I am at this time considering a turbo install on my 3.0 engine, I would be using the guts of a used bae turbo kit for the 911sc. I know that I will have to do a lot of fabricating and loose some useable storage space in the trunk. I have enough support from those who have had the turbo kit installed on there cars for 20 years, and have sorted all the little problems out.
I now have to justify the need for 300hp, when my car runs great as is, but lacks a little heart pounding thrill.
I like the idea of turbocharging as it is all external, biggest hp gains without internal modifications, and I have the capabilites of fabricating the plumbling. Plus it can be done for less than a pair of carbs.
Someone twist my arm, it's a turbo or it's a new paint job for the car.


Chappy

new paint!

TURBO!!!

You REALLY can't turbo a 914/6, haha.

Paint!

I have the complete intake for a 930, fuel distributor,manifold,intercooler, blow-off assembly, etc.

That would make a turbo conversion a cinch!!!

lemme know if interested.

Tim. Pm me on what you would like to sell it for.

I used to have a Volvo 740 turbo.

Turbos rock.

(or, rather, Kompressors rock)

Chappy,
I'm having a hard time understanding this question. What do you mean "justify 300hp"? I mean, I'm trying to understand it, but I can't quite comprehend NOT needing 300hp. I thought we all needed 300hp? Now 600hp might be hard to justify (to my wife), but 300hp just seems like a no brainer. Like food and water and a place to sleep.

Go for it. And anyone who says it will be too hard is a pansy.

-Ben M.

Is the CR of your SC engine low enough to handle the boost to make 300bhp???
If the engine is stock, I doubt it...

cheers,

Jeroen

Make Mustangs cry.
What more justification do you need?

8.51 8lbs-9 maybe not 300 but those who have them installed on there sc engines claim they are faster than the 930's.

Turbo! Turbo!

Does that make it a TT (Twin Turbo)

I just sold a KKK K27 ... a nice upgrade for the 930.

It was used on a '85 BMW 745i

Eddie

I would be shocked if you couldn't get 300hp assuming an excellent intercooler setup (which might allow for 10,11,or 12psi)

-Ben M.

You mean something like this

or this

or this

oops

Why does that look so damn appealing to me

(This is a dangerous conversation for me There is no end to the entertainment budget..... :-))

Ok, the original '76 had a 3 liter 6, with a comp ratio of 6 or so, and a turbo that most serious folk call a door stop and no intercooler. That was good for something like 245 hp. It was very peaky, and low end torq was pretty ugly. That was exaggerated by the 4 gear tranny, where two of the gears are overdrive. When it came on boost, it was/is pretty dramatic.

In mine, we moved to a 3.2, with a comp ratio of 7.6, and the same doorstop turbo (budget... that will change someday...) and it was a big change. (no intercooler for vanity reasons -- I love the early tail) Low end torq is much better, and the 4 gear tranny is definitely live-able. No dyno results tho. This engine in a 914 would be a lot of fun...

I'm quite interested in the intercooler schemes in the photos -- turbo lag has several components (which seriously effects drivability) and one of those is the length of tubing/intercooler between the turbo and the intake. In a consistent high rpm environment (i.e. racing) it may not matter as much, but on the street, there are different issues.

So ... to make it short, I'd be really interested in hearing about how well these beasts perform on the street -- it's where most of us live . And of course, my toy budget for next year has to be increased......

kim.

Cus hp is cooool. Go turbo, I doubt you'll be regretting it when you scratch your paint..

Paint it yourself..

andrew

The guys who run the bae kits swear by them, I have been talking to a guy who has had one on his 78 SC for 20 years. I think if one rigged a pressure sensor to trigger the cold start valve for fuel enrichment, used an intercooler may be ventilated by electric radiator fans, run the turbo up the right side of the trunk maybe even cutting it open and create a boxed area to bring the turbo closer to the intake to lessen the lag, blah blah blah blah, I think it could be done.

Hey, I bought a turbo 'cause I'm hooked on them -- I ain't gonna say "don't do it" . I'm just saying that attention has to be paid.... I'm sure you already knwo that tho...

kim.

turbo

On a cool MN night 12 lbs of boost! You Go Boy! I was just in the cities for Tues & Wed. I was thinkin I should have dropped you a note.

Be a plumber and go turbo, paint can wait speed can't

I fell the need, the need for speed.

IMHO, that is a half-assed way to do it and is a sure way to blow you motor in no time flat.....

Aux. fuel injector moduals are available for a few hundred or use an aftermarket FI such as Megasquirt if you are trying to do this on a budget......

I think if I decide to do it, I will stick with the stock proven to be reliable, bae kit running 8-9lbs. Change the mechanical advance in the dizzy and see how it runs.
I maybe satisfied with the performance gains at 8-9lbs., if not then I would make the changes. I do wish to keep my engine in one piece.

Rich
Let me know next time you come down to the cities. I may have to make a run up to Lutsen to drop off some stuff next month if i'm up in Duluth I will drop you a note.

Chappy

That would explain how he has run his engine like that for 20 years.

He is actually using an additional cold start valve piped into the intake system, with a hobbs N.O. pressure switch set to close at around 5 psig and activate the injector.

I happen to personally know someone who is doing the same thinmg to his 911SC with a BAE turbo system

Here's a pic of "my friend's" 911 SC with the turbo installed. 5 psi to start with, gradually creaping up to a target of around 9 psi with intercooler and supplimental fuel injection, should top out at around 320 very driveable hp.

Sammy, been a while. Come back again soon, man!

Sammy,

What have you seen for intercoolers? I'm guessing that when your friend goes to intercool it, he/she'll have to switch to the tea-tray turbo tail, yes? If not, I'd like to hear more about it -- location/etc.

kim.

Hey Sammy !!!! Welcome back(?)

I was not knocking the BAE kit, I was referring to Chappy "rigging" a sensor to the stock cold start valve...I know it has been done successfully, but if not careful, it can be a costly.....see you at Dunkels

Hi guys. Thanks for the welcome.
i agree that using a cold start injector in the stock location might be a gamble, he's using an injector that's located in the turbo compressor discharge piping so it has time to atomize before going through the throttle body.
it would only be injecting diring periods of boost so the air vewlocities should be adequate to prevent pooling and the air temps would also be high, aiding atomization. As long as all 6 cylinders get the same amount of additional fuel there isn't a problem. If the distribution of fuel is not even it could burn a piston.

I... I mean my "friend" is planning to use a good air/fuel ratio meter to monitor things as he creeps up on the boost. The car already has a turbo whale tail on it so room for an intercooler shouldn't be a problem.

5 psi boost should be good for around 70 additional horsepower which is plenty, for at least a week or two until it gets boring. That's the problem with boost, too much is not enough.

BTW, I prolly won't make dunkel's this year. I'm 23 days into a 35 day, $17 million project with my name on it. I'm putting in 14 hours a day 7 a week so there's not much time for anything else right now, i'll sleep when I'm dead.

I might be able to weasel out for an hour or two but it aint gonna be easy.

Here's some pics of what I'm buried in:

Overview of project:

That yellow crane is rated at 275 ton lifting capacity and is over 200 feet tall.
here's one of a 17,000 horsepower gas expander (power end of a gas turbine) that we are installing:

That better be ball bearing! Or else it will take forever to spool up!!!!

Thats big, cool,

Andrew

I agree with Mueller. DO the turbo, and get a real FI that you can tune with a laptop and a wideband sensor. You need the Fuel/Air ratios to be right or else you are going to have a pile of bits on your hands.

MS is pretty easy and cheap, or there are plenty of aftermarket thingos if you don't want to get into the DIY end of it.

Ok, I went and sprung for it. The bae turbo kit will be on it's way soon. The paint will have to wait a little longer, now comes the fun part figuring out the best place to put it, and how. I always wanted to have a 914 turbo Porsche. Yeee Haaa. I will post as I progress through it as a record to all who may wish to do it in the future.

All Porsche 930 turbos from 1976 thru the later part of the 80s had CIS injection and it works very well with boost.
Up to at least 5 psi a stock N/A CIS system compensates for boost with no other modifications needed. It is after all an air flow sensored system that adjusts for air density and temperature by design. The stock CIS injection on a 3.0 is said to be capable of supporting well over 300 hp.
The reason for the extra injector is not so much to prevent a lean out but more to provide "extra" fuel as a safeguard and to aid in cooling. I could dial the CIS so that it would maintain at least 13 to one at 7# boost, but with a compression ratio of over 9 to one and the crap they call pump gas now days I would feel better having it down around 12 to one while under boost. I know that's a little too rich but it is also safer for the motor.

IMO a DIY fuel injection "kit" is much, much more prone to an OOPS than CIS with an extra injector.

Same goes for aftermarket fuel injection systems. They work great after they are dialed in and the bugs are out, onlyest problem is those bugs can fry an engine before they are sorted out.

To me the CIS route makes much more sense. It's been done many thousands of times with turbocharging.

When the same thing can be said about megasquirt I'll buy it.
I know of two people who have installed megasquirt on a Porsche and have it dialed in. Sure there are more but I only know of two. Neither of the cars are turbocharged.

This megasquirt thing is all fine and dandy but it seems like there are way more people talking about it but very few doing it. I'm a little sceptical. I also don't have time to go around re-inventing the wheel. If I have something that doesn't work I look for a better solution. If I have something that works very good I look for something else to worry about

Up late, Sammy?

Hya JP. Yup, working 5 pm to 7 am 7 days a week. Sux major.
Goofy set in last week, I'm working on zombie mode now.

I will be receiving my bae turbo kit this week and have been putting together parts needed for the install, I will install the an enrichment injector and pressure switch at this time, I'd rather be safe than sorry even if I dont plan on boosting it any higher than 8lbs, knowing me that idea wont last long.
The kit comes complete even has the original instructions. I purchased a msd btm boost retard ignition to replace my msd 6a. I felt the built in rev limiter and the retard control were worth the investment. It will be interesting to see how it will all fit into the 914, what will be useable and what I will have to fabricate. The use of silicone hoses and elbows will make the plumbing easier, I will use pvc plumbing pipe and fittings for the mockup when all seems to fit I will replicate and fabricate in aluminum or steel or with silicone hose and couplings.
I am very excited in starting this project wish me luck. The paint job will have to wait.

TURBO

Join the megasquirt list on Yahoo!. I agree that there are only a couple of porsche's running it, but there are A LOT of other cars running it, and a LOT of other turbo mods, on all kinds of crap from pintos to motorbike engines running in bonneville contenders. There is a huge body of knowledge on it at this stage, it may not be porsche specific, but for that you can talk to the 914 board, rennlist, and pelican.

As for dialling in FI systems, I don't advocate trying to get a turbo running AT ALL without a wideband O2 sensor that is calibrated and working. As far as I'm concerned, if you don't have a quantitative AFR measurement, you ain't got nuthin'.

Turbo update, Intake is roughed in as you will see in the pictures, the crossover pipe with the turbo flange and wastegate is being fabricated and I'm waiting on the turbo rebuild. I have a Tilton electric oil pump to drain the oil from the turbo as I couldnt mount it high enough for a natural drain that was the only problem that Ive encountered so far, everything else has fallen into place. After I get it all plumbed together I will post the complete process of how to do it. I will be using a Tial wastegate,and bov, A turbo X boost controller, a 3lb pressure switch to activate a 911 SC cold start valve mounted just below the throttle body for enrichment, and will use a MSD boost retard ignition system.
I dont plan on boosting much higher than 8lbs to start with because the 901 and clutch will be at there limit at 300hp.

914 6 3.0 turbo

914 6 3.0 turbo

I was wunderin about using a BOV on CIS. Seems to me that you will be relieving pressurized air to atmosphere, after that air has been metered by the air flow metering thingy.

Do you think that will make it go rich when the BOV opens?
The CIS would be thinking that air is going in the engine and adding fuel to compensate when in reality the air isn't going in the engine.

Any thots? Heck it might be an easy way to fuel enrichment, set the wastegate to 15, set the BOV to 8 and let the metering take care of adding extra fuel under boost.
I'm just kidding of course. That would be a waste of energy using exhaust gas pressure to compress air and then send it off to never never land, but it does make the gears start spinnin.................