I got the call yesterday that the 'performance' for the weekend left around $7500 on the bill. When I told them all my cards were maxed out and my bank accounts were overdrawn, they were gracious enough to drop it down to $5500.

This whole charging thing still leaves a horrible taste in my mouth because it doesn't make any logical sense. But I'm the moron who put his name on the dotted line.

At this point I doubt there is anything I can really do about it. There is around $1000 coming in from the silent auction.

As I told a few people at the event, I really thought they were going to be a little more gracious about this.

Anyone have any ties to the Hilton corp?

WTF is this about? Are these extra charges? Gonna need to raise some funds here?

For those of us who don't know what is going on, would you be so kind as to set the stage and explain what happened?

time for world to show some heart...again. pm me your mailing addy and i'll cut you a check today mark. it won't be HUGE but i figure every bit will help. if 280 members can help with as little as $25 we'll get it covered. edit: it'll only take 220. what is the "performance" deal? people out of control?

k

It's a confusing story, because it's kind of illogical.

I'll try to condense it.

I signed up with the hotel for 40 rooms for three nights. Which means (to the hotel) that I'm on the hook for 120 'room-nights' (40 * 3).

The reservation system works like this. I have a block of 120 room nights that are reserved and locked down until a certain date. Once that date passes the rooms are released into the general population, BUT my commitment is not release. At this point they are "trying to help me out" by selling more rooms (their exact words). So if the hotel sells out (like it did on Sat night) then I don't owe anything.

So at the end of it all there ended up being a bunch of rooms empty on Fri and Sun, and thus they are looking to me to make it up to them.

It doesn't make any sense to me, but I've tried to talk to people there and I get the run around explanation. I don't know if I have any other options besides paying up.

Yikes.

That all sounds more like lease provisions that a freakin hotel reservation.

Did you sign a contract that said those things? If so, I would like to look at it for you (lawyer type here) and see if there is any wiggle room. If you didn't sign a contract, you can invite them to self fornicate at their leisure.

That makes no sense. They cannot charge you for something you didn't buy.

You should get a letter from me and other parties that came at the last minute and had to pay 199 per night. I asked as direct as I could can you get me into the block of rooms from the WCR rate and package, I was told NO and for them to not log this and then charge you is NOT right. I will fight with you on this and feel the Hotel needs to review all the last minute reservation from or group for One that came in and paid full price. I think Gteener and her dad as well Did not have reservation.
In the end I will be glad to help with the 25-buck donation but I don’t think we should just roll over on this one. My 456 dollars should have went towards your block, Its called customers service I know its dying here in America but Let be strong. If we all call and bug the manager ( get his name) thay will move on this or loose 60+ future costumers

Some of the thousands of dollars on my credit card(s) archive orignated from my days running mountainboard races 1999-2002. Being an event promotor is 90% a thankless job, and very difficult to turn a profit at. Each year I got a little better, convicing sponsors that no more product was needed, just cash money to pay insurance etc.

I kept my WCR hotel reservations even though I had reservations about the expense!

HHHmmmm....5K? Sounds like the price of a 2056. Maybe you could have another auction to raise funds?

I had a great time at the WCR and loved my king size bed with cable TV!

$199 A NIGHT!!?. the complimentary b-fast buffet must have been out of this world.

k

What Buffet! had to pay everything,


Got some towels for the car wash.

That sounds like shit, Mark. If they can offer the rooms up tot he public then you should not be held financially liable for the cost of them. This "we try to do you a favor by selling as many as possible" crap is illogical. I agree, we should all fight this one. I am in for it. I can send you some of the bolt money I just made (more than $25, but no where near $5.5K).

Here is an idea, we can all call and reserve rooms for the same week and then cancel right before we would have to pay for them. this would fuck up thier biz end maybe (desparate retrobution from an angry man, I know )

hey mark,

btw. first, they charged me the *full* price for the split hotel room

and then reversed the charge completely ...

now what?
Andy

I agree with Leamon. The hotel was not flexible on the block rooms at all, and many people were denied the WCR rate and had to pay the full rate - and I have to assume that they were not counted in the WCR total.

Additionally, there were several people with Sat/Sun reservations that tried to change to Fri/Sat when the autox on Monday was moved to Sat. They were not allowed to change their reservations - so some of those people ended up cancelling Sunday night instead. Again - the hotel turned away WCR money because of their strict policy.

Like Leamon said - we should fight this one as best we can.

But in the end, whatever the outcome - Mark needs to not be financially in debt over this. Yes, it was a bad decision to sign that contract - but that's way in the past and hindsight is 20/20. Mark is the one who stepped up to put on the event during a difficult time in the 914 community. The splintering of the community made a huge impact to the attendance of this years' event. The low attendance from out-of-town participants is really why the hotel numbers weren't met - and there's nothing Mark could do about that.

When the split occurred, there was a lot of doubt as to whether the WCR would happen this year. Mark could have thrown in the towel and cancelled it. But he didn't - he stepped up and put together a great weekend. He has more than paid his dues on this one. He doesn't deserve to get stuck owing any $$.

Mark, first ask them what there average occupancy rate is for Friday nights and then saturday nights and then Sunday nights. Now ask them how many rooms they sold for each night and how many rooms total they have in the hotel. From that you will probably be able to show that they were running above the normal range and therefore you had already done them a favor. If that does not work and you don't mind sending the paperwork to me I will have my Lawyer, read that MOMMY, look at it to see what can be done.(She really is a Lawyer, 30+ years now) Also, if your cards are maxed, how are they going to get there money. What guarentee did you give them?

I also agree with the Dr. They offered the rooms to the public and the law should look at this as taking responsibility for them not as a favor.

If you would like us to I can throw in 25 to help. You shouldn't get screwed for this. PM me you email and let me know if I can paypal you.

Jon

no comp'ed buffet? such a deal...

k

I don't have any legal skills or much money, and didn't attend WCR. However, this smells of bullshit! Put me on the list as someone who will do what he can.
Mark D.

This is total bs. If they supposedly had a block of rooms set aside for wcr attendees why is it that some of the attendees were told that there were no rooms available?

So you booked rooms for Sunday night too?
That might be why you still owe them money.

I have a similar deal with the hotel in Moab for the RRC, but once the cut-off date passes, all bets are off. The hotel is responsible for filling the rooms, not me.

I am sure a phone call to the right person will settle this. If you need help, please let me know

This seems like BS
I would take up the offers from some of them lawyer-types to look at it
It seems like they actively prevented some of thoe rooms from being filled in an attempt to make an extra few bucks
If that's the case, then you should by no means be obligated to pay
If there is no way to get out of it though, I will also contribute some

they came down from 7500 to 5500 pretty quickly

i'm guessing during the wcr dates that bthe hotel did they have all of their rooms beyond the 40 you had booked rented out. thus they could not sell the unused portion of the 40 rooms had they wanted to ?? thus asking you to pay is a joke.

jim

It really does sound like you're getting screwed here. If it comes down to it, count on me for a little $$ to help.

Well boyz the hotel business is a UGLY business! During the last year and a half, I have stayed at a Hilton Hotel every three weeks. I have negotiated a favorable rate because of the frequency of stay. Two months ago I arrived and found my reservation was cancelled. They say I called the Suday before at 5:00 A.M. and cancelled the stay. That was not true! They were full and did not need my lower rate. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I have been a Hilton HHonors member for over twenty years and the local guys did this. I am going to nail the morning manager's ass to the front door.

Kathy and I stayed two nights at the DoubleTree. My check out with extras was $534.67. I hope they included my stay as part of the clubs obligation. I helped to sponsor our event and am willing to help again if needed. It was a great venue. Keep in contact Mark.

Dan Callicott

Nice to see you all!

Mark,

Be sure to keep us posted on what's going on. No way you should get stuck for $5,500.

Mark,
I just paypaled the balance due on the oil tank. So that is in your pocket.

I think the next step is to take it upstream. Usually, local managers have only a certain amount of leeway to lower disputed bills. In this case, the bill is disputed because so many people had to pay full price rather than the WCR rate. Try asking for a regional or national managers phone number.
Next, if they are not gracious and accomodating post the phone number of your contact person here and we can start a shit storm of complaints.
Last step after we get them to lower it to their final offer if not eliminate it is to set up a Paypal storm to make McMark whole on this. Frankly, I thought the entry fee was a little low. It wouldn't have even payed for the Sunday night dinner in most cases.
Mark... Breath... We will get through this too.

Actually, Leamon, I did make our reservations as part of the group block.

Mark, that makes no sense. Did you cancel the extra rooms within their 24-hour cancellation period? Or did they tell you you didn't have to?

Sometimes you have to do their work for them Submit a list of the names from the group that stayed at the hotel and which nights they stayed and show them all the places they screwed up.

I will scan the contract later tonight and post it. Thanks for all the support. I needed it. I will also get the regional manager's phone number as well. Thanks for the great idea Rob.

In either case, post a PayPal or mail address. CC interest is already compiling...

Might want to also have people who were charged full price to scan in their receipts. Sounds totally retarded.

I'm sure this will work out (hopefully without allot of drama) but I will throw in some cash if you need it as well.

I'll send some cash if it will help. God knows i can skip a meal or two..

JaminM3, As you have only 14 posts at this point, let me take the opportunity to
If you live in SLC there is someone there you need to meet if you are going to own a 914. Eric Shea is a vendor, an admin, and a 914 guy extrordinaire. If you have unmarried sisters he only has one wife. Look him up. He is the proprietor of PMB... Maybe you can help each other out... Tell him I said the bit about the unmarried sisters.

You may have struck a differnt deal with this hotel but when I held a block of rooms for my wedding a few years back the deal was that they held a block of rooms for my guests (lets say 10) If all ten rooms were "sold" to my guests by the agreed date then they gave me a free room in return for HELPING THEM. If All 10 rooms failed to sell to my guests by the agreed date then I didn't get the room but I certainly didn't pay anything. At the end of the day they still won because they filled at least some of their rooms with people who might have easily gone to another hotel.

If they continue to insist you pay for rooms you didn't use and that you weren't impeding them from selling then I'd get a lawyer involved

Just my 2c
John

Good to hear you're getting some additional eyes on that contract. One step at a time, and as somebody said try to keep breathing. If we have to start harassing Hilton managers and execs, I'm happy to do it.

"Deadly Bulb Hilton Hotels, I'm about to write you a reality check." -- The Tick

Note that more than a couple attendees of the WCR are lawyers of one sort or another.

This by itself is reason enough to dispute the charges, and perhaps contact the CA attorney general about it. If you are reserving rooms and preventing them from renting them out okay, but if there was even one vacant room that was not rented and was not in their block, they are assed out.

Oh, BTW, fuck Hilton Hotels, I stayed one in Chicago one time, prime area, total dump. Will NEVER stay at a Hilton again.

Keep us all posted. I'll paypal a little cash if you get stuck with this. I still haven't forgot that you and Andy helped me out last year on Mt. Hood.

If you get stuck with the bill Mark, I'll definitely pitch in. But this is a load of crap and it needs to be fought and made to disappear. What a load a crap...

Mark, take half of what you were going to send me and apply to your defense fund. Maybe Allan can speak to the btender and get you a lighter sentence.

Linda and I stayed at the Sheraton Suites hotel in Pomona over Fathers day for the LA Roadster show. The finest room configuration I have ever seen, and I have stayed at the Ritz-Carlton and Four Seasons, for a lot more $$. I could live in this room.
The televisions were on o interior walls, not up aganist a wall so you hear the one from the room next door. Blackout curtains. A refrigerator, microwave, coffee maker, doors between rooms, it was designer quality.
CCLIN914NATION

Here are the contract papers. Any ideas or advice is welcome.

Page 3 has all the fine print.

Stupid question but did you sign and send it in?? Did they get an original or did you fax it?? Did you initial any of the documents?? It occures to me that the hotel has a certain number of rooms to sell each night. You said that they were sold out on Saturday night (do they typically sellout on Fathers Day Weekend Saturday?? Did you push them way up on there 'occupancy rate on that day??) so that means that they had a certain number of unsold rooms on Friday and a certain number of unsold on Sunday. You need to get them to give you the number of rooms total for the property and the number of rooms actually sold on (in total) Friday and Sunday. They also have an 'occupancy rate' which is a percentage of sold rooms per night. If they average 50% on Fridays and they happen to be 75% on this particular Friday I would point that out. Same with Saturday. Did you have more than 50 rooms on Saturday?? You also need to start getting the names of all the different parties that were at the event and make sure that there total for rooms sold to WCC is the same as yours and if they are not they ned to provide the list of people that they have and you ned to check it against yours. Also when looking at the occupancy rate keep in mind that they keep a certain number of rooms open incase there is an emergency or Paris shows up. I will have the papers looked at and then give you a call.

Ummm... Paris ain't showin' up for a while dude. She is having naked shower jail sex with another inmate right now. Just ask Mark's wife Erin...

Mark,

If you can prove that some people didnt recieve the promised discounted rate and then communicated this to club in general I think you have grounds to invalidate all remaining liabilities to the hotel.

Essentially their actions scared away potential particapants.

Hey Mark,

Thanks again for doing all the hard work and putting on the Classic.

FWIW, you should get a firm count from all attendees with details on how many nights they booked and at what rate. Also, if they tried to book a room but were told there were none available.

My family originally booked for Fri and Sat only, but on Saturday decided to spend Sunday night also. The wife was told that the WCR rate was not available, but they could extend our stay for $10 more that the WCR rate which we did. We were very clear that we were with WCR and had booked Fri and Sat well before the deadline.

Anyway, I am definitely willing to contribute more $$ to the cause, so you are not on the hook, but let's get the attendees info and FIGHT!

Jim

I have an idea...

It occurs to me that Mark should persue the challenge to the bill based on the fact that some were told the WCR rate was not available. That is the right thing to do.

Mark however should not be hanging in the wind like drying meat. Lets put together a Paypal fund to reduce his obligation and if Mark is successful at getting the thing to go away, the fund can be donated to charity. ALS has been mentioned. Korijo is after all, a part of our World...

Objections?

No objections here.

Let's make it work.

No objection here either!