What do people recommend for ride height and alignment settings for a 2.0L being used primarily for autocross. The rear ride height is constrained by the springs with the perch on the lowest "slot" in the Koni shock. For front height I was thinking of 125mm from the center of the torsion bar to the center of the spindle. This is 35mm lower than the stock 90mm. For camber I was thinking of -2 degrees in front and -2.5 degrees in back.
I've finally got the suspension put back together with 180# springs and Koni Sports in the back, 21mm torsion bars, Koni Sports, poly bushings, and turbo tie rods in front. Now I just need to set the alignment and get a decent set of tires (Faken 615s) on it.
Full Version: Ride Height?
Generally speaking, a rake of roughly 1 degree is considered desirable. That means the rear is higher by enough to put the chassis of the car at a 1 degree slope to the front.
Going beyond that, you may want to actually have the car corner balanced. Setting the ride height to get as close to even weight distribution as you can (as well as cross weights... LR+RF = RR+LF). Best to do that with coil-overs though...
As for camber? Good luck getting to those numbers. -2 degrees up front pretty much requires some heroics. And none too cheap either. And furthermore, why? That's a lot of negative camber. -1.5 is generaelly what you can get out of good front end without fancy strut bushings or metal grinding/cutting... And -2.5 in back is alot no matter what. Again, why so much negative camber?
-Josh2
Going beyond that, you may want to actually have the car corner balanced. Setting the ride height to get as close to even weight distribution as you can (as well as cross weights... LR+RF = RR+LF). Best to do that with coil-overs though...
As for camber? Good luck getting to those numbers. -2 degrees up front pretty much requires some heroics. And none too cheap either. And furthermore, why? That's a lot of negative camber. -1.5 is generaelly what you can get out of good front end without fancy strut bushings or metal grinding/cutting... And -2.5 in back is alot no matter what. Again, why so much negative camber?
-Josh2
I respectfully disagree.
Measure from the top of the rim to the bottom of the fender lip both front and rear.
Set the front of the car 1/4 inch higher than the rear.
When you hit the brakes hard during an autocross, you do not want to lift the rear end of the car... a slight rearward rake will help with rear end traction during aggresive braking and dramatic weight transfer...
in addition, when you stomp on the gas, after braking, you reset the car, and transfer the weight again to the rear.
I had my car set with a slight forward rake, like a muscle car...and during heavy braking I was experiencing the rear letting go...
I talked to the guy who was winning for the past several years and he told me, and explained it like I did above, that the 914 needs to have the front just 1/4 inch higher...
this is how I learned it...trial and error...and he was right...I can brake alot harder now, and I can reset the car faster...
Rich
Measure from the top of the rim to the bottom of the fender lip both front and rear.
Set the front of the car 1/4 inch higher than the rear.
When you hit the brakes hard during an autocross, you do not want to lift the rear end of the car... a slight rearward rake will help with rear end traction during aggresive braking and dramatic weight transfer...
in addition, when you stomp on the gas, after braking, you reset the car, and transfer the weight again to the rear.
I had my car set with a slight forward rake, like a muscle car...and during heavy braking I was experiencing the rear letting go...
I talked to the guy who was winning for the past several years and he told me, and explained it like I did above, that the 914 needs to have the front just 1/4 inch higher...
this is how I learned it...trial and error...and he was right...I can brake alot harder now, and I can reset the car faster...
Rich
for camber...get as much as you can up front...
Without camber plates...I think 1.5 is the max...but your car is not the same as mine....
You can oval the holes out a little.
The rear I would agree to about .5 more if you can.
Then corner balance it.
Rich
Without camber plates...I think 1.5 is the max...but your car is not the same as mine....
You can oval the holes out a little.
The rear I would agree to about .5 more if you can.
Then corner balance it.
Rich
Like I said, "in general"...
Car setup will make a very big difference here, and that's why corner-balancing is WAY better than just picking an arbitrary ride height.
And if you had your car setup like a muscle car, you may have had too much rake. 0.5 to 1 degree of rake is not that much. And if you had that much of a problem under braking, there may have been something else going on there. Changing the ride height will effect how much weight transitions to and from that end. To that, dropping the rear possibly helped compensate for whatever else was going on. But you shouldn't have been swapping ends like that anyway...
If you're concerned, get the car to an alignment shop that has corner scales, and have them corner balance the car.
Running the car with the nose high will likely give you some amount of understeer...
-Josh2
Car setup will make a very big difference here, and that's why corner-balancing is WAY better than just picking an arbitrary ride height.
And if you had your car setup like a muscle car, you may have had too much rake. 0.5 to 1 degree of rake is not that much. And if you had that much of a problem under braking, there may have been something else going on there. Changing the ride height will effect how much weight transitions to and from that end. To that, dropping the rear possibly helped compensate for whatever else was going on. But you shouldn't have been swapping ends like that anyway...
If you're concerned, get the car to an alignment shop that has corner scales, and have them corner balance the car.
Running the car with the nose high will likely give you some amount of understeer...
-Josh2
car was corner balanced both times..
I shaved three seconds off my times.
I stand firmly by my educated experience.
Rich
I shaved three seconds off my times.
I stand firmly by my educated experience.
Rich
I think you are both right. I currently have the car adjusted so that it has 1/2 degree forward rake - the rear jack point is 7" above the ground and the front jack point is 6.5" above the ground (over about a 60 inch baseline). The front torsion bar centers are 5" (127mm) below the spindle centers.
With this setup the lip of the rear fender in the center of the wheel is 24" above the ground and the lip of the front fender in the center of the wheel is 24.5" above the ground.
The issue is that the fender cut-outs for the front wheel go about 1" higher than the fender cut-outs for the rear wheel, so if you set ride height by the fender opening, setting the front fender 1/4" higher than the back is actually setting the car about 3/4" lower in front (and about 3/4 degree forward rake).
With this setup the lip of the rear fender in the center of the wheel is 24" above the ground and the lip of the front fender in the center of the wheel is 24.5" above the ground.
The issue is that the fender cut-outs for the front wheel go about 1" higher than the fender cut-outs for the rear wheel, so if you set ride height by the fender opening, setting the front fender 1/4" higher than the back is actually setting the car about 3/4" lower in front (and about 3/4 degree forward rake).
see. i toldyou
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