My chassis wire harness is garbage. Recently the wires have started to disintegrate and I have shorts everywhere. When I fix one spot somewhere else fails, and I have to band-aid more crap. I am starting to worry about my car catching fire, and I'm tired of it.

My car is a 74 with a carbed v8. I'm not thrilled about the prospect of buying a used 40yo harness either.

My question is have any of you out there installed a painless/universal chassis harness in your cars?

If so how did you wire the dimmer/light switch/pop up headlights and 2 speed wipers?

What problems did you come across, and what fix it?



Thanks
Zach

Hi Zach,
What is causing the brittle conditions? Car outside? Love to see a picture of your sled

There is a guy on ebay that has a good portion of the factory stripes on hand. I would, and will need to myself someday, rebuild the factory harness per spec and add in a few for the Nissan engine and gauges, power windows & locks, extra lights and stuff.
I've already added relays for the headlights and starter to get the current out of the switches.
I also bought a couple of blade fuse boxes to update that and will run the rear wires thru the driver long instead of over to the middle of the car and back in front of the engine.

I have owned the car for 17 years. I bought it when I was 18, so it has had to be parked outside for various reasons over the years. Now that Im old and own a house it lives in a proper garage.

I really want to put in something new as far as the wiring is concerened. The car is for the most part a race car, I only want the bar bones functions. Lights, turn signals, brake lights, wipers, gauges, engine, ect..

Im sure someone out there has put a universal wire harness in one of these cars.

I wired a 36 ford at work with a painless kit and it was easy. But the kit was set up for a gm ignition switch, single speed wipers and a gm headlight switch, no pop up lights.

So some problems will arise with universal harness, but I think they can be worked around.

These cars are old, and getting older and the options are thin.

A universal harness has no chance of working. The factory harness has around 170 circuits. Your best bet at this juncture would be to have a new custom harness built. There is that guy in the Netherands that may have them available. About $3K.

I second Jeffs recommendation, but if the only two issues you can currently think of are the pop up lights and the wipers, I think the GT headlight setup is a manual lift, and that narrows your potential problem down to just wipers.

I have seen pictures of the GT manual headlights, super cool. I would love to do that.

Jeff, just curious what about a universal harness wont work? I can install a gm ignition switch in the dash, or just a push start button. All the seat belt warnings and interior lams and all that minor garbage I don't want.

so really all I need is...

Lights
Starter
Ignition
Wiper
Hazards
Brake
Turn signal
Fuel pump
Gauges
Alternator

Why is this impossible?

Its pretty simple. Study the factory wiring schematics then compare them to the universal kits. Its apples and oranges, nothing fits and the universal kits are not complete.

Then think about how to connect things - are you using the original factory switches, relay board? You already mentioned using a GM ignition switch. Ugh.

Anything can be forced fit to make it work out of necessity, but there will be sacrifices - in quality, reliability and performance. Once you put in something like that is an obvious kluge job, think for one second about what that does to your resale value and who can maintain it.

Resale is of no concern whatsoever to me, and I do all my own work so got that covered.

Thousands of people, myself included have used a painless wiring kit. I would hardly call that set up a "kluge" job as you called it.

Lot of very beautiful installs with that kit in hot rods all over the world.

I probably wouldn't use a single factory switch if I didn't have to. I like the idea of being able to go to any parts store in america and buy the parts I need for my car.

I don't see any problem with using a universal harness kit. Most people seem to be against them because of the hack installs; there are tons of excellent installs as you noted.

The biggest thing is getting a timer relay to move the headlight motors which shouldn't be too hard (caveat: I've never looked for an automotive one but industrial ones are pretty easy to find).

I'm planning on rewiring my car using an InfinityWire kit because I got a great deal on a used one. It'll be a little easier since the headlight motor timing can just be added to the control logic.

http://infinitybox.com/

Wow, why have I never seen this infinity box before? This looks awesome. Guess I have some reading to do. That sound like it could be a slic option.

I am not trying to upset anyone here on the board. Its funny because I think that most v8 914 guys are hot rodders, and most of the air cooled guys are porsche people. Sometimes we get our wires crossed(no pun intended...lol). At our car loving cores we are fundamentally different folks. I would prefer if evey part in my porsche was replaced with a/c delco, motorcraft, or mopar . I understant that that the thought of those parts in a 914 would make many here very queezy.... lol and thats fine just understand that we are different and have different goals.

My sentiment entirely. For the car I'm building at the moment I'm going to use one of these http://bluewireautomotive.com/products/20-...es-wire-harness as the existing loom is a shambles. Headlights will have a GT kit.

Agreed. And appreciate the recognition of different perspectives.

The 914 can be a hot rodders car...so more power to ya...

Be sure to post details and photos of how it all works out for you.

Sounds like what we need to do is just make a new harness coping the old one.. Just need to source the connectors and should be straight forward. I would have consider making a few of them.

I bought a complete and unmolested chassis harness from a dismantler for $150 ...

Why the all or nothing approach? Keep or restore the headlight wires, the motors run off 1 fuse. The column plugs will be tricky but just about everything else is 1/4" connector.
Does Painless include engine to gauges wiring?

Jeff, your talking about this guy right? Deep pocket stuff, but lovely none the less

http://www.kroonwireharnesses.com

With the universal harness, if it means that the OP has a grin on his face while and not worried about Whispy white smoke making an appearance, then why not

It can be done. Not easy but can be done. The biggest challenge are the turn signals and brake lights. The 914 separates these into their own circuits and the universal kits have a turn/brake light common circuit. The control for which is part of the turn signal stalk. They actually run the brake light circuit into the stalk to cut off from the turn when the stalk is rotated.

I would need to study the 914 stalk diagram to determine if it could be used or modified to work. It might be easier to keep the 914 turn signal circuit in place and graft it into the universal kit.

Anything can be done with enough knowledge...

I believe member fasthonda put in an 8 circuit universal wiring harness in his S2000 swapped car:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=97897


The car is actually still for sale here: http://fasthonda.blogspot.com/2015/12/fasthonda-garage.html

Not much info on this in the Porsche world. All Porsche technicians will recommend a used factory harness. But if you do a search of Samba you can see several examples of people installing various universal kits for bugs and buses from places like American Autowire, Ron Francis, and Rebel Wiring. If you don't need to keep your factory switches it makes things a lot easier. Good luck whatever you decide.

Guys, send us the specifics of what you'd need in a configuration for a 914. You can email that to sales@infinitybox.com. We have a standard configuration that is designed for rear/mid-engine cars. You can see that here. We can easily create a 914 configuration.

Jay Harris
Infinitybox

I will try to address everyone here...

Chris914n6- So why the all or nothing approach? I don't want to do anymore patch work.

SixerJ- kroon wire is too much$$$ And as Jeff said the stock wiring has 170 circuits, way way way too much junk wiring. I just want basic functions and the peace of mind that my car wont turn into a fireball.

Mike Bellis- I see what you mean. I would probably get rid of all the junk on the column and use a toggle switch for signals like renegade did with the 914 v8 6 speed car they built. I think renegade used an aftermarket harness in that car as well, hence the pop up headlight were deleted. I would like to keep the pop up lights, maybe rig up a GT manual set up.

matthepcat- Thank you for posting this honda car. I am curious why the car is stated to not have working headlights. I would like to find out why this owner decided no to try to make them function.

Cory M-I saw on samba various cars and buses that were wired just like you said. I would like to get rid of all the porsche switches in the electrical system.

Downunderman- That blue wire kit looks really nice to me. Looks like the most complete kit I have seen for sale as far as universal parts go.

Not exactly answering directly what you're asking but...

I ditched me harness last year during my build; there is not a single redeemable quality any 45+ year-old electrical harness can offer. I chose to have mine built from scratch as opposed to using an off-the-shelf universal kit.

The upside is I have near flawless system that is personalized to my need. I also have not had a single issue with any electrical component. I designed the circuitry/schematic and layout around my car (mostly a race car) and wouldn't have done it any other way if I were ever crazy enough to do this (once) again!

You can do it...

Tony

OK infinitybox just got a big +++ from me. Now I'm even more tempted to go that direction. I always think it is really cool when a large company joins a forum to try to help guys like us out. That is really cool Jay, thanks.

Tony, got any build pics of your wiring? Really interested in seeing that.

While I work really slowly and haven't gotten to the install point, I have asked Jay a ton of questions through their website and he's always answered very promptly and been very helpful. The components look well built and feel very high quality as well.

Reading up on the infinity box. Very cool stuff but the $$$ may be a bit big for my purposes. If I had a fuel injected ls1 v8 and a pile of cash I would be all in.

A fellow 914 owner PM'd me about his set up and he did use a universal style harness and got the head lights to pop up correctly too. I am gathering info and will post what I find.

Not your solution...just another approach. Here you go Zach.

Tony

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Wow Tony, that is seriously spectacular work. Truly stunning craftsmanship. That's what I want!!!! Did you by chance build 2 of everything? lol

I suggest reaching out to fasthonda to get more details on his 8 circuit harness:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=1544

He is still active here and I suspect he did not integrate the headlights because it was built to be a track car.


Good luck,

Matt

Thank you Zach...only made one set and hopefully never again! Matt has a good idea - reach out to FH and pick hi brain. All the best!

Tony

I've helped with one and will do another pretty soon the headlights are really no trouble, but did add a relay with a set of form C contacts.

Bob

...should've known Bob had this down pat!

T

This from c contact? So is this like a monetary relay that switches polarity? Something like this maybe? 12 v dpdt switch rado shack # 2750043Click to view attachment

or is it something like this?
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A simple DPDT relay can operate the pop up lights. They need a ht signal to go up and another to go down. Very simple to do if you have the skills.

A momentary on off on toggle switch can do it. Piece of cake.

momentary might not work. The factory wires are constant. You would need to try it.

I think im going to have to bring my power probe home from work and test the stock functions of the headlights out and go from there.

Zach,
please keep me in the loop on your solution to this...very interested in doing a simpler wiring harness.

Mike B. does make some good points about the stock turn signal adaption that would be needed. I understand that you would rather replace the turn signal stock. Me, I would like to mend the two together to keep the stock look. Would be very helpful if Mike B. would put his electrical experience to the task.

Dave

I need a harness for my Build-Off Challenge project and had stumbled onto InfinityBox a while back. Based on Jay's post above, I gave him a call and he spent a ton of time educating me on what they do, how they do it and how their product might work for my build.
I'm duly impressed. Great first impression.
So, I think I'll be pulling the trigger on their 20 circuit system.
I'll update my build with the details as I get to it.
Chris

Copy cat!

I am a non-apologetic practicing graduate of the school of "imitation being the sincerest form of flattery". Just ask Tony.

And don't think I wasn't already planning to call you to talk details...