What is the TUB difference between a 914-4 and a 914-6, not a GT just a 6, or are they the same makers, ie...Karman or ???
Craig

Thomas and I were talking about that yesterday. Aside from the engine mounting point.
We came up with the mounting for the hand throttle, the four holes for the windshield washer pump, his has a hole in the trunk for the T-4 air supply that had a white plastic plug in it. Just like the ones in the rear trunk. The jack is mounted in the left rear corrner of the rear trunk and is of the VW T-1 kind.
What else?
:PERMAGRIN: Joe

Yea I no about the Hand throttle and the engine mount turn sigs, gauges, and wiper motor, but what’s that about 4 holes for the wiper pump? What about the TUB's, are made at the same place and time then split, to the right goes 6's and to the left goes 4's, next.
What about the body molding between the fender and the cowl, someone once told me that one was welded and no molding the other has that black plastic molding between, and what about the hand break?

Where is Brad or Mueller when you need them?

Same MFG.

The 6's were sent to Porsche for finishing.

The beading between the fender was on all production 914's and 914-6's. The only one I've seen without is the #4 prototype pics and various user cars that have been modified.

Lefty ignition dash panel and different column... but you're probably back on TUB's again so... that's about all I have.

Engine shelf slightly different....hole in driver's side for oil line from tank...don't know about pass side 'cause it is missing

No mount for heater blower (later cars)



different dash....duh!

Not much is it.
:PERMAGRIN: Joe

If yer talkin' about the hole, it's in a curved piece that I don't remember seeing on a /4....Would have to take an image and it's dark and I wanna go home...

No four cyl motor mounts

The tub's the same. The mounting holes are there for the hand throttle, there WAS no heater blower mount in the cars during the years the 6 was in production, the hole for the wiper motor harness is there in the 4s, the holes for the oil tank are simply punched in the existing bosses of the tub, the motor mount is welded in the 6s, the 4 mounting points are there, IIRC, on the left and right, just not used. The dash insert is different, but it's not a part of the tub. The Cap'n

There are pictures of the workers pushing the tubs across the street to the Porsche assembly line (on carts that seem to use the four little round supports on the edges of the floorpan). These tubs are really quite the same.

If Porsche was only making money on these 914-6's, they may have made a whole lot more of them.

QUOTE

the 4 mounting points are there, IIRC

Nada

these are the holes for the windshieldwasher pump

Four cylinder mounts aren't in sixes and there are only three holes for the washer pump. All early cars had the jack on the drivers side rear.

If you guys are still watching How hard is it for someone to transfer all of the 6 stuff over to a 4, rebadge it weld in the engine mount and any of the other metal parts, change dash, steering column all of the stuff from 6. I don't like it, But I know of such a car, the 6 was beyond repair and a Cali rust free tub was available and so the swap took place and was rebadged "because it all came from a 6" and has all doc's window sticker manuals everything,
he only told me because he said the new owner should know, plus if you knew 6's you would know.
The doner was a 73, so better doors, retractable seat belts, I'm not sure what else you get with a 73 that 69-72 didn't have. Besides the seats.

What value difference would there be? Besides YOU KNOW. I think just knowing it could
ruin it for me, I don't know, I'm not a purest, but it somehow just doesn't seem right.
What do you think, am I making too much out of it?

Craig
Stuck in Indyanoplace

QUOTE (Speedster07 @ Nov 15 2005, 05:56 PM)

What is the TUB difference between a 914-4 and a 914-6

About $5000.

On the /6 there's a bracket to hold the oil feed line between the bottom of the oil tank and the ol cooler. It is definitely part of the tub, and not there on the /4.

For what it is worth, I have had 2 real 6's. I am now in the process of building a clone from real six parts. I am starting with a 73 tub. I feel that I can build a lot better car with the parts that I have than the original 6 came from the factory. I think a lot of people have taken this approach.

Actulay, I think we should make up a BLACK LIST and post all of the numbers of the -6s chassies we know to have been distroyed.
:PERMAGRIN: Joe

As an owner of two stock sixes with zero mods, I can tell you that there were so many changes made to the tubs from the time production began until the last six in '72 that no book or article has yet to catalog them. This doesn't include the 916. Different animal. My 70's are #0137 and #0876 made two months apart and there are differences between them. Just one example, the tabs that hold down the floor mats are not on #137 but are on #876. It was not uncommon to stop the production line and offer an upgraded design at the factory. There are other differences, but I won't go into that now.
For those looking to swap out parts from a rusted or busted six and upgrade to a newer chassis, it is still not a "real" six. To me, the '72 chassis is the best conversion tub. It's lighter than the '73 and later ones. But, in perspective you can do anything you want with any tub because they are that flexible. In the end, a real six will always be a real six and all others are conversions.
That is from me, the purist.
Don

I just spent 10 minutes typing my thoughts on this and it got lost in transmit!! So I did it again and Poof its gone again?? Third times a charm!

So here it is in a nutshell.

This looks like a nice tub
To build one this nice to this point would cost you more than$12k for a 4 or 6
To complete this car would cost $8-12k
It would be a nice relyable 6 with more power than a stock one
If you want more power in a 6 chassis and you put a 3.2 in it, it is not an original purist car any more
The 6 chassis may be worth a few more $ but this chassis is very clean and has all of the best suspension, brakes, lines and late model benifits.

I even thought about selling my 6 for $13k and purchasing this chassis to complete my project.

my .02

QUOTE (sixerdon @ Nov 16 2005, 07:13 AM)

In the end, a real six will always be a real six and all others are conversions. That is from me, the purist.

and i'm not a purist ...


- how about the hole in the front trunk wall where, on a /4, the hose for the spare tire air goes through.
i thought the original /6 didn't have that hole ...

- rear trunk heat shield is bolted on on a /6, welded on on a /4 ...

Andy

In the end...it comes down to the hysterical value....hysterical because the CWs that have to have an original spend absurd amounts of money to be original 'cause they feel they can "stand above the common", which is ok with me. Yeh, I sell OE parts for more than Porsches to the hysterical crowd.

It's nice to say that you own a 30 - 35 year old original, but if it is repainted, a switch changed or the engine / trans rebuilt, etc., it really isn't original. The only "originals" are the ones that were built and either never driven or driven a few miles and then parked (in a storage unit and later found in the desert).

So for me, a conversion is probably better than an "original". Better suspension, better window winders, more power, etc, etc. I would think a conversion will be driven far more than an original. Originals constantly worry about bird droppings, alien drivers, rock chips, etc. I like to drive my car (hard, and I've blown enough engines to prove that).

Now don't get pissed off from the first two paragraphs..it's how I feel, not how you feel.

Disclaimer...the views presented here are those of Slits the Asshole and do not represent the management of the 419club.com or the views of the 914world.com.

There are enough differences an expert could tell them apart.
As has been said, a conversion can be made that is much better than the original, and one is less inhibited when dealing with a conversion. While an original six would command a premium over an equivalent condition conversion, it would not be great. The biggest factor in the value of any car is the condition of the car.

QUOTE (sixerdon @ Nov 16 2005, 06:13 AM)

As an owner of two stock sixes with zero mods, I can tell you that there were so many changes made to the tubs from the time production began until the last six in '72 that no book or article has yet to catalog them. This doesn't include the 916. Different animal. My 70's are #0137 and #0876 made two months apart and there are differences between them. Just one example, the tabs that hold down the floor mats are not on #137 but are on #876. It was not uncommon to stop the production line and offer an upgraded design at the factory. There are other differences, but I won't go into that now. For those looking to swap out parts from a rusted or busted six and upgrade to a newer chassis, it is still not a "real" six. To me, the '72 chassis is the best conversion tub. It's lighter than the '73 and later ones. But, in perspective you can do anything you want with any tub because they are that flexible. In the end, a real six will always be a real six and all others are conversions. That is from me, the purist. Don

'For those looking to swap out parts from a rusted or busted six and upgrade to a newer chassis, it is still not a "real" six'

Well said..real ( factory) vs made up.

I agree, there will only ever be ~3332 914/6's

There has the potential to be +115,000 914/6 conversions

That doesn't mean that a converted car will not exceed the capabilities of the stock 6, it's very easy to do that without much effort

Hmmm, I just might make the only 914/6 to 914/4 conversion

QUOTE (Speedster07 @ Nov 15 2005, 09:49 PM)

If you guys are still watching How hard is it for someone to transfer all of the 6 stuff over to a 4, rebadge it weld in the engine mount and any of the other metal parts, change dash, steering column all of the stuff from 6. I don't like it, But I know of such a car, the 6 was beyond repair and a Cali rust free tub was available and so the swap took place and was rebadged "because it all came from a 6" and has all doc's window sticker manuals everything, he only told me because he said the new owner should know, plus if you knew 6's you would know. The doner was a 73, so better doors, retractable seat belts, I'm not sure what else you get with a 73 that 69-72 didn't have. Besides the seats. What value difference would there be? Besides YOU KNOW. I think just knowing it could ruin it for me, I don't know, I'm not a purest, but it somehow just doesn't seem right. What do you think, am I making too much out of it? Craig Stuck in Indyanoplace

If you were sold a car that was advertised as an original /6, and it turns out to be a re-badged car, I'd be making all kinds of noise about it. A conversion is a conversion. Even if "everything" was transferred over, it's still a conversion. Advertising and selling a car without disclosing this constitutes fraud.

If the VIN was changed, it would not be entirely legal. I believe that is a Federal law.

I will be putting a 3.2L and 915 or G50 trany in it if a get her. and power windows, and 911 style door panels, mabe getty 911 dash. and flaired, not GT style.

Thanks for the comments you guys were kinder than expected,
It's ok to bring it on, I can take it. Did I say that out loud

This fine example of German engineering will not be in shows as an original 6, nor is it being sold as as such, I always wanted a 6 and this is one that would be ok to molest
I would not want to do this to a real 6, so I guess this one would be perfect to hop-up.

BUT WHATS IT WORTH ??? 5k 8k more...less


Thanks for the info
Craig
Freezing in Indyanoplace

Depending upon the quality of the conversion and the quality of the car, some have sold up to 10 - 12K

I figure 7 - 10 for a decent conversion

And remember, if you turn them upside down, they all look the same

Andy: Thomas just took off a heat shield that was bolt on in an early -4.
:PERMAGIM; Joe

BONG



Round 2

QUOTE (SirAndy @ Nov 16 2005, 08:59 AM)

- how about the hole in the front trunk wall where, on a /4, the hose for the spare tire air goes through. i thought the original /6 didn't have that hole ... - rear trunk heat shield is bolted on on a /6, welded on on a /4 ... Andy

Jerry's car has the hole in the trunk.

The bolt on shield is a clue, but easily replicated. In fact Ed Davila's four now has a bolt in heat shield because the rear trunk floor was replaced and if we welded in the shield we couldn't paint the top of it.

THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH FOR YOUR HELP AND INPut

Now I have to figure out what to do and how much it would be worth with out and engine and trans.

I have the 3.2L and 915 already.

Thanks again
Craig

QUOTE (VegasRacer @ Nov 16 2005, 01:28 AM)

QUOTE (Speedster07 @ Nov 15 2005, 05:56 PM) What is the TUB difference between a 914-4 and a 914-6 About $5000.

That about covers it.

QUOTE (davep @ Nov 16 2005, 08:52 PM)

There are enough differences an expert could tell them apart. As has been said, a conversion can be made that is much better than the original, and one is less inhibited when dealing with a conversion. While an original six would command a premium over an equivalent condition conversion, it would not be great. The biggest factor in the value of any car is the condition of the car.

[QUOTE]

I think the biggest factor in the value of any car is the condition of the buyers wallet.

T.C.