours has had holes brazed shut!! I also pull the throttle body to see if it shuts completely. I also check the diaphragm in the distributor vac advance mechanism with my Mighty Vac. Finally I will look at the seals on the injectors but if the small ones cracks or the plastic tip gets lost there will be some backfiring too. Good luck

ahh... the simplicity of carbs

I have new hoses and just this morning re-installed the original air cleaner and connected the AAR the way it's supposed to be. Also put back the 2.0 043 MPS. It runs smoother but still will not idle where it's supposed to when cold (1400 rpm's) or warmed up (900 rpm's).

At least it runs good after warming & has power t'boot!

......b

As someone said, check your timing. If it's advanced too far it will idle high.

Could also be your decel valve (if you have that installed). Remove and plug the smallest line that goes to it. If your idle speed changes, then it is defective. It shouldn't pass any air at idle.

Demick

OK... OK

As for the decel.... Got rid of that long time ago, but thanks anyway

....b

Set it hot, and make it around the 27btdc that the factory called for, slight over-advance has little effect on making your car punk(in) out ricers.



In my experience, if you disco/plug the AAR (if you have one that works, asshole Otto) and do it after a nice hot run, then hook up the AAR, you'll find out that the AAR is probably sticking 'slightly' open, and running it up a couple hun-erd pmps... rms.. pmrs..

Oh heck! Revs!

M

Thanks M, that could be my trouble. I didn't set it hot, just warm. I let it warm up in the shop while I did other things (cough) (cheap high became apparent) oh ya... ophen da door

No, not really!

I have plugged the AAR after a drive & it doens't matter. As soon as I pull the hose off it it revs up so I know it's working but it won't do it on first start in the morning.. goofy thang. I'll do the hot timing tomorrow after I hang the curtains in da Beaver.

Something else that went Tits Up... my sewing machine blew its reverse cam. My wife says it sounds like a carpet machine <_<

......b

Setting the timing cold, warm, or hot shouldn't make any difference. You are simply setting the timing based on full centrifugal advance (which happens around 3000-3500rpm). Doesn't really matter what's going on engine wise to get it to that speed.

Demick

Bruce:

I got the same exact problem...

My AAR valve has the passenger side fitting attached to the fitting on the top of the air cleaner so that it sucks fresh air in when the AAR is open...The drivers side of the AAR fittings goes to the white plastic fitting the fuel enrichment injector goes into in the TB plenum...

When the AAR valve is open it uses vacuum to suck in raw air to mix with the fuel from the injector...In essence, it creates a vacuum leak until the AAR closes and brings the RPM down to where it's suppossed to be...My AAR works and closes completely but my RPM is still at around 1100 to 1200...Sometimes it hunts ( 900 to 1100 RPM) so bad, she dies...Starts right up and runs OK, but just won't idle...

I am going to re-time the "Hot" motor to 27 degrees but with the retard hose connected to see if that makes a difference...

2-OH!

I do everything hot, everything in the damned engine hole is affected by temp... heh..

Serious!

The car runs different at 3/4 warm, than it does at warm.

You shouldn't hold your car @ 3500 cold anyhow.


M

I can't help but be amused by this little (shitt'nfuck'n) car but I luv it

What's also amusing... I posted this exact same thread on the Bird Board and received 2 answers....

both were from Alfred and all it said was to down load a pdf. on D-jet maintenance

It (he/she) makes me laugh
and I luv it too (not him/her) it's the total amusement

.......b

Who let you back in here?

Hee's Baaaaack..

Les see how long he stays clean!

(if you stay nice, we wont ban you.. again...)

How disappointing

Actually.... I want to appologize. That was a cheap shot. Al was just trying to help.. sorry Man.

I also wish to appologize to Pelican Parts. They have been there for me in my time of need, advice and parts...
Sorry guys......

.......b

I'm not I've always been disappointed in al.

The AAR valve hose plugs into the air cleaner.
I'll bet you have a leaky worn out Throttle body. Check out how tight the shaft to body play is, as it should be nice and tight with smooth action. The fix is to have bronze bushings put into it which make for a smooth throttle.

The engine is getting air from somewhere....tb,injector seals, bad hoses etc.

Geoff

Thanks Geoff, I suspected the throttle body due to its frozen position when I first tried opening it. I literally had to soak it in PB Blaster and scrape the white oxidation from the inside of the barrel to get it to move. After taking it apart and cleaning it it still felt like the brass plate was getting stuck within. Caused for a had throttle peddal with no smoothness of giving it the gas. It's better now because I took it apart again and used a small wire brush wheel on my dremmel to knock off other deposits. The shaft does feel a wee bit wobbley. I have 2 1.7 throttle bodies. I wonder... maybe the bushings will fit from them????

....b

UPDATE!!!

I re-timed it and it was just a BCH off. It slowed the idle to about 1050 with the idle screw closed. The AAR isn't closing completely. It's staying opn a BCH also but when I plug it off there's no change in idle speed. I think Geoff is on to something about the throttle body leaking. There could be a few other areas with minuscuel leak probs. The good thing is... it's running great and I don't wanna sell it no more

.....b

YAY! I mean.. IDIOT!


M

I had the same problem on my 76 2.0 and found the intake manifold bolts were loose?!!
I also had the decel valve go bad on another instance.

George

no, there are no bushings in any of the stock Throttle bodies. I had a automachine shop install them in mine as they had some in stock that would work. Wow, what a difference!

The other thing is to check the advance/retard plate in the dizzy to see if its sticking.
How steady is the timing mark when you shine the lite on it??? If its wobbly by over a 1/2" then the dizzy shaft is wearing out too. Gives you all sorts of problems with acurate timing (ignition and tigger points).

Geoff BTDT

Ya, the timing mark is wobbly. Looks just like my 1.7 did before I installed the Pertronics. I have the Pertonics in this one but it doesn't make a difference. Ani't it something what a slight movement of the dizzy can accomplish If I had a 3rd hand to hold the engine speed at 3500 rpms it'd make life alot simpler whilst timing

Geoff, did the bushings make for a smooth feel of the gas peddal with no sticking when you first apply pressure to it?

....b

Bruce, the wear in there shouldn't translate very much to the pedal... when they are worn, you may notice a clicking but it's nearly nothing, I noticed on one I sold a couple years ago that it clicked lightly, if I floored it.

How's your pedal cluster? May a cable be doing something nasty in, or out of a tube?


M