Hello all: I'm new to the 914 world and am hoping to add a 2.0 to our garage soon. I have seen references to a VIN page in the forums but can't find it on the site.
Can someone point me in the right direction?
Thanks

Hello. Click the 914 info link up top.

Thanks, found it! Where can I use the VIN to find out how the car was equipped when new?

quick answer: you cant. The vin wont provide any of those details

Well, in actual fact you could use the VIN to acquire my CoA-type of Report which could have almost all the data you want but not including the transmission #. There is a cost of course. Email me.

~ Ok
To clarify, in the U.S. without taking your car to a certified Porsche dealership and paying their princely fee you no longer are able to receive a document (COA) that would provide a supposed list of equipment that car was originally delivered with.
BTW even when it was still possible to purchase that report its accuracy was questionable.

Rich, are you insinuating that I am a wacko and a liar? Whether you are in the USA or anywhere else in the World, I can assist a client to get a Kardex for a Porsche from 1950 through 1969, and a Report for the later cars. Almost 900 so far. My Reports are much the same as the old CoA, but not official since I am not a Factory authorized employee. Still, my Reports contain information not see on the CoA, and my accuracy is well supported by 45 years of research. Perhaps you should try my service rather than disparaging it.

Dave I suggest you cut down on the coffee.
I made no such insinuation, & if Im gonna call someone a liar I wont mince words.
I qualified my statement related to region only because I have no knowledge if PNA does things differently in different countries, not to imply anything related to any service you might provide.
If fact, this it the first that I have been made aware you provide any such service?
Before you loose your shit over a perceived slight you might consider whether the target of your ire is even aware of why you are mad
Do you have an ad here in the members section? Other marketing site? If not, why not?
I guess here is your chance...
If you provide a service that may be valuable to the community... perhaps provide a detailed description (& prices) of what that is, and how to access it.

chill

Hey all! The Bumblebee that I was courting was finally delivered this week, complete with original window sticker, CofA and service records dating back to the 20 mile delivery order. Now the sorting out begins. What I thought would be a short list is getting longer. I'm hoping I don't regret the challenge.
I'll post more in a new thread.
RobClick to view attachment

That is excellent Rob. I am gathering the last bits for a full engine rebuild by Mark Henry for my LE Bumblebee. I'd love to see your WS & CoA. I can get that added to the LE website that documents our great little cars. You can email them to me f you wish. Regards, Dave Pateman

Hi Dave: I was just looking through the forum to find a VIV search engine to check out a 911 I want to buy. Then I saw your request for information on my BB. Did I ever send you that? If not let me know what you would like and if I have it I'd be glad to send it along. Sorry if I mossed it.
PM or email would be best. robkammer16@gmail.com
Rob

Hi Folks. I'm new to this forum and don't currently own a 914, however, I am currently looking at one for sale. I tried to do a Carfax search on the VIN, and it says it requires a 17 digit VIN. Can someone suggest a site to obtain a vehicle history for a 914? Thanks!

David can give you initial/as-delivered info off the Kardex - but he does charge. It won't be a history but it'll show you how it came from the factory. Not sure of his timeline - reach out direct: david_j.pateman@sympatico.ca

I recently ordered a (new) PPS From Porsche NA to see what $125.00 USD buys you.
I was disappointed.
Its little more than a regurgitation of the COA, similar format, same errors but with a new omission: no verified engine #.
Kinda pisses me off. Porsche HAS that information, they DID provided it with the COA.
Now they withhold it to extort a few more $?

So after a couple of cocktails one eve I send off a ill tempered email to the VP of "aftersales" not really expecting anything of it but just an opportunity to vent & provide a opinion on their "Classic" marketing strategy ...some time later I get this response:

Good Afternoon
I hope you are doing well. Thank you for your patience as I gathered information from our Porsche Classic Vehicle Information Specialist. Please see below:

I have verified that we produced a PPS for your noted VIN mid-February. I have reviewed the original build documentation and confirmed the PPS provided is accurate.

The transmission was not recorded at the time of production therefore we cannot list the transmission type on the PPS and indicated information not available.
The MSRP is not recorded (for any vehicle until the late 1990’s-early 2000’s) therefore the MSRP is listed as information not available.
As the PPS is an official record, we do not use external sources or other window stickers for verification of the MSRP. If the information is not recorded at the time of production, it is not included in the Porsche Production Specification. If the customer has the original window sticker for his vehicle indicating the MSRP, he may submit those documents for review to vehicledocumentation@porsche.us to determine if the PPS can be updated to indicate the MSRP.
The vehicle is equipped with option 570 which is “Seat Cushions” per Porsche Germany. This option refers to a change in standard seat cushions (such as comfort equipment).

We cannot provide vehicle information via email for security reasons.

We cannot confirm/deny or provide the engine/transmission numbers.

We do not release the engine/transmission information any longer for the security of owners due to the value of classic vehicles. This is for your security and the security of future buyers, we do not wish to provide information that may lead to any misrepresentation of a vehicle in the future.
We now offer the Classic Technical Certificate (CTC). The CTC includes a 63 point inspection by a Porsche Classic Partner. Beyond the technical inspection, the certificate also includes photos of the vehicle (including the engine/transmission numbers) and original production information (included on the PPS). Based on photos of the engine and transmission in the vehicle, which we obtain from the Porsche Classic Partner, we are able to provide a verification on the CTC if the engine/transmission in the vehicle match our records or if there is no Porsche record (such as the transmission numbers for the 914’s)

Our site does indicate that the engine and transmission serial numbers are not included and information will be included on the PPS when available. This detail is indicated before the process of starting the PPS.

In the spirit of goodwill and appreciation of your loyalty to the Porsche brand, I would like to provide you with a complimentary PPS. If you would like to receive the PPS, could you please verify your mailing in your reply & acknowledgement.

Thank you for contacting Porsche Cars North America and for the opportunity to assist in this matter.

Kind Regards,

Executive Case Specialist
Porsche Cars North America, Inc.
One Porsche Drive, Atlanta, GA 30354

The seat cushion thing was odd. The PPS I received listed "Seat cushions" (plural) as optional equipment.
I thought perhaps it was a upholstery option but apparently not.
Never heard of Option 570, so I dont know how more "comfortable" they could make them?

Rich, Option M570 was a center seat cushion as in 'Comfort Equipment'.

https://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/OpEq.htm

@JeffBowlsby
So Jeff you are indicating that base 914's sold w/o center console would have come with the plastic 2 section tray as standard equipment & that the pad or cushion that fits that tray is the "seat cushions" option being referred to?

Could be, not really sure. That exact description was quoted from German market 914 price lists that I found many years ago. The only source of this info that I have come across.

I also have this 1971 USA-market price list with similar info.

All 914 (4&6) would have as standard equipment a center deposit in front of the gearshift, and a two compartment tray between the seats. Option M570 was a seat cushion that fitted into the tray for a third seating position. Not a comfortable one since it is narrow, loose, and the driver would be working the gearshift possibly between your legs.

Thanks for the confirmation, I learn something about these cars all the time.
Its odd that PCNA doesn't see fit to correct their grammatical error, it only adds to confusion & uncertainty of the "product" they are selling.

So per Daves comment were dealers likely to have removed the deposit boxes (Like the spare alloy wheels)? Or they simply were so shoddily made that they haven't made it the near 5 decades?

i think @davep might be incorrect about the deposit box (under dash in front of gearstick) being standard on all 914s whether 4 or 6.

there is a bit of conflicting info out there.
i've read old threads here where the usual expert types pronounce them as also only being on early 914s pre 1973. that would appear to be not true.

they are listed in the parts manual.
and they are listed as having been updated for particular years of production.
all years of production.

Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

my 74 1.8 has one and has had it from new.
but its not a common thing.
no reason to doubt it was not ordered with the car. its faced with the brown carpet with white streaky threads in it - matches the carpet and brown interior of car - which if i am not mistaken was only in cars post 73.
that would counter ideas it was only an item on early cars (along with the parts cat).

we have collected a fair bit of research examples of the 74 and 75 1.8s and there is an occasional car with the parcel box - as its named in the parts manual.
these have also been very original condition cars.
no reason to doubt they came with the car.
but by far the larger proportion of examples dont have them.
only have the little plastic tray between the seats. often with the cushion but not always.

i believe the parcel box was a tick the box option order.
what the option number was - no idea.
even @JeffBowlsby says his list of option numbers is not complete.
its great he has the information that he has, must have been hard to dig up.

factory sales brochures showing the interiors of base model cars don't show package bins. so i think standard 914 condition was no package bin. you ticked a box for one.
and beyond that you ticked a box for appearance group and got the full console and gauges package. in 74 and 75 you could upspec a 1.8 to have the same console and guages package as the 2.0. what i think was the case was you could not upspec a 73 1.7 to have that. got some fairly trustworthy 73 1.7 on file with the package bin but never the console and gauges. again most 1.7s have neither.

as an aside.

i have often looked at the parcel bin in mine wondering exactly why it is the shape it is.
ie its quite tall and not exactly useful for most things you want to store in a console "bin",

its pretty good for rolling up a puffer jacket and stuffing that in there!

my thought about the original design and purpose is that it suits the shape of a lot of womens shoulder bags in the 1970s and that is what it was for?

snooped around in my files which are mostly re 74 Ljet.
but i collected examples either side - 73 1.7 s and 75 1.8 s.

here are two 1,7 examples with the parcel box as porsche called it.

1.

Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment


2.
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

its much more common in 73 1.7s than later 1.8s from 74 on.
a couple of good reasons for that i think.
you could not order the console and gauges that went into the 73 2.0 for the 73 1.7.
as far as i can work out no 73 1.7 ever got the top spec gauge console.
instead the parcel box was what you got when you went full spec on a 1.7.
the american sales sheets refer to it as a console in these 1.7 cars.
one sales sheet lists it as a No Cost option and implies it is part of appearance group 1.7.
the other lists it as an $18.00 charge option. (sort of implies not part of appearance group standard package for that particular car but ordered as a distinct option by the customer? )
but no M-Code for it.

I suspect that a full M code list for the 914 will be hard to find.
it would have been a document held by the VW-Porsche GMBH organisation rather than porsche itself? i know some of the M-Codes on the 914/4 are shared with the VW 411/412. so they are VW M-Codes not Porsche ones.

in 74 (and 75) it was a different story for the 1.8s.
they could be real strippers or they could go full appearance group.
that included the guages and console that went in the 2.0L as well.
@StarBear has one. from factory that way.
thats where the 1.8s are different from the 1.7s.
i think most people after the non stripper type car would have ticked the 1.8 appearance group box and got the full gauge and black vinyl console.
ticking the box for the parcel box would have become far less common. it would have been something you built up from a base model car.
same went for 75.

but according to PET you could still get the parcel bin.

i'll dig around further in my files for the 74 and 75 info.
but its a much rarer thing in those years.

i have one in my car but its unusual in other ways too.
its not appearance group spec like @StarBear s.
but it does have sway bars (factory fitted) and the bin.
but still has star steelies and not alloys.
it was ordered a very particular way.

i would speculate the following (with reasonable basis) for that package bin - so called "console".

for the 4s.

its a standard part of appearance group package for 70 thru 72 4cyl cars.
base 914s don't have it but you could order one as an option to base car.

-------

for 73 its included in appearance group 1.7 cars.
base 1.7 s don't get it. but it can be an option.
the appearance group 2.0 for 73 gets the full console and gauges.
base 2.0 s don't get the bin but can be an option.
the reason that the 1.7s never got the guage option was the engine did not come to the assembly line with the sump plate sender. having a temp guage in a 1.7 was not a factory consideration at that stage.
------

for 74 the guages and console are the standard inclusion for both appearance group 1.8s and 2.0s.
the base 1.8s and base 2.0s do not get the bin. but its an option if ticked.
the strategy changes in 74 and there is a 1.8 engine that came to the assembly line with a sump plate sender. its identified with a paint stamp number.
all 2.0s had the sump plate sender no matter what as they all had a temp guage,
either in main instrument cluster or in console.
74 is the first time the factory offers a temp guage in the base engined car as a possibility.

---------

for 75 - as per 74.

----------

for 76. all 914s are 2.0 fully kitted as appearance group with guages and console.

---------

dunno what applies for the 6s.
but am guessing its as per the 4s of those years.
there is a base car. no bin.
the full spec car has the bin.
but its an option for the base cars.

I'm still processing the above, but here are a couple of other fun facts to ponder:

The 1971 wiring schematic includes an oil temp sender circuit on the ignition harness and the original ignition harnesses have this circuit. The 1970 and 1972 do not. My thinking is that a separate wire directly connected the 1971 ignition harness to a sump mounted oil temp sender. Unlike the later 73-76 cars with the circuitry in the main chassis harness.

The 1973-76 cars have the center console gauge harness connections in the main chassis harness under the carpet, the 1970-72 cars do not.

thats pretty interesting stuff.

hints at something i came across when researching the EC engines of 74.
it was in the emissions legislation historical material i stumbled on.
not that i am an historian of the usa epa.

but around about 72 all the USA domestic manufacturers and the main import vehicle makers (VW being a big player) sat down with the EPA to discuss the timing in play as a result of the Nixon Clean Air Act of 1970. the hiccup was going to be the proposed deadline for the introduction of catalysers. this had been set at 1975 model year.
it was agreed to move it one year to 1976. there were concerns that not enough platinum could be manufactured to ensure there were sufficient cats for USA wide car production.

As a side note California was always one model year in front of the EPA standards introduction. This was agreed to in 1970 for the same reasons. to allow for phasing of manufacture and supply logistics. hence california was to have had cats in 74. they still went ahead with unleaded phasing in on schedule but not the cats.

it struck me there was a possibility that the EC engine with L jet was originally intended for 1973 but was as a result delayed until 1974. they kept running with the D jets for 1973 in the 1.7s. the result in california was the unleaded 1.7 with the 73 (or 70) hp engine which was very weak. i still ponder that weird notation of the 1.8 engines in 1974. where the california engine is the EC-A and the USA engine is the EC-B. they reverse their notation from 1973 in a funny way. and in 75 they reverse it back again on the EC engines. it almost suggests that somehow it might have been that in 73 they might have been going with EA engines for USA 49 states and the EC 1.8 engine for california. like maybe a phased engine introduction. but they held back and just detuned the 1.7 D jet for california. you would need access to the factory archives to get to the bottom of it. but there is something there.

its almost like the wiring harnesses you are describing for the 73 cars were in anticipation for the L jet 1.8 variations that were available in 74 and were in the pipeline and incorporated into the body during production regardless. but a last minute decision was made on the engines to the contrary.

i'll dig around more in my L jet files to find any other package bin fitted cars i came across in 74 and 75. i've ended up with about 80 74 cars on file from the L jet research. i was tracking those painted engine stamp numbers.

what i found is the L jets for USA definitely only had 4 of those painted stamp numbers.
they corresponded to whether the cars were california or USA epa markets and whether they were fitted with the sump plate sender and engine wiring for the sender.

the same patter repeated in 1975. ended up finding all 4 of the numbers for the 75 L jet.
same pattern associated with the 4 numbers as in 1974.

i looked for it in the 73s. only two numbers. never came across a 73 1.7 that was fitted with guages and was what i considered trustworthy as an example. ie its sales docket data corresponded to its present condition.

another little thing i noticed is just about every 1.8, whether 74 or 75 i found has vinyl on the targa bar originally. (again using trustworthy examples). there seemed to be no 1.8s without the vinyl. there are some now of course but they were all repainted/restored cars. this was whether a base 1.8 or an appearance group 1.8.
i'm strictly referring to USA market cars here. there were vinyl targa bar deletes in Europe. the 74 1.8 in the porsche museum is a no vinyl 1.8, but thats also an AN twin carb euro engine car.

in 73 you could get a base 1.7 without vinyl targa bar and you seemed to get the vinyl with the appearance group. you could also get the 2.0 the same way.

most of the trustworthy 2.0s i have come across with the research seemed to have vinyl targas in 74 and 75 - whether appearance group or not. apart from the LEs.

that was a pattern i could see in all the examples we found for L jet research around the 73 to 75 model years.

not saying this is 100% accurate. there could well be examples existing that discount the pattern i have seen from the examples collected on file. but......its what i am seeing in the material i did collect.

As another little bit of info.
we did find one 74 L jet that was retrofitted with guages and console post production line and the fitment was done by the dealer to utilise the inbuilt wiring in the chassis harness.

the fitment was done at the dealer pre shipment. all the paperwork with the car when it was for sale on BAT about 8 years back showed it clearly that it had been fitted by the dealer.

it was quite unusual as it did not use the sump plate and sender fitted to the factory made cars with the console and guages. instead it was a sender inserted into the oil pressure sensor/sender on top of the engine. i suspect the reason was that it is actually a little difficult to replicate the factory wiring from the sump sender to the top of the engine without dropping the engine. the dealer probably did not wish to do that much work.

the guages are also interesting as they are not factory VDO guages. they are another type fitted into the console. it all appeared to be original to the car from new at the dealer. it was a very original excellent condition car.

my conclusion was that dealers could do the console guages addition as a plug and play easily as all the wiring was there for it all the way to the dashboard. including the sump plate and sender in all the 2.0 engine cars. but it was not such an easy plug and play for the dealers in the 1.8s. hence most of the 1.8s with the console and guages were a factory production line order item to get the sump plate and engine wiring.

the thing about the 71 cars is interesting.
not sure what that indicates.

but the lack of chassis wiring in 70 to 72 makes sense.
the cars coming out of karmann were only 4 cyl cars.
the premium 2.0 was the porsche 6 and they were kind of seperate.
with semi offsite production line going on.
and all the 6s had a temp guage.
how was the temp guage wiring incorporated for the 6 from 70-72?
but does not explain 71.

after the 6 gets canned the 2.0 4 becomes the premium engined car.
but its totally made at karmann. no further porsche production line involvement.
so for the first time a car with a temp guage is coming out of karmann factory?
makes sense they would rationalise the chassis harness down to one item no matter what.?

maybe they were considering a temp guage for the 4 in 71 as part of appearance group.
i guess the question is did any 4s ever come with the temp guage in the main instrument cluster during 70 to 72 when they were all 1.7s.
my files don't extend to looking into anything much pre 73 models.


the one other thing i can think of re 71 is that they were still at that stage gearing up for more ambitious production. they were definitely going to do a rhd version for 72. it was advertised in the australian press and potential buyers were notified. (i think the twin adjustable seats of 72 is a vestige of that plan before it was cancelled?).

in 71 all sorts of hard nosed decisions would have been being made as the 914/4 was not as successful as hoped in all the markets outside the USA and germany. it was a total bomb in the UK for instance. the other main markets for rhd were japan and australia.
chicken feed. probably quite a few things were being readied in 71 that never eventuated in plans for the 72 model year? dunno if that explains the temp wiring in 71.
but they would have been in a scramble canning the future of the 6 and altering strategy fast to develope the 2.0 L four.

@JeffBowlsby

this was the one and only 74 1.8 that had clear documented evidence of a dealer installed console and gauges (what you call plug and play installation).

you can find it on BAT if you keep on scrolling way back in time.
its right back at the start of the BAT auctions about 8-10 years ago.
(a stunningly original and excellent original condition car, wonder who owns it now,
its never come up for sale again).

Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

the rest of the 74 1.8 console/gauge cars i have on file, and its quite a few correspond to factory installation in 2.0L cars and quite a few of those i had the window sheet document for which list the console/gauge as part of appearance group (ie already in car and factory installed/ordered?).

and i trawled the files on the 74 1.8 s.
79 examples on file.

all have vinyl targa bars except one.

this one.
you can also find it on BAT.
its a very poor condition 1.8 but suprisingly intact.
however it showed evidence of an earlier respray in factory original color.
rear badges missing and fixing holes filled.
overspray on black plastic cowl intact grill.
and when you looked at targa bar there were holes on lhs side for lower targa chrome trim.

my guess is it had the original vinyl stripped off.

Click to view attachment

i did not turn up a single other 74 1.8 (USA car) without the vinyl.
not saying there were not any, but i did not come across any others in 3 years of collecting examples for L jet files.

i will go back through files again as i am sure there was one other 1.8 i found with the parcel bin besides mine. i know the parcel bin was there from the start in mine.
either dealer installed or factory as i have the lhd drive carpets still and the section under the bin was unfaded and factory fresh. the brown carpets notoriously fade and the tunnle section of mine was the usual faded color where it was exposed to direct UV.

@JeffBowlsby .
here is some stuff i isolated out a year or so back when i was looking into the targa bar - vinyl question re 74 and 75 base 1.8s. found where i put them in a file.

sales brochures from 75.

German market brochure.

Click to view attachment

UK market brochure.

Click to view attachment

French brochure

Click to view attachment

all three brochures use the same photo.
and its a base 1.8 in classic stripper form with no vinyl for european market.


.....and here is the USA brochure from the same year.
almost identical brochure with the rest of photos like european ones.
but not the car for this particular shot and page in the brochure.

Click to view attachment

its a vinyl clad targa bar.
but look carefully, the models are the same people dressed the same.
and seem to be out on the same day in a close by location to where they other shot was taken.
it could be they are using an american market car for the shoot.
or it could be the same red euro spec car and the photo has been airbrushed and worked over. (i say this because they did do a work over on the 74 brochure for the USA version and simply airbrushed in the warts - and got them looking not quite right when they did it, made the warts too small. - i can dig that brochure up as well from files).

but they sure went to a bit of trouble to have a different brochure for the USA in 75 and they show no cars with any painted targas. all with vinyl.

I'm thinking every USA car for 75 at minimum had a vinyl targa.
and i'm pretty sure it was the same for 74.

not sure every 1.8 in 74 or 75 for europe was without the vinyl but its possible.
very hard to find out as so few examples of original euro spec 1.8s are out there.
but the couple i have found from old sales ads were all painted targa bars.

and here is the other one from the 75 brochure.

UK, France, Germany all have this shot.

Click to view attachment


and same page from USA brochure (otherwise very similar).

Click to view attachment

can't tell if its the same car and same photo but simply airbrushed to make the 1.8 differently portrayed for USA market or they actually rolled a US spec car into exactly the correct position. if they did roll another car in for the shot they were bloody good, very precise. (they add the warts in on both cars too, or vice versa, used american spec cars and airbrushed warts and vinyl targa out as well as changed the white black interior to white - who knows. but i don;t think its two different stagings of the same shot with different cars).

anyway they sure are distinguishing the 1.8s differently in the sales material.
dunno if it proves anything but it matches what i built up in the 1.8 L jet files.

Checking a few archives:

The center gauge console was first offered for the 1973 2.0L and only the 2.0L. I am sure a dealer could get the needed parts and install it in any 914 as has been done many times over the years. See page 19.
https://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/zMan_1973_S...iningManual.pdf

The targa vinyl became standard on all 914s (except the USA LE cars and apparently the 1.8L ROW market cars) beginning with the 1974 model year. Interestingly (to me anyway) the 1974 914GT (German market LE) had the vinyl, yet the 914SL (Japan market) did not. Its my understanding that Porsche designers wanted to make these limited edition cars in their various markets, be stylistically different from the standard model year cars. See page 5.
https://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/zMan_1974_2...iningManual.pdf

Going back to the center cushion questions..

Does anyone know if when the cushion was added to a car, did it count as
a third seat and that provoke the center seat belt to be added and the
change of the foil sticker that says Seating Positions 2, to Seating Positions 2+1.??

Per my OG post my PPS just showed "Seat cushions" under optional equipment, no mention of additional seatbelts as well .
Perhaps Jeff has some info related to a option code for those?

Center seatbelts were optional equipment M166 (US cars) and M186 (ROW cars)

https://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/OpEq.htm

Does anyone have an idea of how many cars were optioned with the center seat belt.??
And I suppose it would show up on a COA..??

makes sense re german market GT.
from the few genuine euro market 1.8s i have dug up all were no vinyl.
even one 75 that had a gauge/console.
almost as if german or european taste was headed towards back trim and no vinyl and away from chrome at that time. divergent from USA taste.

thanks for confirming my file info on the 74 on USA 1.8s

i used to know an old german VW mechanic here who i think is still alive.
its been years since i have seen his 2 914s but i believe he still has them.
one was a last of the line german 75 2.0
i can recall it well. no vinyl targa bar. but it had guages and console.
it was an original car in excellent condition that he inported in to aus from germany way back. late 70s or early 80s i recall.
i should go out and see him before its too late and see if can get some photos of it.

never seen an example.
none in all the L jet cars i trawled through.

don't recall seeing attachment points either when i last had interior of mine out 4 or 5 years back. maybe they were there but i sure didn't notice them.

was the 914 ever officially a three seater for USA DOT certification.
from memory the tyre pressure sticker on the gas tank of my 74 914 notes "Seating Positions 2".

From what I understand the center belt was only offered on early cars.

The 2+1 seating sticker has been shown in another thread..

Click to view attachment

Center seatbelts were available for all cars from at least 1971-on. Per the link above.

I’ve only seen center belts in early cars and my understanding is that only early cars had the welded mount for them. The center belt that I just sold came from an early ‘70 that I parted out and cut up. It was a one owner car (before me) but too far gone to repair. Some neat first year only details on that car. Metal round relays, two piece door cards, etc. u would have liked to save it but besides the normal east coast rust, there were panels that couldn’t easily be repaired. The front shock towers were rusted out.

The interesting thing was the original owner drove the car to work in the same town where I grew up. I even rode my bike past his workplace parking lot when I was training. Bought his car 35 years later.

good to know. did not think i was imagining there were no mounts for those belts in my 74.

interesting how that sticker changes from the 70-72 cars and is 2 seat only from 73 on.
that had to have been a DOT thing.
i think i know why. had to bone up on 73 1.7s. checked the ones in my file.
seat belt interlock relay. somehow i thought that came in with 74s, but i see its got the interlock light on the dashboard of the 73 1.7s i have on file.
it would have been a horror to incorporate the seat belt interlock into the removable seat cushion of the so called third seat. bad enough it was hooked up to two seats. throw something down on the cushion or even lean on with your elbow and the whole buzzer bs ignition no no shebang would have gone off.

@JeffBowlsby -i think whatever the option sheet data might have said about it being an option for all cars all years might have been thrown out the window in the USA after 72 due to DOT interlock design rules.

@JeffBowlsby -i think whatever the option sheet data might have said about it being an option for all cars all years might have been thrown out the window in the USA after 72 due to DOT interlock design rules.
[/quote]

I dunno. The center seat belt mounting brackets can be bolted thru the seatbelt receiver bolts on the later cars. I had it that way in my 74 for awhile. No issues. The price sheets I documented were German market cars...maybe the center seat issue did not apply there?

In 73 it was a "Seatbelt Warning System". Just a dumb 'sit on the passenger seat without being buckled up, and the dash light lights, and a buzzer sounds'.

74-76 it was the "Seatbelt interlock system" that disables the car from starting if not buckled up.

The center seatbelt had no sensors, it was just a convenience for when your honey wanted to snuggle up.

[quote name='JeffBowlsby' date='Apr 3 2024, 10:16 PM' post='3137748']
@JeffBowlsby -i think whatever the option sheet data might have said about it being an option for all cars all years might have been thrown out the window in the USA after 72 due to DOT interlock design rules.
[/quote]

I dunno. The center seat belt mounting brackets can be bolted thru the seatbelt receiver bolts on the later cars. I had it that way in my 74 for awhile. No issues. The price sheets I documented were German market cars...maybe the center seat issue did not apply there?

In 73 it was a "Seatbelt Warning System". Just a dumb 'sit on the passenger seat without being buckled up, and the dash light lights, and a buzzer sounds'.

74-76 it was the "Seatbelt interlock system" that disables the car from starting if not buckled up.

The center seatbelt had no sensors, it was just a convenience for when your honey wanted to snuggle up.
[/quote]

aha - the 73 version sounds a bit more harmless than the 74.
that seatbelt interlock and its relay caused me a lot of pain 30 years ago.
i was very happy when i had it taken out of circulation.

hey i have thought about that wiring loom you mentjoned with capacity for guages in 73 and the penny dropped while i was taking a train ride to one of my job sites today.
i think you might have just explained why the 1,7 engines only have two painted code numbers on them in contrast to the 4 codes on the 1.8 engines in 74 and 75.
i'll post the theory later after i have reduced it in words to something simple.
but you got my brain turning it over and i have had a light bulb moment.
might be a mad lightbulb moment but it did light up.

ok @jeffBowlsby - returning to this.

(this thread has been good. wandering further north of the seat cushion into the package bin along with this info on the harness of the 73-76 cars might throw a bit of light on the last mystery i was trying to find data on re three number engine code stamps on the 4 cylinders).

i got to here.

Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

as you may recall Jeff we were initially only restricting research to 74 1.8 L jet cars.
we started turning up enough examples of the engine stamp codes to pretty much capture the extent of them.

and there was a verifiable pattern.
there were 4 number codes present on north american engines.
they corresponded to first of all whether a 49 states engine or california.
and further subdivided into whether it was a car built as an appearance group 1.8 or a base 1.8. if appearance group (fitted with gauge + console) the engine was also assembled and supplied by engine factory at hanover with a sump plate with oil temp sensor and engine wiring to plug directly into the chassis wiring loom.

using PET we worked out that the 1.8 engines have listed the two types of sump plate as fitted. whereas 2.0 engines always were fitted with sump plate with sensor and wiring.

what also became clear was that in 74 all 1.8s got as part of what we call appearance group package with the same guage and console as the 2.0 cars. in fact the 1.8s were pretty much the same as 2.0 appearance group optioned car, just gave you the choice of it being the smaller engine (fuel economy, first oil crisis? scenario).

after that 74 1.8 engine research i extended the collection of data into the 75 1.8s.
75s used a very similar spread of 4 letter codes across a sequential range of 4 consective numbers.

i got all those codes and connected them to verified data (original window stickers).
a repeat of 74 data in terms of what type of engine was numbered with which number.
similarly 75 1.8s also repeat the 74 spec re appearance group and base car.

after the 75s i went into the 73 1.7s.
i figured if my theory was right there ought to be also 4 of these codes for the 1.7 engines in 73.
1 for base EA (49 states), for appearance group EA, 1 for base EB (California) and 1 for a. g. EB.
but i have only ever been able to find 2 engine stamp numbers for the 73 1.7
610 for the EA
613 for the EB.

but now i can see the assumption i got wrong.
its clear to me now the 1.7 appearance group cars were not fitted with a console and guages as a factory spec option set up. only the 73 2.0s.
the 1,7s got a parcel bin console.
VW-Porsche kept a bit of spec difference to distinguish the two different engined cars in 1973. likely a marketing strategy?

but there was a four consecutive range of numbers alocated to the 1.7s.
running from 610 to 613.

the wiring loom you say exists in all 73 cars and can take the temp sensor connection from the engine along with the 4 number range allocated indicates to me that VW-Porsche contemplated offering the guage+console in the 73 1.7s for appearance group.
to do this they would have used all 4 of the numbers just as they did in 74 and 75.

however a late decision was made i think and they changed strategy.

as a result they simply used the first and last code number possibilities from the allocated range of 3 number codes.
610 for EA and 613 for EB.

i conclude there is no 611 or 612 engines. they dropped the necessity for these late in their plans for 73 models.

--------

another curiousity of these code combinations is as follows.

the EC 1.8 engines come after the EA and EB 1,7 engines chronolgically.

yet when you look at the code allocations.
the EC engines have the 600-609 range.
the EA/EB engines have the 610-619 range.
and the G engines have the 620 range.

which almost suggests that in terms of engine design projects that the EC precedes the EA/EB.

which it might have. thats what i am thinking.
negotiations with the EPA by all the big car manufacturers in 1972 caused the program for emissions standards introductions to be be delayed one year and shifted in time.
kind of opening up an interim year in 1973.

i think the EA and EB engines of 73 were a late insertion into the development program of the 914 and the EC engines were given more time to be developed - in particular focussing on the new L jetronic injection system. that is probably why they get their own 10 range of 3 number codes?

---------

thats why i think the wiring loom is there in the 73 1.7s but never the possibility of the temp gauge (at least from the factory as an ordered car).

in fact i am yet to come across a verifiable 1.7 fitted with the temp gauge from factory.
enough examples come up with a console and gauge but these are not original condition cars you can use to verify data.

---------

after 73 it looks to me like VW-Porsche go ahead with their planned model strategy given thought to earlier.

ie that the appearance group versions of the 1.8s and 2.0s are very similar (almost identical spec) cars only distinguished by their engine types as the difference.
-----or its all about fuel economy versus power. apart from that you can have the same car if you wish.

i've also worked out some details of my car and its original purchase from the discussions in this thread and confirmation by @JeffBowlsby re spec of the base 74 and 75 1.8

in all the documentation that came with my car 35 years ago, a window sticker was missing. so can never confirm the factory order spec.
but it might be time for me to talk to @davep

however there were two 73 brochures. one is a big brochure and the other is the fabric and paint phamplet. the brown interior is ticked. my car has a brown interior.
and on the ext colors page is handwriting that says "which paint color?" same handwriting as in some pages of glove box manual. #1 is summer yellow.
#2 is signal orange. my car is phoenix red.

i conclude the original owners were looking at a car in 1973 and made the decision to place an order and buy in 74.

they were probably looking at a 73 1,7 appearance group in the showroom?
and now i know a base 1,8 in 74 was pretty close in most ways to an appearance group 1,7 in 73. all that was missing was the parcel bin! - pretty much.
probably explains the parcel bin in mine? deliberate request and must have been a stronger preference to them than guages and console of the 74 1.8 A.G.
its unsual. i have only stumbled across one or two other 74 1.8s with the package bin.
nearly all are either nothing or the A.G console/guage set up.

they also special ordered in the sway bars.

looks to me like nothing else.
just a base 18 with the bin and the sway bars.
like you did not have to do much to a base 1.8 in 74 to have a car virtually identical to a full spec 1.7 from 73.

pretty clear that one thing the original owners agreed on as husband and wife was it had to have a brown interior. very 1974 fashion/taste.
the husband i bought the car off said it was his late wife's car.
she had kept it and would not part with it.
i reckon she might have been the one who was specific about the parcel bin?

its an early L jet from the first 3 months of production.
so its on the cusp of the end of 73s being in the showroom and the first arrival of the batch of new models coming in.