I don't like the looks of this.....

I'll let @McMark chime in if he wants to, lets just say there have been a few "issues" with those fixtures, which has in turn significantly slowed progress on my /6 build ...

I am fully aware of the delays and setbacks that happen when you tackle one of these builds. Of course having to do doing something over (twice) is problematic for progress too.

Sorry guys, it's been a crazy few months. But here's what I've learned since my last post.

Celette has nearly no real support for the 914. The only fully developed fixtures died when they released the MZ Tower setup. There are now only two 914 fixture sets in the Celette inventory: 1 in the US and 1 in Europe. I've seen the US set firsthand and I've seen a copy of the Euro set, and neither set is 100% correct.

This is what I was told when I inquired about ordering an official set for purchase.


So I rented the US set and have it here now. I've attached my Aubergine car and everything seemed to line up really well -- until I got to the shock towers. And it took me awhile to confidently decide that this set is incorrect in the shock tower fixtures. The definitive evidence was that the official US fixture set was indicating that my Aubergine car was essentially perfectly straight at the front A-arm mounts, rear A-arm mounts, rear trailing arm mounts (inner and outer), transmission mounts, BUT the front shock tower needed to go up by 6.5mm and the rear needed to go down by a whopping 16mm. These numbers are HUGE considering that ALL the other fixtures line up and this chassis shows no signs of accident damage. And finally, simply consider what sort of accident it would take to move ONLY the two front shock towers down 1/4" and the rears up over 1/2" without affecting the rest of the suspension alignment. It's impossible.

SO ANYONE WHO HAS ANY SHOP THAT RENTS THE 914 CELETTE FIXTURES MUST BE AWARE THAT THESE FOUR FIXTURES ARE INCORRECT AND SHOULD NOT BE USED.

After all of this roundabout effort and research, I've decided that the only way I can be confident in my Celette bench and fixtures is to build a set myself. I'm using the official US fixture set and my Aubergine car to make my set. I will be using modern technology to document each piece. Each fixture will be made up of multiple smaller pieces which I will have laser cut. Once I have all the building block parts, I'll remove fixtures one by one and assemble the component parts on the bench, in place. I'll then confirm accuracy of my piece before moving on to the next piece. When everything else is done I will document the shock tower fixtures as they are, before making the modifications necessary to make them correct. I know other people are taking a similar approach.

This is certainly not how I, or anyone else, thought this process was going to go. There were a lot of hopeful progress, but in the end these fixtures are too critical for me to accept anything that isn't quite right. In order for me to be fully confident in my work, I need to be fully confident in my fixtures. So I have to make my own, and I have to like how they turn out, before I can move on to Andy's car.

Truly a class act. Andy's car is in good hands and all members in the future will benefit from your hard work and attention to detail if/when the time/need comes.

Good work Mark! What a pain. Maybe you could make your own sets to sell/rent. Maybe just the two defective ones?

Nice research Mark. Guess I am back to building a set too then. I have a rust free straight car to work off of too. Really in most cases a guy doesn't need heavy fixtures designed for withstanding the pulling forces of a collision repair. Most of what we do is related to rust repair and withstanding the pulling forces of a welding process. We all know how our chassis can move around while welding.

Wouldn’t the front towers be the same as the 911 fixtures.
Can you modify the existing fixtures rather than making new ones.

Well, once I build mine and use them I was planning to just ship/bring everything your way. The MZ Towers make building these fixtures relatively easy. But building fixtures from scratch would be a larger endeavor. I know you're certainly up to the task, but just borrow mine when I'm done.




Well, remember these aren't made by Porsche people. So unfortunately, the answer is no. The setup is approached differently (see pics below), and there's no reason to expect that the 'neutral' position of the chassis, over the bench, is the same height or fore/aft location. In fact, just looking at the Celette diagrams I can tell that the 911 chassis will sit closer to the bench than a 914 chassis, which means nothing will interchange.

911 Front Shock Tower
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914 Front Shock Tower
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Cool,

I have rent money waiting. I will be laid up for awhile anyway. Gettin my own fixture installed the end of the month. LMK your projected time line. I have Juergen's car disassembled and ready to bench.

BTW: Need my windshield jig? I can send it to you.

You guys are awesome taking this on. Quality.

Got all the modeling done and got all the plates laser cut from 5/8" steel. Ordered 20' of 40mm solid steel rod. This stuff is all seriously heavy. I packed half of the steel plate parts into a 12"x6" box, and I could barely pick it up. Definitely confidence inspiring.

I checked all the laser cutting first to make sure bolt holes were going to line up and to make sure I didn't make any other mistakes. One set of plates I made a dumb mistake, and the trailing arm bracket with the three holes didn't quite line up, so I had to fix and reorder those. But the second version came back perfectly. The laser shop also accidentally drilled holes on 2 sets of plates to 12mm instead of 10mm, so I got those redone as well.

I spent all of Sunday and Monday double checking the car on the bench, and then getting started making fixtures. The laser cut plates are working out just like I expected and I've got 4 fixtures made and it's working really well. Each piece has quite a bit of work. The front shock fixtures had to have the large circle piece machined with a specific angle on the outer edge. And the other fixtures pictured are for the two bolts where the steering rack/cover mount. That little ring had to be trimmed from 5/8" plate down to 10mm thick, as well as machined on the ID and OD to size. Oh, and drilling the 12mm pin hole through to 40mm rod is no joke. Those take 10-15m per hole going slow and letting the bit cool periodically.

So far everything has worked out. Each piece or process I make/do is working out. At the risk of sounding self-promotional, it's very satisfying to be able to see the payoff from all these years of experience with various fabrication skills. While these fixtures are fairly simple in appearance, the need for accuracy is where it gets tricky. I was really afraid of drilling the pin hole in the rod. Getting that perfect is terribly challenging. Being off by less than 1° would be make the piece unusable, and it MUST be drilled last.

I've gotta step away from fixtures for a couple days to get an engine test fired with my fuel injection set up, as well as build the bottom end of a 2270 engine. But I'm planning to be back building fixtures on Friday and should have all the critical ones done next week. I need to outsource machining on a couple pieces because my mini-lathe is not big enough to hold the piece. And there are a coupe plates that need to be a specific thickness and flatness. So those will need to go to a surface grinder.

Thanks for all the encouragement. This has been a huge delay and a ton of effort, but I appreciate all the positive comments.


I gotta make my own. I want a full set of Celette and body fixtures on hand here when I'm done.

Amazing stuff Mark!! Mad skills and patience to boot.

It is very cool to see the passion you put into this project. I know it will eventually pay off for you but your time and $$ invested shows your commitment to the 914. Thank you!

One small step for man.......one giant leap for 914s.

I admire your perseverance and attention to detail on this, keep going!

Nice work! Is this one of the fixtures that doesn't fit inspiring this activity?

Amazing. It is comforting to know you will have the right tools for the job, should the need arise. I am sure SirAndy is very very happy too.

It is! The fixture itself is fine, it's just that the pin hole isn't right so the fixture is too low.

Hey Andy, while you're waiting for me to get this done, how about making the site read meta data and rotate pictures. Or at least a button us admins can press to rotate pictures inline...

I have the code all ready and tested, just need to find time to plug it in ...

Nice. Several months back now I approached another shop about renting his stands. I planned on renting Celettes top fixtures. I would have soon found out about their failure. Since Celette scrapped the original fixtures you will have the only correct top fixture set for the new design now.

Nearly done with the fixtures. A bunch of stupid 'normal life' stuff make things take way longer. But the majority of the fixtures are complete. I just have the following remaining:

Rear Shock Towers (designs sent to laser cutting, should be back this week)
Engine Mounts & Rear 'Donuts' (waiting for rear shock towers to be in place first)

Here's a few shots of the inaccurate fixtures. Remember that this car shows no evidence of crash damage and these pictures were taken with the car mounted to the official Celette Fixtures. The front A-Arm mounts (front and rear) and the rear trailing arm mounts (inner and outer), as well as the transmission mounts, were all in place and lined up perfectly 'out of the box'. So there's just no logical way that these gaps should exist.

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And here's some shots of my fixtures:
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Quite impressive!!

Nice work!