My 3.0 and tranny are at my mechanics shop for some work and while talking to him he suggested I cut the engine shroud in half behind the alternator from side to side. He stated if this was done in the future if the alternator had to be replaced it is much easier as the induction system ( carbs ) won't have to be disturbed. You simply unbolt the front portion of the shroud and you now have access to the alternator. It sounds like it makes a lot of common sense so anyone out there done this? You have to fab up some kind of lip/cover to bridge where you cut but that should be pretty easy. Thoughts?

can't speak for carbed cars, but on my FI motor, i didn't have to take the shroud off at all ...

i did have to remove the upper intake as it's in the way, but the alternator came out just fine with the shroud in place ...
Andy

Yer wrench is an idiot.....

I'm dealing with three daughters and a wife right now that just came back from a weeks vacation.......


Yer wrench is FUCKING idiot.....






OK....I feell better....



But yer wrench is STILL an idiot......










I need a cocktail.........













Did I mention how much of idiot yer wrench is??????



















Ummm, OK.....I'm drunk now.....where's that idiot wrench...I needs to slap his ass.......


If it's my brother in law....tell him mom says hi....

A most eloquent statement there Mike .......

Glad to see you back in form ...................

I'm out of line?

Cutting a shroud in half.....That's got to be the stupidest suggestion I've seen since the chopstick thingy....

Andy the pic of your shroud is much different then mine. It appears yours has access already built into the shroud. As you know on most 911 engine shrouds it goes up and around the top of the alternator housing. I don't see ANY way to remove the alternator once the engine is in place without removing the shroud? And to remove the shroud you have to take off the intake manifolds? So I think my mechanic ( not an idiot ) has made a good suggestion. If someone knows how to remove and replace an alternator on a 3.0 in a 914 without removing the cooling shroud I'm listening

Well, I do Agree with Andy and Mike. I don't see why you would need to remove the shrouding to get to the alt. Anyhow, it did make me laugh Mike

I would say the guy is an idiot though. He may just have different ideas

Maybe I'm not explaining this correctly, cutting it in half may be a overstatement. I'm thinking if you were to draw a line from side to side behind the alternator that would be the " cut line ". So if an alternator had to be replaced while the engine is in the car you could unbolt just that section without disturbing the intake system at all.

I've done it....not a huge problem.

O.K. here is a pic of my engine with the shroud in place. If the cooling fan is basically against the firewall how do you remove the alternator with the shroud in place?

I agree

Big deal, you have to pull the carbs.... really just un-snap some linkage undo an extra couple of bolts, then unbolt and remove the shroud, easy access to the alt..

How does your wrench suggest sealing the cut? for example if the cut is made with a saw with a 1/16 kerf.. you now have an extra 1/8 gap where cooling air can escape. and of course since the integrity of the shroud it gone... things will never line up "exactly perfect"

Don't do it

I can have the carbs off in 20-30 minutes. Its not really a big deal

Also how often do alternators fail?

You guys really need to look in the Classic Thread forum...

How to remove your alternator in your Six without removing the intake system.

That certainly helped me understand how it can be done, looks like a real PITA. Thanks for the feedback gentleman.

Planning on replacing your alt very often?

Shock value.....if you need a mechanic to change out an alternator, you may need to think about having a 914. The list has been kind of mundane of late.

I was trying to make a point...alts very rarely fail. Pulling an alt with carbs is a 3.5-4 on a scale of 1-10 when the engine is INSIDE the engine bay.....it's not that much harder outside.

Doing it with CIS, MFI or any other fuel injection is simply practice for when something else screws up. Hell, if Clay can do it while standing on a foot stool...anyone can....

If you have a check book, this isn't the car for you.

Not an insult Mike .... rather a compliment ..........

I have gone thru this car from one end to another doing all the work myself. It's taken me two years and I'm getting close to installing the engine. This was intended to be a discussion to see if there might be a easier way to change the alternator once the engine is in the car. I'm a average DIYer and have learned to weld on GT flares, weld in chassis stiffening kits etc. but having said that sometimes I just don't want to deal with things and will pull out the wallet. I have a 1983 SC and it is rock solid reliable, should I expect the 914 to not be as reliable? I have replaced EVERYTHING under the car that can be changed, installed Elephant Racing polybronze on all four corners. Brakes are 911 M calipers on all four corners. New bearings,turbo tie rod ends,new Kennedy Engineering pressure plate,clutch disc,TO bearing etc. The engine is being gone thru as we speak. Distributor is being refurbished/recurved to work with the carbs.New SS fuel lines installed. New master cylinder and all new brake hardlines. You get the picture. So in my mind the only thing left to " breakdown " is electrical. I expect this car to be drop dead reliable after all the new parts and work, is that an unreasonable thought?

No. Which is why there's no point stressing about replacing an alternator that will probably work just fine for another 20 years.

A bit off topic but you may want to consider larger front brakes.

Yep, alts are pretty robust....I've only had one alt go in 30 years of playing with P-cars. One alternative is to cut an access port in the firewall. "Some" like it as the belt change is easier. I don't recommend that either but it makes more sense than slicing the shroud in half.

I also have had no problem with a belt change as-is. Clay says he's done an MFI belt change as well....

i guess the factory got smart after 30 years ...

the 3.6L engine i have allows for removal of the top part of the shroud.
Andy

Hmmmmmmm the factory has done what my mechanic has suggested and he's called an idiot
I am also thinking about cutting an access panel in the firewall
It's all good

Ah - no. The factory made a new, proper part.
If you'd said "my mechanic suggested using the 3,6 fan shroud" we'd probably have just said "cool idea, go for it."



People do it. Some ways are better than others at keeping the FIRE on the other side of the WALL.

My thoughts on this is make a outline of where the cut is going to be. Go ahead and complete the cut. You now have a piece of metal in your hands ( access panel ). Now weld a 1 inch lip onto the access panel. Drill holes in that lip and mount to the firewall with sheet metal screws. If there ever was a fire I'm sure this would be the least of my worries.

I'm not trying to be combative I just asked a question. Some folks I thought were a little aggressive with their replies and seeing that the factory decided to do a similiar " upgrade " to the shroud they must have thought it was a good idea?
In the end we each can mod our cars as we seem fit because we are paying the bill.

Sounds like a lot of work fabbing and welding the lip. I think I'd probably just make a new panel from mild steel sheet. I don't like sheet metal screws poking into the engine room - too many scars on my hands from finding them. I think a better way would be to use some quarter-turn fasteners similar to Dzsus fasteners.


I'm not in a position to defend the replies of others...

I've *always* said "It's your car, do what you want..."

I was insulting your wrench, not you. Do whatever floats your boat. I also gave you a more "accepatable" alternative that's common.

This place can be a rough room....if you felt "I" was attacking you, I wasn't...

Notching a fan shroud to allow alternator removal is something I have no problem with. Now cutting a hole in a FIREWALL is something I think is stupid.


But it is your car, and your ass to burn up in an engine fire.



(Picks up soapbox and carries it off...)

Everyones opinion has value and no I don't feel like I was personally attacked. In regards to the cutting of the firewall two things come to mind.
1. The access hole will be covered with the same gauge metal that is being removed and it will overlap the outline of the cut.
2. If there ever is a fire I don't plan on staying in the interior of the car to see if the flames come thru the access panel, I plan on getting out.

Think of this my diminutive tejan friend ... if the fire is that bad to come through a covered hole in the firewall, the back window will have blown out long before.

i dont see a problem with this the 1/4 turn fasteners would be a better idea and if you make a gasket around the edge with kaowool (ceramic glass wool used in furnace combustion chambers) or some other ceramic fabric it would probably be explosion proof, especially if you use 16 ga metal that might be the only part of the car left. p.s. boxsters have said firewall acess panel... just saying.

I had a hole and some diamond plate that was secured by a latch mechanism that crossed the entire square. I hated to cut the hole, but it made tuning and maintenance SOOO much easier.

BTW, neighbor I am thinking of moving to Wilkes-Barre to attend Geisinger's Emergency Medicine program.

(Puts soapbox down and steps onto it....)

When you are doing 70 on the freeway in the left lane and you realize that there are FLAMES shooting up from the engine compartment behind you, you do not want ANY possible way of them getting into the passenger compartment while you are getting the car stopped and getting the hell out of it.


Been there, Done that. Not going to do that again.


All 914s I own will have stainless steel fuel lines installed and a solid firewall with no holes.......


(steps down from soapbox, picks it up and walks away)

KILLER! move it up maybe you can help me tackle some outers if you are feeling bored haha