Man I am rusty with this stuff these days....what rotors worked with the vented and non-vented Volvo 240 calipers?

Yes you can installed this brake vented discs on the 914er with 5Lug
Am I doing now. You see here. Kerscher Break disc 4 Lug with Brake Calipers from the 911 . The hole spacing by the Caliper is 76mm
On Thursday this Week build the parts in my 14er one then I know more.

Click to view attachment

All you need is the calipers from the 911 or BMW 320i

You understand me?

Yes, but 76mm is = to 2.995 or 3 inches which is the bolt spacing for a 914, a 911 is 3.5" so this should work for stock those in your picture look like stock callipers for 914 from Eric Shea of PMB performance ini Sandy, Utah correct?
-thanks for sharing the link and giving some great information from Germany!! also share some pictures when you get a chance as you are completing your project!

Phil Wagner

mostly yes ...

Ok the older calipers from the 911 also have a hole spacing of 76mm and therefore fit to the 914th
They are the same as the 914/6.

I will continue to report when I'm done with the conversion

usually is better than not at all .... I write as good as it gets

I emailed Kerscher and here is what I got in responce...

Hello Mr. Zach,

thanks for your mail.

Up to now we did never check those discs on a 914/4.
We did use only for VW Beetle.
We did sell the discs last week to a customer here in Germany
who did plan to install them in a 914/4.
Problem is discs do not fit with original 914 calipper. Our calipper
we use for Beetle brake does not fit for 914.

I have asked my customer here in Germany to give me some Feedback.
As soon as I have more informations I come back to you.

regards
Emmi


Kerscher Tuning GmbH
Eggenfeldener Str. 46a
D-84326 Falkenberg
Tel.++ 49 (0) 8727 96 88 0
Fax ++ 49 (0) 8727 96 88 29

E-Mail: E.Kerscher@Kerscher-Tuning.de
Internet: www.Kerscher.de

German Tuning Group
E-Mail: info.gtg@kerscher.de
Internet: www.germantuning.de


Now as far as the info I have gotten from the web my understanding is that the ghia/beetle spindle is shorter than that of the 914/4. Supposedly the 914 uses the same spindle size of a 412 vw. So the jury is still out weather or not these work for our cars.

So hopefully we can get something going with the billet hub. Plus I like the idea of being able to replace just a rotor and not the entire assembly.

And the added benefit of that huge chunk of aluminum being a heat sink

If someone local had the parts to reverse engineer I'd gladly do this project again, but without having a 914 to use the stuff on I'm reluctant to spend any money for parts I don't have a use for (yet)


I might even have the material to do a prototype but I wouldn't do any production parts, that is a headache for someone else with more $$$ and time (a real shop, not a guy with CNC Bridgeport in his garage!)

Mike,
Eventually, my car will be down at McMark's shop for the installation of the 915 transmission. They are building it right now. Once it is in the car, Mark is going to fabricate the cable shifter system.

You are welcome to reverse engineer from my 5 lug AL hubs. As I said, these were just drilled and tapped for studs and they loosen up unless the wheels are holding them in place. That is the only thing I would engineer out of them. I believe mine use 914-6 rotors and I know it uses Alpha Romeo GTV-6 Aluminum calipers... So I have a very significant unsprung weight reduction in the front.

Just thinking out loud here, but the stock hub is just a solid piece of metal right? why couldn't we cut the rotor section off and machine the back of the hub to accept 911 rotors? Is this possible, or am I completely out of wack here?

The axle hub from the 914er can not be too short because the brake discs are from beetles and 411/412 is the same. But I'll see it on Thursday ..

I will be looking forward to see how these fit on your car. I have a question for you, what year is your 914?

its not solid...that would be crazy heavy.

rich

I would lean towards the use of some 'standard' aftermarket rotor and possibly caliper arrangement...less expensive, easy to find, and possibly lighter.

cm

The "hub/spindle" is connected to the brake disk by the "bell" or bowl shaped portion.

My suggestion above was to cut off the disk (leaving some tabs) and bolt the wilwood rotor on.
The stock piece is not a good candidate because if you cut off the disk and leave tabs, there is very little material thickness left where the tabs would meet the "bell".

Plus what caliper you want to use would govern the required offset of the bolt-on rotor wrt the wheel mating surface.
I would prefer the 914 caliper with the spacers to accommodate the vented rotors (essentially a 914-6 caliper?)

I with you on the rotor part. Rockauto is filled with cheap great calipers for cheap.

Some decent calipers include...

Cadillac cts-v 05-07
Acura TL and RL
Turbo rx7 88-91
Volvo v70r and s60r
Toyota trucks 79-84

These listed are all 4 piston calipers. The acura RL is interesting because it has a top bolt mount that I really like. Of course all these calipers used rotor of all different diameters and thickness. But that is why I think it would be cool to set a hub up for a wilwood rotor with like their 8 x 7 pattern. Then you could choose a caliper and rotor combo that works best for what you want/need.

Really interested in doing a 5 bolt from this configuration IF the rotors can be done for it.

good Morning

My car is built in 1970

I was afraid you were going to say that. From what I can tell the early cars were different. Auto Atlanta sells two different hub assemblies for the 914/4. One for the 70 and 71 and then another for the 73 and up. I'm no guru, so I don't know what the exact difference is. But, it may very well be the case that the kerscher hubs/rotors will fit your car and not mine.

Yes there is a difference between the models to 72 and the later models
The later models have a centering on the brake disc. the elderly not.
unimportant for the installation of the disks Kerscher
Here in the German forum, we currently have the discusion whether the conversion works in both models

For the older models such as mine must be a distance of 5 mm plate for the brake calipers (Ventet Brake disc) In the later is supposed to be different.
I will inform about the conversion ..

I dig the Wilwood stuff...those 4-piston Dynalite calipers are very nice.
I wonder, though, if bolt patterns could be matched using a cut off 914 hub. I've got a couple old hubs from a '76 to look at. Naturally, there are other options we haven't thought of yet.
I have a feeling the aluminum hubs will be the most desirable.

I just witnessed the difference first hand when I attempted to install "early" rotors on a "late" spindle assembly.

Everything seemed fine right up until you go to put the caliper on.
The offset of the disk centerline from the inner bearing seating surface is different and the caliper will not slide into position.

So it is likely possible to get a hub design that is common for both models, BUT requires a final step of customization.

With a common Aluminum hub design the final steps would be to:
1 - Bore down to the correct depths for both the inner & outer bearing race seating surfaces (early vs late spindle)
2 - Drill for 4 vs 5 lugs and press in studs from the back or install inserts

I think your early/late mounting difference is mostly in the caliper. For the hub, I think the only difference might be the wheel centering 'ring' on the late ones.

If the drawings can't be found, I have a set of these machined hubs sitting on my shelf. I took them off when I took my car to get inspected by the TUV and never put them back on. Someone could borrow one of them to get pertinent measurements.

If mike mueller is interested in using these to draw up plans to post up here, I will pay the shipping from you to mike and back.

Today I have installed the Kerscher front brake

So here's the summary of the installation

1. Kerscher wheels fit plug and play

2. Original wheel bearings installed. Beetles and 914 have the same wheel bearing.

3. The washer from 14er (the outside between the wheel bearing and clamping screw comes) from Bearing Kit beetle does not fit properly.
So the original disk used by the 14er. Same dimensions only the groove is shorter. The wheel bearing screw is just under 1mm further out but is fully supported on the thread.

4. Dust sheets must be reduced because the brake disc 5 mm is more inward. The brake disc schleifft so on dust sheet. Since I'm gonna still looking for alternatives.

5. Caliper (911 or 914/6) with 76mm hole spacing to fit
Approx 4-5mm spacer rings must be backed so that the saddle again running in the center of the disc between the brake caliper and receptacle.
These spacers are also important so that there is enough space between caliper and rim. Although not without grinding rings but this is very closely at the ATS.

6. The brake lines can be taken.

7. The original dust caps for the wheel bearing adjust.

The install is very Easy.

Click to view attachment

Click to view attachment

Washer must be installed. The Axle strud ist not too short..Look here
Click to view attachment

Nice write up.

911 dust shields might be adaptable. they have a different hole pattern but you may be able to redrill them.

Looks good. Sorry I had my doubts. If the billet hub get no traction, I'm going to order some.

I would not even think about pursuing the billet hubs.
They will certainly cost more and they wont be this easy.

rich

Anybody try this in here in the states yet ?

I wonder what those things weigh. Seems like stock rotors are around 15 lbs.

If you guys need a Machine Shop in Arizona,call Precision Research 480-926-2127.They do lots of work on WWII Aircraft,Race-cars, ect. It will not be cheep but you get what you pay for.