Hi all,
I just purchased a v-8 converted 914 and inherited a bunch of electrical problems
So much for "turn key" and "daily driver" descriptions....
It will be some time before I can get this vehicle to pass our state inspections...
The problems (electrical) so far,

No power to right side headlight-SOLVED
No horn (I don't even see a wire coming up the steering colum)
Wipers not working
Gas gauge not working
Hazard lamps not working
Front turn signals not working (Not even installed)
Back up lights not working

My first post of electrical gremlins (the right side no power to headlights) was solved rather quickly and so I thought I'd post my attacking the next problem, there's no power to any of the 5 wires to the wiper motor when the key is on and the wiper motor switch is activated on the steering colum. I don't see that this is fuse protected but I do see it on the circuit board (56, 91-optional intermittent).
I'm guessing that it's not fuse protected.
What test can we come up with that will tell us if the wiper is operational and beyond that (if it is) why is the switch not controlling it? Probably the relayor a ground fault I would guess, but first things first, how to test the wiper motor?
Thoughts, ideas?

Additional information-In another post I found that the relay for the wiper is supposed to be above the fuse panel and accessable by removing the two screws that hold the panel in. I did this but can anyone identify the relays and a test for same? Here's a picture-
Also-the PO converted this to a v-8 and in a previous conversation with him about the circuit board, he alluded to the board no longer being useable during the converstion. I'm not sure if I inturperted what was being said....but I can't find a circuit board anywhere. Not being familar with 914's and having to wait for a manul from Amazon, wait for it (the dumb question), where would the circuit board be located?
Assitional information-After examining an online diagram of the "relay" board, it appears as if the PO was right and (given that he removed all the heating stuff as it was no longer useable in a v-8 conversion) the relay board was no longer neccessary. That said, it appears as if the wiper motor is fused (and relayed-as it looks like I have the intermittent switch). Still hoping someone can identify the relays from my picture and mebbe have a test for that relay, but...and this is odd, one of the diagrams I've viewed (and I've posted it) indicates one of the five wires coming off the wiper (56) as going to a fuse block (60) with slots 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. That's confusing to me as I'm only aware of the 12 block fuse panel under the steering colum. Is there another one somewhere?
Lol, can't wait for Amazon to deliver my 914 book :-(
More info-learning curve. After much study I do not believe my wiper system had the intermittent switch and as such I shouldn't/wouldn't expect to see a relay for it. The diagrams indicate a relay is used only with the optional intermittent. Soooo, it appears as if the wiper motor is merely to a switch and it also appears as if it gets it's power from fuse panel position eight. I've tested the fuse and it's good, yet when I have the key on and the wiper switch on, I see no power at position eight on the fuse panel (either side). That's making me think the switch is bad, as I heard these fuse circuits are fused at the end of the circuit. Soooo, any cool ideas for testing the switch? Still might be of value to have a test for the wiper motor itself too. One of em is bad unless I've msitaken where the wiper motor gets it's power from (position eight).

Jeez. Will I be left to my own genuis thinking on this? :-(

Patience grasshopper, lets start off with which year 914? They are each a little different electrically.

We will also ask that you keep it simple...you have about 40,0000 different issues listed, take one at a time.

You should be able to start sorting out the differences between the factory schematic and your actual wiring on your own.

Do you have the intermittent relay or not? The switch on the steering column does not priovide the intermittent function.

I would start with checking to see if you have all wiper motor wires in the right locations and verifying that there are no other wiring issues related to that wiring like cuts, corroded terminals, melted wires etc.

Click to view attachment

Hi'ya Jeff! So, not only do I have the LE but I bought a 1973 Darkside a few weeks ago also. Rains it pours, right?
Agreed! Many issues and best taken one at a time. Got the headlights solved and tomorrow I'll wire up the motors. Hopefully they'll operate!
But in the meantime, I'm attacking the non-working wipers...
I visually examined what I could of the wires and saw nothing obvious and I looked at the connections at the wiper and checked they were attached where they are supposed to be attached (see pix). I do see what looks like a relay socket close to the wiper motor (see pic) but the stalk only has two positions so the tab is intact.
Is fuse position 8 supposed to be hot with the key on or is it supposed to be hot with the key on and the wipers switched on?

Whats your real name moon-man? I like knowing who I am talking to.

Thats not an intermittent relay base, it looks like the fresh air fan connector.

More later.

My bad! Let me introduce myself...David Appell
Pretty sure it didn't/doesn/t have the intermittent option. Stalk is a two position and I didn't see a relay where I thought I would see one (like on my LE, which does have it).
While I am somewhat disappointed the level of electrical problems I've inherited, I must say, it is an exciting project. A little more than what I had hoped/planed on....but exciting none the less. Tomorrow I'll also put on the Roh wheels and tires I have around and a set of Recaro's. I'll be stoked if the hideaway motors operate without fail after I wire them tomorrow as well :-)
Hopefully I can get this on the road over the next few weeks and sort out any other problems. Not exactly sure if I'll be keeping this one. If I do, I think it probably needs a fairly major work over and that would take away from the LE :-(
Like I said, not exactly what I'd planned on.
Btw, still waiting on papaerwork the LE :-/

That 4 pin female thingy is for the fuel tank level sender
Whoops , my bad, if it's 4 terminals, it's for the fresh air blower,
If only 3 terminals, it's the fuel level sender.
Sorry, Barefoot

And that is why we ask for pics

Beg to differ boyz...the fuel level sender is Green-Brown-Black wires...

That thaar is the FA fan connector. Same connector type, different wiring.

Ha. guess I better look a little closer and engauge my brain before talking.

Is the Brown ground connected to the wiper body? Cant see from pic.

Gonna throw up a bunch of pics for you while Jeff is walking you through things.




Wiper switch thread Wiper

Click to view attachmentLol, I'm color blind but I think you mean this wire?
Yes it's grounded to the body of the wiper motor :-)
Thanks for the images. The relay board images while cool for my files I don't need as the relay/circuit and all the associated relay's for that board have been ommittted as this is a V-8 conversion that evidently didn't require any of those circuits/relays.
The image of the wiper motor and relay's was VERY interesting though! Can I assume that two relays are used when the intermittent option is in use but only one relay is used for the standard two position switch? If so, where is that relay located? Back of the fuse box perchance? Which one...lol
Thanks :-)
D
Addedum, opps. My mistake. Only one relay is in the picture. IS it used without the intermittent option?

Very cool wiper switch thread too :-)

What year is that wiper motor ? My 76 does not have those two extra wires.
Are they for the intermittent function ???

It's a 73 motor as far as I know and I'm pretty sure this car does NOT have intermittent. Jeff says that the wiring changed from year to year so I'm not suprised your 76 is different.

The brown wire on the right of the photo
is attached correct?

Make sure your grounds are all attached and have good contact.
Especially the ones under the dash, on the drivers side, under the fuse box.
Here is Jeffs guide to grounds

Opps. I guess I didn't make it clear. I'm actually (really, no kidding) color blind. Which is why I enclosed a picture with the wire in question circled. I've enclosed another image with a different wire circled. Is this the wire (brown) that you were referring too? Sorry for the confusion. Real color blindness can make wiring a VERY interesting challenge
Addedum-I checked and it runs through the harness so I'm assuming it's connected (the brown wire) but I'm assuming they're all connected lol! I suppose that (unraveling and checking) is or might be one of the next steps but I'd love to avoid it...
I think it's the switch but that's not based in any evidence

FWIW I tracked my non-functional wipers down to a bad switch using the procedure in the tech tips 700 book. I now have a toggle switch under the dash for windshield wiping purposes.

Cool!
WHere is this "Tech Tips 700" book located and where can I get a copy? Or is this some resource online? If so, do you have the link?
Thanks!

It is located in Marietta, GA. from AutoAtlanta.

It is a very useful book for 914 owners IMO.

there are about 700,000 tech tips in this forum.

I have the tech tips book but don't recall reading about replacing the wiper switch with a toggle switch under the dash? Maybe that's an AA special secret?

914world is tech tips x 1,000,000

It was a rare (and now extremely valuable) option back in the day.

Interesting. Today I found what I think is the wiper relay (see pic/s) and I'm not sure if it's the right relay. It says on the side #111 94 583. Is that the right wiper relay part number for a 1973? I'm not even sure if it's wired properly (note jumper wire-not even sure if that's supposed to be there). The PO said the wipers did work (at some point).
Still stumped
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

That's the headlight dimmer relay. Have you found the wiring schematics for your '73 on the pelican parts dot com site yet?

That's the headlight dimmer relay. Have you found the wiring schematics for your '73 on the pelican parts dot com site yet?

Hi Jeff,
Yes I have the schematic from them. And while it's helpful I'm still stumped. I can't even find where the relay is.

And that's because (on non-intermittent models) there is NO relay (thanks William). Earlier in the thread there was an image that confused me about a relay being employed. Now that I know there's no relay, I can start tracing down wire continuity between the switch and the motor.
There is however a rather nagging question....
The wiper motor is fused at position 8 on the fuse block, right? Shouldn't one side or the other (regardless of fuse condition-mines good) be hot with the key on?

And that's because (on non-intermittent models) there is NO relay (thanks William). Earlier in the thread there was an image that confused me about a relay being employed. Now that I know there's no relay, I can start tracing down wire continuity between the switch and the motor.
There is however a rather nagging question....
The wiper motor is fused at position 8 on the fuse block, right? Shouldn't one side or the other (regardless of fuse condition-mines good) be hot with the key on?

Well that's a BIG problem. The wipers ain't gonna work with fuse block eight not having any power with the key on. Soooo, either the fuse block is bad or the ignition switch has a problem. I'm not seing any other problems associated with the ignition switch so I guess I'll focus on the fuse block. Saw a nice upgrade from Pelican for a blade type fuse block fer bout hundred bux....

Jwest is a forum vendor and offers the fuse panel.

JWest Panel

This is a pic out of the haynes manual for an early car.

Is everything else on the fusepanl hot with the ignitions switch on?

If the wiring works out ok, and the ignition switch is OK, then how about the wiper switch on the column?

The different fusepanel layouts are different between the model years. That image out of Haynes is from an early car 1970-71, it is not the same as the 1973 car fusepanel, which has a horn relay. And that buzzer is hugenormous.

I would like to see a photo of the backside of aftermarket fusepanels with the wiring attached if anyone has one they can post. The factory fusepanel has busses on it that the aftermarket panels do not have.

Just out to the garage to test the fuse block and here's what I found:
With the key on,
1-6 dead
7 hot (lower side only)
8 dead
9-12 hot

Key on with light switch pulled out
1-2 dead
3-5 hot
6 upper spade dead, lower spade hot
7 hot both sides
8 dead
9-12 hot

and after this test my headlights went out, sigh. Fuse or relay I reckon.

1973 fuse assignments

75-

Are these towards the front of the car or rear as the fusepanel is mounted?

When the fuse panel is in place (under the steering wheel), relays are toward the steering wheel and the fuses are toward the floor.
And all that said....8 is always dead and that is why the wipers (theoretically) aren't working. But I'm assuming the hinkyness in the data may explain planty of other things too (keep in mind that all the heating has been removed so that wouldn't be part of the eqaution anyway)

Addedum (easier to read)
Key off- Key on- Key on/light switch on
1 dead dead dead
2 dead dead dead
3 dead dead hot
4 dead dead hot
5 dead dead hot
6 dead dead hot
7 dead hot hot
8 dead dead dead
9 dead hot hot
10 hot hot hot
11 hot hot hot
12 hot hot hot

Previous observation of one side being hot, other being dead due to fuse connection, corrected for this test. All fuses test good and dressed with sandpaper as well as fuse box.

I'm happy to report the problem is solved.
On 1973 they used a horn relay (Thanks Jeff) and if that relay is bad fuse block position #8 won't power up and...you guessed it, not only will the horn not work but anything on position #8 (including the wipers) won't work either!
I swapped out a new relay and the wipers came on no problem. Also now I can hook up some horns (PO removed them) once I track down the wires for them.
Soo....just need to get the horns going, license plate lights (already found what I think are the wires and they are hot), and the reverse lights and I can get it inspected and DRIVE the car
I think Monday I'll get the license plate lights going and the horns working.
Thanks everyone for the patience and positive feedback helping me figure things out!
We've done much together so far!

Got the headlights working
Got the flip ups installed and working
Cut the fiberglass hood (for the flip ups)
Got the wipers working
Got power (theoretically) to the wires for the horns
Found a solution to the reverse lights (without using a relay board)

We are kicking butt together!

Nice work. I would have missed that and burned my car down by now.

reviving an old(ish) thread
73 2.0 I have the same symptoms -no horn no wipers
you have a pic of the horn relay? where it's located?
thanks
cjl

The horn relay is on top of the fuse panel. The positions sometimes changed over the course of production (the socket just plugs into a hole in the panel) so it's best to check the wire colors going to the socket against the wiring diagram.

Look for red, red/white, black/yellow, and brown/white wires.

--DD

Off topic, what ever become of your " master cylinder" tread?
This is where you wanted to retread one of the ports on the M/C.
Did you have success or?

thanks dave will look
cjl

HalfMoon,
That relay is J 13 and is called the fresh air blower relay, but is really just a power relay. Mine was intermittent and drove me crazy until I cleaned both the sockets and the relay prongs. If it acts up again, if you already cleaned the sockets and prongs, try slightly spreading the prongs a bit. Makes for a tighter electrical connection.
Tom

ok I am not a very smart man - am I looking in the cabin at the fuses just forward of my left knee and shin when I am driving (I don't see any relays there -do I have to remove something to see it) or am I looking at the relay board under the plastic cover on the drivers side in the engine compartment?
and once I locate it, I can swap out one from the headlight motors to test?
Haynes shows a relay plate (what I think is in the engine compartment) and the fuse box relays (which is what I think I am looking for but have no idea where it is)
tia
cjl

wait a minute I think I see them like somebody said earlier in this thread or another ABOVE the fuse panel
I see two outboard larger screw heads 1 looks to be original cheese head & 1 phillips with a domed head (obviously a replacement) and two smaller inboard screws both phillips I assume since the outboard screws are mismatched those are the ones i need to remove?
cjl

Yes, those. The whole thing will hang down by the wiring harness when you do that; the relays are on the top side of it.

--DD