For those looking into new mufflers, some key points to know beforehand:
1) not all 2.0L exhausts are the same,
2) in 914 land, the definition for "exhaust header" and "heat exchanger" are, confusingly, interchangeable

===================================

From: Alan
To: triadwest@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 10:47 AM
Subject: 914 muffler

Hi.

I am interested in your performance muffler for a Porsche 914 - 2.0L.
Dual exhaust (both pointing out back).

Shipping to zip:  94583

Anything else?

Let me know when & how much to PayPal you.
 
--> Alan


===================================

From: Alan
To: triadwest@comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2013 10:00:56 PM
Subject: Fw: 914 muffler

are you still in business?

--> Alan


===================================

From: triadwest@comcast.net
To: Alan
Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: triad west/914 muffler

Alan,
Shipping to 94583 would be $45.99 so total would be $320.00 (exhaust) + $45.99 (shipping) = $365.99. Patable to triadwest@comcast.net. I also would accept a check but no visa/MC.
I would need to know the type of heat exchangers you have as modifications are common with these cars...could be a 73/74 2.0 or a 75/76 2.0...
let me know
dave @ triad


===================================

From: Alan
To: triadwest@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 12:47:30 PM
Subject: Re: triad west/914 muffler

Thanks for getting back to me.
There are no heat exchangers.
How long is the fab/wait time?

--> Alan


===================================

From: triadwest@comcast.net
To: Alan
Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 1:04 PM
Subject: Re: triad west/914 muffler

alan,
what do you mean that there are no heat exchangers? what are we attaching to? The exhaust is a two in/two out system,some headers are single out...?????????
Dave @ triad


===================================

From: Alan
To: triadwest@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 2:16:39 PM
Subject: Re: triad west/914 muffler

There is no heat exchange casing to heat air for the cabin.
Exhaust headers only.

There are two gaskets that looks like this: 
http://www.autoatlanta.com/Porsche-Exhaust...R039251261.html

--> Alan


===================================

From: triadwest@comcast.net
To: Alan
Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2013 9:57 AM
Subject: Re: triad west/914 muffler

Alan,
O.K. you have 2.0 heat exchangers with no heat. The exhaust will not supply any heat but will bolt to your system....I am all over it.
I'll build one today and be in touch...
 
Dave @ triad


===================================

From: Alan
To: triadwest@comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 7:42 AM
Subject: Re: triad west/914 muffler

What's the status?

--> Alan


===================================

From: Alan
To: triadwest@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2013 2:11 PM
Subject: Fw: triad west/914 muffler

Hello. Do you have any updates on the 914 muffler build?

--> Alan


===================================

From: Alan
To: triadwest@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, June 17, 2013 7:14 PM
Subject: Fw: triad west/914 muffler

Well, I'm not sure what happened here. 
I'm assuming the build will not happen and I'm moving on.

--> Alan


===================================

Bummer. Dave is good people, I hope everything is ok with him... And I'm truly bummed for YOU, because its a great product that I'm sure you would've enjoyed! Which direction are you going to go now with your exhaust?
Chris

Basic misunderstanding.

YOU brought this up, so I'm going to respond to what you posted:
Dave asked you what kind of exhaust you had since there are three different styles of factory exhaust. You never said if you had 1.7 exhaust, 2.0 exhaust or 1.8 exhaust. They can all bolt to any engine, but they all have different muffler attachments. Sounds to me like Dave was trying to get you the right part, but never got a straight answer from you.

Did you ever pick up a phone? Seems like a quick phone call could have clarified all of this.

I had a good experience with Dave. Hope it works out for you. His exhaust are awesome. I would suggest you give him a call. Well worth the price. In my opinion, best sound by far.

Click to view attachment

Yes, many parts are 'interchangeable' on 914s. Some have possibly had 10 or more owners since new, and a lot of the 'original' components are gone on many of them.

Yes, it's a good idea to know exactly what you have so you know what's compatible. Model year of the car, displacement, type of exhaust, modifications, etc. are all typically required info.


Have you thought about calling Dave on the phone? ... emails aren't necessarily the most personable form of communication



EDIT: you guys are fast ... already posting while I was still typing


Where's that new tuna can, Joe?

I've had similar experiences from several vendors like that. I'm overseas so a call is a little difficult but waiting weeks for a response and then ending up with nothing just means move on and give someone else the money
Edwin

Just an observation. From what I read here, correct me if I have this wrong. Dave is a decent guy who builds a great product. He probably keeps his costs down by answering his own email, handling all the shipping, bills, income etc... Of course we all get frustrated because we are used to placing an order and receiving the tracking number an hour later. My guess is he just forgot about you, or possibly has something other than "914's" going on in his life. Two sides to every story. I would pick the phone up and call him.

i know for fact that triad had a major computer crash. have you considered calling on a TELEPHONE?

Dave, made mine early this year. It too took a little while, but for a hand made part that dropped right in without issue, it was worth the cost, wait and the shipping across the county. I am still VERY pleased with my purchase. IF I could do it again I would ask Dave to add Chrome tips for an added cost. Stock is fine but a little bling is better

Love triad! I proudly sport a transparent Triad sticker in my back window...and I typically do not do stickers on my 914


-Robert

Sorry, I'm going to jump on the other side of this. Since when is building a good product a free pass for bad business. Zeezee was told in late April that his product was being built and that he would get a response. Right there is where good business ends. If you say you are going to respond... respond. Open up the fancy computator, fire up excel and keep a spreadsheet of who is an active customer. Heck, go old school and keep a pen and pad for who needs responses.

Zeezee did the right thing by emailing 3 additional times, giving more than adequate time between emails for "other than 914 work" to be completed. If you do not want to have your business be emailed, don't list an email address. List a phone number only and you will get phone calls. If you list an email, it is implied that you check and will respond to said emails.

If you don't have time to be a good businessman, don't do business. If you build a good product but have no time for customer service, reach out to one of the thousands of loyal 914ers who would happily handle doing customer service.

Sorry, but as the recipient of many very similar exchanges, it irks me that there is defense for blatantly ignoring a paying customer.

i don't get why people, in general, love exchanging numerous emails when a simple 10 minute phone call will do the job. i'll take a land line call over an electronic communication any day. he ?s. clarifications. people going on vacation. order ?s. computer problems. too freekin' much.

Because in general, email can be tracked. If you sent an email a month prior ordering X, Y, and Z for a quoted price. You can refer back to said email. A phone call becomes who remembers what and how it was interpreted if it was transcribed.

I have to agree with Kevin that a phone call to sort out any and all issues should have been the course of action. Dave is a "old school" type of guy and not a twentysomething guy with two phones/ipad always "in touch" with the electronic world.

ALL of the ld phone calls i make are listed on my monthly billing. ALL phone, local or ld, calls are noted by my service provider. but i will concede that the whole transaction took too long. again, computer convenience sometimes isn't very convenient nor time effective.

I will tell you I've had problems with other vendors that do the same. Phoning is the best, it's my duty to help them and get my product. I don't mind at all. I had to call to ensure the purchase kept going through. No biggie, I'm not dealing with an Amazon distributor here. The email string proves nothing to me other than that the order sat a very long time from BOTH sides. No money traded hands. I'd see it as 'tire kicking' or 'Craigslist Flake Syndrome'.

If Dave stepped in and showed 50+ emails of similar nature of someone 'tire kicking' but no purchase or fund exchange...wouldn't it make sense? I bet many of the vendors get inquiry emails just like this. How can Dave differentiate a 16 year old kid wishing to buy a product and a serious buyer? Telephone call? An order? A check?

Reading the email string Zeezee says he wants an exhaust. But doesn't know the specifics of his own car. That'd be a CLUE to Dave he might not have a good client. I'm sorry, but think about it. If you don't even know what you are bolting the exhaust up to...how can he build it. Point: My brothers 914-6 has aftermarket heat exchangers and mine has stock; therefore, the mounting pipes are different lengths. His Triad will not bolt up to my car. Even though both are the same 914-6.

+1 for a phone call. Exchange a number, make an order. Send money and receive product. No money. No product.

i can't tell you how many times dave has sold a system for a 2.0 4 only to be informed it "doesn't fit". wrong he's and he has bit the bullet on the return. i pointed out that he needed to ask more questions or ask for pictures if the buyer wavers on specifics.

Lol "twentysomething"... my 72 year old mother has an ipad and can handle responding to an email within 30 days. No need to respond within the minute, day or even week. But a response to 3 emails over a 2.5 month span is crazy. Unless he is a hermit and lives in a cave, I'm guessing he is "in touch" more often than that. Enough excuses, he makes a phenomenal product. No taking that away at all.. In this case, his customer service and response time is lacking.

.....so what is the purpose of your post?

Interpersonal skills?

Lesson on humility?

The skill of your grandmother with computer skills?


Sorry but everyone has a bellybutton.

Let's see, it was nearly two months since Dave said he was all over it. I would be gone to, but only after making a phone call to see what happened. It disturbs me a little that guys will make public their problems when they really haven't done all they could have done. With that said, I am very happy with my Triad.

time line..17th to the 25th and 6 emails JUST to sort out what type of he's are on the car.

Dave Just retired from the carpenters union last month he`s been party n his ass of ,flyn off to Hawaii , spending money,and just having fun,,,and something about the computer being broke and not give a rat ass

I im at 7:45PST he`s going to modify my triad next week ...he pick up the phone on the 3rd ring! the dudes on it

We tend to forget that for most people it isn't possible to supply 914 products as a means of survival. As an expression of creativity maybe, which generally comes across as good product. The demand simply isn't there. Do the math: can you sell $50 a day and survive? Not if you have any costs. So these things seem from cyber land to be indistinguishable from full press businesses, but they aren't. No staff and no time.

Maybe there could be some sort of 914 web sticker that says:
I am mainly doing this because I like it and as a service. Yes, you have to pay, but keep in mind I am actually an airline pilot. A fancy logo and a disclaimer that you only look at emails sometimes and get confused easily.

Then there could be others that tell you: Yes we are a full time Porsche business. We will behave as such.

Personally I agre with both camps. No excuse for not answering emails once you get started. I like the paper trail of an email. Phone calls often are more productive.

I also bought a Triad muffler for my six earlier this year. I called Dave and he was a pleasure to talk to and work with. We also went back and forth over email. The transaction was seamless and timely. I would recommend Dave and his product to anyone. Yours might be an isolated incident, but I have been on this board before the split and I have found that most of the vendors on this board that have a day job have similar customer service. If I do not pick up the phone and call them, then I end up with a similar issue. It's no excuse, but I put up with it to get there product.

People are going to stop selling and coming up with new products for our
cars if we are like this guy. Calling you can tell them what you want. And they can tell you if they have it or can get what you want. when they can get it to you. The 914 cars are not that big a market.

They are a bunch of great guys and are doing us a service by making low margin stuff for our cars in there spare time. You can't compare them to Pelicanparts.com, where you get an email every step of the transaction.

I try to be way more responsive to emails than what was shown above even though I get plenty of confused tire-kicker types of streams from people almost daily. But, I am a bit obsessed.

From what I was reading int he posted emails, Dave may have simply felt that this customer is likely to order the wrong part, it will not fit, and he will have to eat the cost of making it and shipping it. Not worth pursuing, perhaps. Personally, I would have asked for a phone number and time to call, or provided such. I agree, a call is much better. After a call, if I feel that the customer may not remember the details, I email them a synopsis for reference and this makes both of our lives easier.

Transmission rebuilding is definitely NOT my primary job. As it stands, I am still looking for my DVD stuff to fill some back orders. They were packed somewhere during our recent move and it has taken me a long time to still not have found them It seems to bug me more than my customers.

If a business lists an email address as a way to communicate with them it should be just as viable as any other method they advertise. I much prefer email over phone calls.

At the time, I felt my first email had all the proper details.
And we eventually worked out the issues. A phone call would have had the same back-and-forth confusion and explanations.
If he felt I was just jerking him around he could have asked for money or just tell me, up front, he wasn't interested in my business.

I still think "heat exchangers" and "exhaust headers" are not the same thing.
My car does not have "heat exchangers"... my muffler does not connect to a heat exchanger.

With all the research I do .. I'm still learning more about these cars.
Hopefully others doing research can learn form my mistakes.

.....all about you and he....not we.

Your text.

So what?
Regardless of your preference/definition, they are known as heat exchangers, headers, manifolds, pipes, etc. What Dave really wanted to know was what shape is the muffler connection point. Small trapezoid? Large trapezoid? Triangle? It's not a matter of calling it the right thing.

Now see you have still confused me.... If you have Porsche heat exchangers with the airguide tin taken off then that is what you tell him.... If you have some other header system that is not Porsche or a repo like ssi then you are shit out of luck or will have to make a trip out to Washington and Dave will custom make it for you while you wait.

If you pass up buying Dave's exhuast because of your missinformation and what I think is a lack of confirming and arrainging payment then it will be your loss that you would regret..... So many happy customers running triad

Call Dave to get it straightened out or 'move on'.

This thread is becoming non-productive.

+1 for the Tele. Yes, I use the email. I even have a website. But when it comes to productive communication I choose the Tele. Why? I honestly don't know if "X" received or read my email but I sure as Hell know that I spoke with "X" and that "X" fully understood my communication before I end the call. The thing Email allows is confirmation that it was opened. And one can "step" around that, too.
Sorry 'bout your deal turned sour but it's going to happen within our escutcheon. These "suppliers" are actually "gifted individuals" that render a service to a very narrow market.

You know what's odd, zeezee? Someone mentioned a computer crash? That's never happened to your grandmother? And when it did did you just keep sending her e-mails? From her lack of response to your e-mails just assume you'd been disowned? Or did you pick up a phone and call her?

I'd suggest that next time you find out what's really gone on before publishing your travails to a group who have all had good experience with the man. He was asking you about your heat exchangers to make sure you got the right product. You couldn't give him an answer, and until now haven't even understood why he was asking those questions. I don't know why he didn't respond to you, but from your posts get the feeling he made the right choice. And actually, zeezee, know it or not, that may have been the right choice for you, too.

If you have a problem with a vendor, it's your problem not ours. Anyone who prefers an email to a phone call has other issues. The written word is one of the poorest forms of communication. Everyone interprets it differently to fit their own feelings or agenda. I would like to see rants like this about personal problems go the way of political and religious discussions.

Whut?

Wow...harsh words. Personally I feel he gave PLENTY of time before posting about his problems. How many people here have posted after not hearing from someone after a week? Months and months go without a response and that isn't long enough? Find out what is going on before posting???? How was he supposed to do that when he couldn't get a response?

I don't know anyone who had a computer crash for months on end and didn't look into fixing it. I could understand if it were a week but if someone cares that little about email, take down the email and only give the option of calling.

Yes, understandable but he could have called and asked were the part was.

Well, it was an example. Like hypothetical. Hey, I am a scientist and certainly get confused easily.

Also this has gone on enough,eh?

zeezee

The bottom line is this: If you want a very nice Triad muffler for a very reasonable price, call Dave, otherwise just move on. I hope you get it right. Eventually, you will need something from someone else and there are pretty damn good vendors here. So, tread lightly my friend.

Ya its like mikey...... He comes across like an ass munch in writing but in person he's just a clown.....

By making a phone call? Would probably have resolved things and would certainly have been less work than posting all that correspondence, creating the drama, and then having all this discussion based on speculation. So was that ALL the correspondence? Nothing left out? Did Triad call him and he missed the call? None of us know any of that. In fact all I really know for sure is that I've been kicking around here for ten years and heard nothing but good things about Triad. Based on that I suspect there's more to the story, but until SOMEONE makes a phone call we're all really just wasting time here.

I've been in tech support for a couple of semiconductor manufacturers. Our rule of thumb is if you haven't straightened out the issue by 3 emails back and forth, it's time to pick up the phone.

Email is great for providing a written trail, but is not good for ironing out differences of thought. One minute on the phone can circumvent many emails and reduce frustration.

ILBT!!

His phone number is listed on his website.

That's all I do around here anyways!

You didn't even spell it right.

Thanks ..i think i talked with Dave this AM.. he`s ready to get busy again ....he`s just been busy learning how to be retired ....I 90 tunnel at 6K on the tach ..no better sound then a traid west



communication is the key to everything..and with me the best why is a phone call because of my great writing skill`s or lack there of haha not everyone can be a great writer or a great mechanic but we all do our best and shouldnt be judged or disrespected because we are not proficient at one aspect of our lives .