Yesterday i have seen at a dealer a 914/6 GT. It has the vehicle identification number is 914 143 0041. I don't know if its is one of the original 32 GTs or if it is one
which has the GT - dealer Kit from Porsche.

Do you know how to identify?
The original paper states that the car was fist time admitted on 12.12.1969.

How much is such a car worth? (original GT version or the normal version
with the GT Kit?)

Thank you for your help,
Christoph

That serial number is not listed on this page of original factory GT's.

I would request a Cardex from Porsche to detrimine its build history. Probably its a M471 car so its value is in its condition. Pics would be nice.

QUOTE (xray666666 @ Aug 17 2005, 05:47 AM)

Yesterday i have seen at a dealer a 914/6 GT. It has the vehicle identification number is 914 143 0041.... The original paper states that the car was fist time admitted on 12.12.1969.

it would be quite unusual for a car with a 1971 VIN to have been first admitted in 1969...

I would say it could be a wrong digit

if it's VIN 914 0 43 0041 it would be an early 914-6 and the date could be correct

if so, it can't be a factory M471 - this option wasn't available in '70

o.k. - don't ask me why I know, I mustn't tell you

is this car grey?
is the engine a carbed 2.2S?

if so, IT'S NOT a GT, it's a simple 914-6 with flares ...
originally it was willow green
VIN is 914 1 43 0041 - the admittion date bases on a failure of Austrian authority ...

sorry Christoph - I completely forgot

a very warm welcome on this board

nice to see one more Austrian here

Gustl

Its nice to see anyone new here....welcome!

Hi,

first of all thank you for the warm welcome. Yes the car is grey and the guy told me that it was green before.

I have to check if the engine has carbed 2.2. If it is possible i'll go to the dealer tomorrow and make some photos, so you could see the car.

The VIN is 914 143 0041
The engine number is 6410 014
first time admitted 12.12.1969 BRD (Republic of Germany - west germany).

I'll try to make some photos and hope that you could tell me how much a car like this would be worth (if engine and so on is ok).

One more thing if it's just a 914/6 with the kit why is in the "Zulassungsschein" (the orignal papers of the authority) the identification "VW - Porsche 914 / 6 GT". Shouldn't it be without the "GT"?

QUOTE (Bleyseng @ Aug 17 2005, 03:09 AM)

"I would request a Cardex from Porsche to detrimine its build history. Probably its a M471 car so its value is in its condition. Pics would be nice."

Sorry but, what's a CARDEX? What should i ask at Porsche for? And where could i ask? Any email adress?

QUOTE (xray666666 @ Aug 17 2005, 06:22 AM)

The VIN is 914 143 0041 The engine number is 6410 014 first time admitted 12.12.1969 BRD (Republic of Germany - west germany). I'll try to make some photos and hope that you could tell me how much a car like this would be worth (if engine and so on is ok). One more thing if it's just a 914/6 with the kit why is in the "Zulassungsschein" (the orignal papers of the authority) the identification "VW - Porsche 914 / 6 GT". Shouldn't it be without the "GT"?

With that admit date of 12.12.69 the VIN should be 914 043 0041 as the fourth number of the six vins indicates the year it was made.

Sooo, is it a 1970 model or a 1971 model 914/6? Check the vin number again.

Hmm, I thought the six cars were Porsche 914/6's not VW/Porsche's in Europe?

QUOTE (Bleyseng @ Aug 17 2005, 05:33 AM)

With that admit date of 12.12.69 the VIN should be 914 043 0041 as the fourth number of the six vins indicates the year it was made. Sooo, is it a 1970 model or a 1971 model 914/6? Check the vin number again. Hmm, I thought the six cars were Porsche 914/6's not VW/Porsche's in Europe?

I have a copy of the orginal papers in front of me and the VIN is correct. I'll check the VIN within the car.

do you have a copy of the original German papers with the date in it

as far as I know, when the car came to Austria the authority had to write new papers (Einzelgenehmigung = Zulassung) and they made the failure
it's their failure too, that the paper says "GT"

I'm pretty sure that the VIN from the papers fit the car

as I told you, it is neither a GT nor a later converted "kit-GT" - it's only a 914-6 with flares and an other engine ...

the CARDEX or Certificate of Authenticity is a kind of "Geburtsurkunde"
it shows all options the car was supplied with when it left factory
in your case I'd contact Porsche Classic in Ludwigsburg
try this: classic-info@porsche.de


in my opinion it's not worth any more than any other flared 914-6 with a stronger engine

QUOTE (Bleyseng @ Aug 17 2005, 09:33 AM)

I thought the six cars were Porsche 914/6's not VW/Porsche's in Europe?

nope.

Euro 6's were "VW-Porsche-914-6" (i had one, still have a spare badge"

QUOTE (ArtechnikA @ Aug 17 2005, 04:12 PM)

QUOTE (Bleyseng @ Aug 17 2005, 09:33 AM) I thought the six cars were Porsche 914/6's not VW/Porsche's in Europe? nope. Euro 6's were "VW-Porsche-914-6" (i had one, still have a spare badge"

but there is a difference at the original papers/documents

at all 914-4 they say the producer is "Volkswagen"
at all 914-6 they say the producer is "Porsche"

the horn button is different, too

QUOTE (Bleyseng @ Aug 17 2005, 05:33 AM)

With that admit date of 12.12.69 the VIN should be 914 043 0041 as the fourth number of the six vins indicates the year it was made. Sooo, is it a 1970 model or a 1971 model 914/6? Check the vin number again.

According to the following URL there are models which where build in 70 and have the fourth digit 1.

http://www.pelicanparts.com/914/technical_...hassis_info.htm

QUOTE (xray666666 @ Aug 17 2005, 10:23 AM)

According to the following URL there are models which where build in 70 and have the fourth digit 1. http://www.pelicanparts.com/914/technical_...hassis_info.htm

yes, of course. the model year starts around August.

do they show any *1969* build dates with '1' year-date VIN's ?

there's a failure in this list

they say that the 916s were built in 1969, but as we all know they were built in 1971 (MY 1972) ...
in addition ... there's no 916 VIN 914 2 33 0010 ... the first prototype 916 has VIN 914 1 43 0195

PP should review their info

QUOTE (Gustl @ Aug 17 2005, 06:10 AM)

in my opinion it's not worth any more than any other flared 914-6 with a stronger engine

ok and what's something like that worth? just an indication...

Please find attached a scan of page 8 of the July 1996 Porsche Panorama. This was an atricle titled "Exploring the 914/6 GT Mysteries" and refers to the factory documents regarding GT serial number.

Hope it helps.

If anyone wants this scan in higher resolution send me a PM with your email address.

Go here and study up. Could have alot of Kit GT pieces that would raise the value considerably. Dealer installed or privately installed, Byer Beware . Good Luck
http://www.pbase.com/9146gt

QUOTE (xray666666 @ Aug 17 2005, 04:56 PM)

QUOTE (Gustl @ Aug 17 2005, 06:10 AM) in my opinion it's not worth any more than any other flared 914-6 with a stronger engine ok and what's something like that worth? just an indication...

it depends on the current condition of the car

if it's a good driver without big problems I'd say about EUR 25-30k

a couple of months ago a friend sold a flared ' 70 914-6 with carbed 2.7 engine, diff lock and front iol cooler for about EUR 38.000 - but the diff lock and the oil cooler were factory installed and the engine was completely rebuilt (for about EUR 16.000)

concours condition will cost more


I'd say it would be a good idea to ask someone who's familiar to 914s to inspect the car with you
there are a couple of specialists in your area (Wien-Vösendorf, Oeynhausen, Artholz, Zöbing)
you could save lots of money if a real specialist helps you!

Hi,

i made 2 fotos

http://cs.xn--hngematten-outlet-qqb.at/tmp/914.jpg
http://cs.xn--hngematten-outlet-qqb.at/tmp/914_2.jpg

what do you think?

the first pic (overview) looks quite good - as I told you today, if it would be a '70 car I would be seriously interested (I like flared teeners)

I'm no specialist, but the 2nd pic looks not so good

it would be interesting what condition the longs and the engine bay / battery tray is
typical areas like hell hole, trunk, doors (lower area), ...

but I'm sure here are a lot of guys who can tell you more about this ...

did you reach Toni (Weitec) - what did he say? does he remember the car?

Gustl

Well,
If you ignore the chassis number and look at the engine number instead this is what you've got:

The serial number range for the 1970 2.0l engines used in the 6's was 6414001- 64141634 with units produced in 1970. It is listed as a standard 901/38 2.0l engine.

There were a total of 443 914-6 cars made in 1970, but the other cars had 901/36 engines with serial numbers ranging from 6410011- 6410268.

This car you are looking at has the 901/36 engine, and that engine matches the vin that you posted, and as such is at least a numbers matched car...



This comes from Boschen and Barth's book "The Porsche Book"

It is unfortunate that the dealer was not friendly. Does he want to sell the car or not!
That windshield frame does not look good. I cannot imagine why it is like that unless there is damage underneath. That does not look like paint peeling. The frame does not look straight right at that point. The seal can be replaced, however it is one of the most expensive and difficult pieces to get.

Are the fender flares steel or fiberglass? Are the rocker panels flared to match? No oil cooler, so not a GT really. Just a nice 914/6 with flared fenders.

QUOTE (Matt Monson @ Aug 19 2005, 01:30 AM)

Well, If you ignore the chassis number and look at the engine number instead this is what you've got: The serial number range for the 1970 2.0l engines used in the 6's was 6414001- 64141634 with  units produced in 1970.  It is listed as a standard 901/38 2.0l engine. There were a total of 443 914-6 cars made in 1970, but the other cars had 901/36 engines with serial numbers ranging from 6410011- 6410268. This car you are looking at has the 901/36 engine, and that engine matches the vin that you posted, and as such is at least a numbers matched car... This comes from Boschen and Barth's book "The Porsche Book"

you might have mixed up a little

you're right that "Chrisoph's engine number" is a MY 1971 901/36 - and that it would fit to the VIN 914 1 43 0041 (both numbers are really early)

but in MY 1971 the engine number range for 2.0 SIX 5spd is 6410001-6410268
and the fitting VIN range is 914 1 43 0011 - 914 1 43 0443

in MY 1970 there were total of 2657 914-6 cars made (VIN 914 0 43 0011 - 914 0 43 2668)

the engine number range 6414001- 6414163 you're talkin' about is the MY 1971 901/38, which is only for the US market
but the car Christoph is looking at is an originally german car, that's in Austria for more then a decade ... so it'S a 901/36 engine

as far as I know, the original engine is rebuilt to 2.2S spec (carbed)

QUOTE (Gustl @ Aug 18 2005, 10:42 PM)

QUOTE (Matt Monson @ Aug 19 2005, 01:30 AM) Well, If you ignore the chassis number and look at the engine number instead this is what you've got: The serial number range for the 1970 2.0l engines used in the 6's was 6414001- 64141634 with  units produced in 1970.  It is listed as a standard 901/38 2.0l engine. There were a total of 443 914-6 cars made in 1970, but the other cars had 901/36 engines with serial numbers ranging from 6410011- 6410268. This car you are looking at has the 901/36 engine, and that engine matches the vin that you posted, and as such is at least a numbers matched car... This comes from Boschen and Barth's book "The Porsche Book" you might have mixed up a little you're right that "Chrisoph's engine number" is a MY 1971 901/36 - and that it would fit to the VIN 914 1 43 0041 (both numbers are really early) but in MY 1971 the engine number range for 2.0 SIX 5spd is 6410001-6410268 and the fitting VIN range is 914 1 43 0011 - 914 1 43 0443 in MY 1970 there were total of 2657 914-6 cars made (VIN 914 0 43 0011 - 914 0 43 2668) the engine number range 6414001- 6414163 you're talkin' about is the MY 1971 901/38, which is only for the US market but the car Christoph is looking at is an originally german car, that's in Austria for more then a decade ... so it'S a 901/36 engine as far as I know, the original engine is rebuilt to 2.2S spec (carbed)

I don't think I am at all mixed up, but as you pointed out, I managed to pull the numbers from the wrong line of the book. But your following info contains some errors.
According to Barth (and since he has ties to the factory, I trust his info) here's the breakdown for it all. And his production numbers are complete and not broken out by US or ROW, other than when it is a 901/36 vs a 901/38.

MY69 Chassis 9140430001- 9140432668 for 2668 units. Engine numbers 6400001- 6400889 for 901/36's &
Engine numbers 6404001- 6405781 for 901/38's

MY70 Chassis 9141430001- 9141430443 for 443 units
Engine numbers 6410011- 6410268 for 901/36
Engine numbers 6414001- 6414163 for 901/38

MY71 Chassis 9142430001- 9142430240 for 240 units
Engine numbers 6420001-6420270 for 901/38

There is no MY 69 914-6. Many built in 69 but 70 MY.

Thanks for the clarification. I tend to use production date and MY interchangeably in a lot of instances. I was mostly trying to make clear that the car that is being looked at is part of those 70 production numbers and not the '69 that the paperwork claims...

I'd say we're both right
this car is a little tricky, because both - VIN and engine number - are definitely MY 1971, but very early - and so both are built in 1970, but late (very likely August)

my source was the Johnson

Neither Barth nor the factory got MY1972 production figures correct since 260 were built. What we can agree on is that the VIN and engine are a close match and the engine is likely the original case, from 1971 model year. Production date is probably later than August, but I have no data to prove that. I think there is a possibility that there was a delay in production due to low sales numbers. Both 0028 and 0032 wound up in Japan as did several others from late 70 and early 71 production.

What is interesting is comparing the engine numbers and the car numbers. They don't match very well. Add in the sporto's and the GT's that did not get production engines and it gets quite interesting.

QUOTE (davep @ Aug 19 2005, 06:44 PM)

Production date is probably later than August, but I have no data to prove that. I think there is a possibility that there was a delay in production due to low sales numbers. Both 0028 and 0032 wound up in Japan as did several others from late 70 and early 71 production.

as far as I know back in the 70ies cars were produced and then the dealers tried to sell 'em

here's a car with very close VIN and engine # with delivery date 08/01/1970
might be interesting for your files

@ Christoph: that's a CARDEX from a '71 914-6