Nice work!
Want to see Penny in the magazine this fall.
John
Nice work!
Want to see Penny in the magazine this fall.
John
It's aliveeeeeee!
Despite the progress last week getting the car started I still had some issues. When I started up Penny I noticed something strange. The engine idled about 2500 rpm. This was way too high. At first I thought the idle control valve was not working. When I unplugged it the idle dropped about 200 rpm. Yep, it was working. Logical conclusion... Air leak.
I was gone all week traveling for work. I could not stop thinking about it so I came home at lunch Friday and cranked up the compressor. I used the manifold pressure inlet line and put about 30 psi on it. HMM that tell-tale hissing means there is more than just leaking from the throttle body. I start feeling around. All the vacuum lines were connected properly. It was not the purge valve that part of the crank breather. I finally got my hand down under the manifold and found it - a huge leak.
The head and intake manifold were not mating well. The Suby motor uses a pressed metal gasket and I did slightly bend it when pulling off the intake. It really sucks when the gasket sticks to the manifold on one end and the head on the other. Of course, there is no room to get your hand in there to separate so you just pull. My mistake. At least I had another set from the second motor.
The other night I pulled the intake. Of course, this means removing the intercooler, the DS turbo and a bunch of connections. I admit the single turbo setup is considerably less complicated. I only loosened up enough to lift up the intake and slide out the old gasket. Yep, it was crinkled like a potato chip. I got the new gasket, slathered a very thin layer of CurilT as extra insurance and got it back into place. Next, I tightened up the intake bolts and pressurized to about 40psi. No more leak! It holds pressure nicely so it should be ready for boost.
Shifter: I found a crack in the cable housing support. This keeps the housing of the push-pull cables on the shifter from sliding back and forth. I started to epoxy the crack and then decided it was not worth the chance of breaking again. So I made a new aluminum support. I might have to break down and order some custom cables for replacement. I also changed the cable routing for a smoother arc. big improvement. This should smooth out the shifting and reduce the effort. Actually, its not bad now. It feels like a 911 shifter the first time you shift with new bushings. Tight but direct.
I think I may have figured out the cooling system. I was previously purging all the air out but it would boil over at the first sign of heat. After much deliberation including complete removal of the thermostat I found that had the overflow canister connected to the wrong port on the purge canister. I just switched two hoses and everything seems to be working fine.
The overflow tank has three ports. One is the return line from the heater circuit and water cooling jackets, the second I had connected to the overflow tank and the third was not-connected. When pressure would build in the system it would just blow coolant out into the overflow tank. I just capped this second hose off after checking the factory manual. I found that this connection is an air-=bubble return on the automatic radiator bleed system. I do not need it since I have a remote bleeder at the front of the car. I capped this off and moved my overflow tank connection to the third port. The system pressurizes and seems to be bleeding correctly. Radiator is plenty hot. I now have to hook up the laptop and verify my temperatures.
I think I might be on the downhill slope to keeping Penny cool.
Until next time.
Oh Yeah, I did take Penny for a drive around the block. I scared some neighbors in the process.
. Nothing like a twin turbo open pipe/zork setup. I will start to fabricate some new mufflers this week to quiet it down.
I will get the wideband connected this week sometime and then start tuning it. The previous tune runs a little lean and has poor throttle transition. I am not taking it into boost until I can verify the AFR. Easy to fix.
I also need to get the tach working again. I am having a signal problem.
I was gone all week traveling for work. I could not stop thinking about it so I came home at lunch Friday and cranked up the compressor. I used the manifold pressure inlet line and put about 30 psi on it. HMM that tell-tale hissing means there is more than just leaking from the throttle body. I start feeling around. All the vacuum lines were connected properly. It was not the purge valve that part of the crank breather. I finally got my hand down under the manifold and found it - a huge leak.
The head and intake manifold were not mating well. The Suby motor uses a pressed metal gasket and I did slightly bend it when pulling off the intake. It really sucks when the gasket sticks to the manifold on one end and the head on the other. Of course, there is no room to get your hand in there to separate so you just pull. My mistake. At least I had another set from the second motor.
The other night I pulled the intake. Of course, this means removing the intercooler, the DS turbo and a bunch of connections. I admit the single turbo setup is considerably less complicated. I only loosened up enough to lift up the intake and slide out the old gasket. Yep, it was crinkled like a potato chip. I got the new gasket, slathered a very thin layer of CurilT as extra insurance and got it back into place. Next, I tightened up the intake bolts and pressurized to about 40psi. No more leak! It holds pressure nicely so it should be ready for boost.
Shifter: I found a crack in the cable housing support. This keeps the housing of the push-pull cables on the shifter from sliding back and forth. I started to epoxy the crack and then decided it was not worth the chance of breaking again. So I made a new aluminum support. I might have to break down and order some custom cables for replacement. I also changed the cable routing for a smoother arc. big improvement. This should smooth out the shifting and reduce the effort. Actually, its not bad now. It feels like a 911 shifter the first time you shift with new bushings. Tight but direct.
I think I may have figured out the cooling system. I was previously purging all the air out but it would boil over at the first sign of heat. After much deliberation including complete removal of the thermostat I found that had the overflow canister connected to the wrong port on the purge canister. I just switched two hoses and everything seems to be working fine.
The overflow tank has three ports. One is the return line from the heater circuit and water cooling jackets, the second I had connected to the overflow tank and the third was not-connected. When pressure would build in the system it would just blow coolant out into the overflow tank. I just capped this second hose off after checking the factory manual. I found that this connection is an air-=bubble return on the automatic radiator bleed system. I do not need it since I have a remote bleeder at the front of the car. I capped this off and moved my overflow tank connection to the third port. The system pressurizes and seems to be bleeding correctly. Radiator is plenty hot. I now have to hook up the laptop and verify my temperatures.
I think I might be on the downhill slope to keeping Penny cool.
Until next time.
Oh Yeah, I did take Penny for a drive around the block. I scared some neighbors in the process.
. Nothing like a twin turbo open pipe/zork setup. I will start to fabricate some new mufflers this week to quiet it down. I will get the wideband connected this week sometime and then start tuning it. The previous tune runs a little lean and has poor throttle transition. I am not taking it into boost until I can verify the AFR. Easy to fix.
I also need to get the tach working again. I am having a signal problem.
Finally making progress.
1. High Idle. I previously fixed a high idle. But the idle was still too high. All the adjustment had been dialed out of the throttle body. The plate was as close as I could get it without scraping the sidewall. My last suspect was a sticking idle air control valve (IAC).
Tonight I went out and pulled it off the car. I thought it had the typical dirt problem and just needed to be cleaned. Then I discovered that the vane is connected to the solenoid with a magnetic pin. The vane is adjustable and had come out of adjustment. So, I cleaned it, adjusted on the bench and put some power to it. It opened as it should. Back in the car, turned the key and then unplugged the valve. Worked perfectly. Idle is now adjusted to about 700 rpm.
2. Mixture. The mixture always seemed a little lean. I could not verify previously because the narrow band O2 sensor just was not accurate. I connected an Innovate LC1 and have it working properly. What a big difference. Yes, the car was a bit lean for me. Now I can properly tune the car.
3. Steering wheel. The stock wheel was in great condition. Too bad my knees and the bottom of the wheel are just too intimate. So, I swapped it for an old Momo wheel I had on the shelf. Much better clearance. Next step is to pull the hub and modify it for the back collar and horn ring. 4 holes to drill and tap and I am all set. I am probably going to put a quick release on it as well. Once I put a decent seat in the car it will simplify egress.
4. Door handle. The DS exterior door handle quit working. Today I pulled apart the door to investigate. I found that stupid plastic part that pushed on the release catch to be laying in the bottom of the door. I guess Its time to fix that. I also lubricated the door latch assembly and window frame. They are both happy and moving freely now.
Next step is to put some type of muffler on the car. I am going to run twin can mufflers off each turbo and then bring them together GT3 style behind the transmission. Should look pretty cool when finished.
1. High Idle. I previously fixed a high idle. But the idle was still too high. All the adjustment had been dialed out of the throttle body. The plate was as close as I could get it without scraping the sidewall. My last suspect was a sticking idle air control valve (IAC).
Tonight I went out and pulled it off the car. I thought it had the typical dirt problem and just needed to be cleaned. Then I discovered that the vane is connected to the solenoid with a magnetic pin. The vane is adjustable and had come out of adjustment. So, I cleaned it, adjusted on the bench and put some power to it. It opened as it should. Back in the car, turned the key and then unplugged the valve. Worked perfectly. Idle is now adjusted to about 700 rpm.
2. Mixture. The mixture always seemed a little lean. I could not verify previously because the narrow band O2 sensor just was not accurate. I connected an Innovate LC1 and have it working properly. What a big difference. Yes, the car was a bit lean for me. Now I can properly tune the car.
3. Steering wheel. The stock wheel was in great condition. Too bad my knees and the bottom of the wheel are just too intimate. So, I swapped it for an old Momo wheel I had on the shelf. Much better clearance. Next step is to pull the hub and modify it for the back collar and horn ring. 4 holes to drill and tap and I am all set. I am probably going to put a quick release on it as well. Once I put a decent seat in the car it will simplify egress.
4. Door handle. The DS exterior door handle quit working. Today I pulled apart the door to investigate. I found that stupid plastic part that pushed on the release catch to be laying in the bottom of the door. I guess Its time to fix that. I also lubricated the door latch assembly and window frame. They are both happy and moving freely now.
Next step is to put some type of muffler on the car. I am going to run twin can mufflers off each turbo and then bring them together GT3 style behind the transmission. Should look pretty cool when finished.
Yesterday I managed a little time in the garage to do some cutting and welding. Usually this is too loud late at night after work. So I had a large bin of misc. mandrel bends from last year. Dug them out and found a few that fit my needs. The result after an hour or so was twin exhaust off the twin turbo. Later tonight I can pull each side off and finish weld the connections. I eventually plan to connect the rear with a gt3 style pipe around the rear valence. That will wait.
Today I got the exhaust welded up. I also swapped out the old MOMO wheel that was on the shelf. Its very worn and split but fits so much better. I had fun drilling the back of the hub to accept the filler cap and horn ring. I did not realize that the installation was so much different than a 911. Now if I could just get a horn button that fits everything would be great. The one I have is too large OD.
Late this afternoon I took the car out for a little run. I was never more than 2 blocks from the house considering I did not have plates and the numbers on the side kinda call attention to the car. Tuning the car is much different than the 911. I have to rethink the AFRs where the car is happy. It likes to run much leaner than a 911. Must be those modern 4 valve heads with a central spark plug. I have not even started tuning timing yet until I have the AFR in check.
I have to say the blow off valve makes cool noises when it dumps. It even kicks in when the car is not under boost. This means I am quickly pressurizing the IC but not actually the intake. I never went over 14% TPS according to the datalog.
I GOTTA GET PLATES AND TIRES. I so want to have fun and start driving it.
Today I got the exhaust welded up. I also swapped out the old MOMO wheel that was on the shelf. Its very worn and split but fits so much better. I had fun drilling the back of the hub to accept the filler cap and horn ring. I did not realize that the installation was so much different than a 911. Now if I could just get a horn button that fits everything would be great. The one I have is too large OD.
Late this afternoon I took the car out for a little run. I was never more than 2 blocks from the house considering I did not have plates and the numbers on the side kinda call attention to the car. Tuning the car is much different than the 911. I have to rethink the AFRs where the car is happy. It likes to run much leaner than a 911. Must be those modern 4 valve heads with a central spark plug. I have not even started tuning timing yet until I have the AFR in check.
I have to say the blow off valve makes cool noises when it dumps. It even kicks in when the car is not under boost. This means I am quickly pressurizing the IC but not actually the intake. I never went over 14% TPS according to the datalog.
I GOTTA GET PLATES AND TIRES. I so want to have fun and start driving it.
jamie,
loved reading thru your thread. great work!!!
not sure if this would be any help but this is from my current tune. i dont know how to convert g/rev that the stock ecu uses to kPa that ms uses but perhaps as a reference its useful
loved reading thru your thread. great work!!!
not sure if this would be any help but this is from my current tune. i dont know how to convert g/rev that the stock ecu uses to kPa that ms uses but perhaps as a reference its useful
Ron, How much boost are you running at WOT? This will allow me to convert the g/rev. This is a mass airflow conversion based on density and stroke volume for load.
WOT 18#
Displacement 2.0L
note: I am running AVCS so that will alter base timing. let me boot up the laptop and ill screen shot that as well.
this will be interesting to see the conversion.
Displacement 2.0L
note: I am running AVCS so that will alter base timing. let me boot up the laptop and ill screen shot that as well.
this will be interesting to see the conversion.
Cool. What is your boost control profile?
Also, Are you taking it to 8K? I have only been to about 5K with mine so far.
Also, Are you taking it to 8K? I have only been to about 5K with mine so far.
I am running a manual boost controller. both tuners i interviewed (one of whom did my tune) discouraged the ebc or even the hybrid i initially had set up. they said they'd do it but stated the tune with the mbc would be better so i pulled the ebc and just ran a straight mbc
here is the avcs table
here is the avcs table
oh and yes, taken to 8K
btw, ive got an extra MBC if you want it, a donation to the 2013 Build. its the one on the Left. the one of the right is the ebc i was going to run.
btw, ive got an extra MBC if you want it, a donation to the 2013 Build. its the one on the Left. the one of the right is the ebc i was going to run.
OK. g/rev = (pulse width / (2707.09 / injector flow rate))
Are you running stock injectors? These should be 540cc/hr. If so, I can easily calculate a pw table for MS.
The timing table really helps too.
Are you running stock injectors? These should be 540cc/hr. If so, I can easily calculate a pw table for MS.
The timing table really helps too.
Great suggestion on the boost controller. I currently integrated the MS to the stock boost controller but I think it is dumping before I get boost. Safety factor while I get the car running well.
they are the stock ones yes, pink's and i believe that is correct flow rate.
pm me your address and i'll send off the mbc tomorrow.
edit: in the interim, just hook up the nipple on the compressor housing directly to the iwg (bypassing any controller). then you will have around 8# boost, the least you can have. this is the force the from iwg spring holding the wg shut.
pm me your address and i'll send off the mbc tomorrow.
edit: in the interim, just hook up the nipple on the compressor housing directly to the iwg (bypassing any controller). then you will have around 8# boost, the least you can have. this is the force the from iwg spring holding the wg shut.
Amazing and inspiring build!
I have not yet purchased my first 914, trying to get a feel for them first. Your thread is great! Thank you for detailing so much!
I have not yet purchased my first 914, trying to get a feel for them first. Your thread is great! Thank you for detailing so much!
@Chi Town - Thanks for the compliments
Ron, Do you have any pulsewidth numbers? Your fuel table is the target AFR for the open loop running. this is a strange way of presenting load as it should be a target table for a closed-loop system.
Ron, Do you have any pulsewidth numbers? Your fuel table is the target AFR for the open loop running. this is a strange way of presenting load as it should be a target table for a closed-loop system.
QUOTE(jpnovak @ Feb 18 2013, 01:34 PM) 
@Chi Town - Thanks for the compliments
Ron, Do you have any pulsewidth numbers? Your fuel table is the target AFR for the open loop running. this is a strange way of presenting load as it should be a target table for a closed-loop system.
no, no pw numbers. i thought it was odd too. cant really wrap my brain around how the ecu responds to inputs and the tuning methodology. its not like the MS that uses the fuel/VE table for a fixed amount of fuel delivered under open loop situations. in the case of closed loop, compares measured ARF to the target AFR table and increases / decreases fuel from the VE table via pwm or something to that effect. this would be for closed loop operation or when tuning with VEAL or even manual by look at logs via mlv. this is a comparison of load (kpa) vs engine speed (rpm)
suby really relies on MAF and engine speed. MAF is basically a hot wire and is at a specific temperature, the more air passes over it, the cooler it will become. the ecu then adds more voltage to the MAF wire to heat it to that temp up and thus is able to determine how much air is flowing into the system based on that additional voltage. with that and the engine speed it knows where it is on the table. it compares the AFR to the target and give it more/less fuel. but what i dont get is how much fuel does it know to start with ??? closed or open. i dont get it
Ron, I think I cracked the code.
The 2.8 value should correspond to your 18psi. If you scale the rest of the values by a (260kPa/18psi) the lowest value corresponds to 23 kPa. My car idles about 31 kPa so this is just about right to idle in the lowest corner of the map.
The rest of the values are just a linear distribution of the load table. In my case, I just scale by MAP reading. Simple. Effective.
Now if I could just figure out a way so that I did not have to type all those numbers in by hand. Ouch!
I can use the timing table and the target AFR table. Your cam setup will be slightly different and this will effect fuel values. No problem. I will just tune to the target AFR. Easy. I admit I was unsure how lean/rich to make these engines under boost. I found some info that said 11:1 under WOT boost was a great target. I see you are mostly a 10.8:1 so this is slightly more rich.
I am also surprised how much timing is pulled out at 18psi. Must be ready for a big bang to delay timing and pressure onset that late. Such great information.
Tomorrow I can start the number input game.
The 2.8 value should correspond to your 18psi. If you scale the rest of the values by a (260kPa/18psi) the lowest value corresponds to 23 kPa. My car idles about 31 kPa so this is just about right to idle in the lowest corner of the map.
The rest of the values are just a linear distribution of the load table. In my case, I just scale by MAP reading. Simple. Effective.
Now if I could just figure out a way so that I did not have to type all those numbers in by hand. Ouch!
I can use the timing table and the target AFR table. Your cam setup will be slightly different and this will effect fuel values. No problem. I will just tune to the target AFR. Easy. I admit I was unsure how lean/rich to make these engines under boost. I found some info that said 11:1 under WOT boost was a great target. I see you are mostly a 10.8:1 so this is slightly more rich.
I am also surprised how much timing is pulled out at 18psi. Must be ready for a big bang to delay timing and pressure onset that late. Such great information.
Tomorrow I can start the number input game.
Jamie,
thats awesome. glad you were able to use it. now to enter 18x16 tables by hand. watch out for carpal tunnel syndrome
oh, i was reading for FMIC 11:1 to 11.5:1 while TMIC 10.5:1 to 11:1 as a guide for reliable power but for more aggressive tune, up to 12:1 yikes!
i want video since you dont post pics fucker
thats awesome. glad you were able to use it. now to enter 18x16 tables by hand. watch out for carpal tunnel syndrome
oh, i was reading for FMIC 11:1 to 11.5:1 while TMIC 10.5:1 to 11:1 as a guide for reliable power but for more aggressive tune, up to 12:1 yikes!
i want video since you dont post pics fucker
I guess Ron thinks I don't have any pictures.
First, how many Victoracers can you fit in the trunk of your daily driver? In my case, One, Two, Thrr-eee. It takes 3 VictoRacers to fill up the daily driver trunk.
Armed with new rubber I went on to the next step. Today I started to tune the motor. Mostly low rpm. Still have not achieved boost. I need someone to drive while I tune. Auto tune (VEAL) works but I prefer to tune by hand.
Anyway, here are some pictures in the driveway.
First, how many Victoracers can you fit in the trunk of your daily driver? In my case, One, Two, Thrr-eee. It takes 3 VictoRacers to fill up the daily driver trunk.
Armed with new rubber I went on to the next step. Today I started to tune the motor. Mostly low rpm. Still have not achieved boost. I need someone to drive while I tune. Auto tune (VEAL) works but I prefer to tune by hand.
Anyway, here are some pictures in the driveway.
The car runs well around the neighborhood. Still need legal tags to venture farther away. These are in the works. At least insurance is current.
I am finally starting to tune the EFI system. What fun this is. Drive around until you reach a point where the car runs like crap, look at the AFR and realize its too lean, start adding fuel and feel the car gain torque. Keep adding fuel until you have a stable AFR and feel the car really want more throttle and is happy. Rinse, Repeat.
Then go back at look at the fuel map and realize that you are dumping crazy amounts of fuel when the car comes into boost. Some would say, nothing good can come from this much fuel requirement. Some might say that the car is making considerably more horsepower in twin turbo trim that the base map from the single turbo trim. Otherwise there is no explanation for requiring that much more fuel.
And I only have the car limited to about 8psi right now. Wait till I get to 18!
Yes, it is my current mid-engine rocket ship.
Then go back at look at the fuel map and realize that you are dumping crazy amounts of fuel when the car comes into boost. Some would say, nothing good can come from this much fuel requirement. Some might say that the car is making considerably more horsepower in twin turbo trim that the base map from the single turbo trim. Otherwise there is no explanation for requiring that much more fuel.
And I only have the car limited to about 8psi right now. Wait till I get to 18!
Yes, it is my current mid-engine rocket ship.
All I have to say about that is
Car gets to be a LOT of fun when that boost comes in, doesn't it? You totally stop trying to drive subtle. Lee. Aim and shoot, hold on, repeat. It's serious fun, and mine isn't even as strong as yours.
.
Car gets to be a LOT of fun when that boost comes in, doesn't it? You totally stop trying to drive subtle. Lee. Aim and shoot, hold on, repeat. It's serious fun, and mine isn't even as strong as yours.
.
Yes, I will use VEAL. However, I start with datalogs and roughing in the map by hand. This allows me to have VEAL make minor adjustments where it works best. I have found that if the map is way off VEAL is difficult to control. If you give it more authority to make changes it will start to change where you don't want it to.
The best method is to have someone else drive while I tune. Much faster process. But, I don't have a passenger seat and that makes it difficult right now. But if that is the worst of my problems from here on out I will be fine.
The best method is to have someone else drive while I tune. Much faster process. But, I don't have a passenger seat and that makes it difficult right now. But if that is the worst of my problems from here on out I will be fine.
bump for an update
Hey Ron,
Let's see...
I managed to get a new driver's seat installed. I picked up a GT3 fixed back replica seat a few months ago for $99 on ebay. Carbon fiber goodness but the stock seat is still lighter. This one offers significantly more support.
Otherwise, I am still tuning the car but I do not have a lot of time to devote to it. I really need large blocks of time (1.5 hours) of driving but the schedule has not allowed.
When tuning I ran out of VE table space (max 255) and had to rescale the table by increasing the req_fuel value and scaling the VE table down the same percentage. I should now have enough room to dump more fuel under boost. Of course, this has slightly messed up my midrange. Its just not as smooth as it could be.
I continue to work on it.
Let's see...
I managed to get a new driver's seat installed. I picked up a GT3 fixed back replica seat a few months ago for $99 on ebay. Carbon fiber goodness but the stock seat is still lighter. This one offers significantly more support.
Otherwise, I am still tuning the car but I do not have a lot of time to devote to it. I really need large blocks of time (1.5 hours) of driving but the schedule has not allowed.
When tuning I ran out of VE table space (max 255) and had to rescale the table by increasing the req_fuel value and scaling the VE table down the same percentage. I should now have enough room to dump more fuel under boost. Of course, this has slightly messed up my midrange. Its just not as smooth as it could be.
I continue to work on it.
So, Its been a few weeks since I updated the thread.
1. two weeks ago I had a CV joint come apart while tuning. The inner subaru came apart when the retaining clip came off. No damage but I had to wait for some parts. In the end, the axle on the DS was 3/8" too short and that was the root cause. I had to fabricate a new axle and get it installed. That was completed last night and the car is driving again.
2. tuning. The car is running well at most of the NA sites. I am now ready to start creeping into boost. I am taking my time since I don't want to blow this up while driving.
3. I completely revamped the braking system to stock. I refinished the rotors and installed some Ferodo DS2500 pads. These are a long time favorite dual purpose street/track pad that are cheap compared to others. What a difference. The car stops appropriately now.
4. Suspension... During the tuning process I have blown out both front shocks. Now you know what happens when you let your car sit untouched for 9 years. The seals will go and fluid will spill. Let's just say that the car will bottom out on every small bump now. Yeah, they are that bad. Digging through my stash to see if there are some old inserts laying around.
5. Track time... I had signed up for an open track day tomorrow (May 18). The car is not ready since its not tuned and the front shocks are blown. So I will take the bimmer DD instead and have some fun. Next time I am taking Penny.
6. Finally got my lost title replaced. Should have it registered next week and can finally start a real tuning process.
I promise to post video once the car is running properly.
1. two weeks ago I had a CV joint come apart while tuning. The inner subaru came apart when the retaining clip came off. No damage but I had to wait for some parts. In the end, the axle on the DS was 3/8" too short and that was the root cause. I had to fabricate a new axle and get it installed. That was completed last night and the car is driving again.
2. tuning. The car is running well at most of the NA sites. I am now ready to start creeping into boost. I am taking my time since I don't want to blow this up while driving.
3. I completely revamped the braking system to stock. I refinished the rotors and installed some Ferodo DS2500 pads. These are a long time favorite dual purpose street/track pad that are cheap compared to others. What a difference. The car stops appropriately now.
4. Suspension... During the tuning process I have blown out both front shocks. Now you know what happens when you let your car sit untouched for 9 years. The seals will go and fluid will spill. Let's just say that the car will bottom out on every small bump now. Yeah, they are that bad. Digging through my stash to see if there are some old inserts laying around.
5. Track time... I had signed up for an open track day tomorrow (May 18). The car is not ready since its not tuned and the front shocks are blown. So I will take the bimmer DD instead and have some fun. Next time I am taking Penny.
6. Finally got my lost title replaced. Should have it registered next week and can finally start a real tuning process.
I promise to post video once the car is running properly.
Let's see where are we with this project. I finally connected with the PO and got the title signed over. It took longer than expected to get the replacement for the lost title.
Penny is now legal for driving. To celebrate I took her out on a nice drive this morning to meet some friends for breakfast. Its funny driving a fully stickered up car around town. Lots of waves and thumbs up. Also lots of drivers that ignore everything around them. Yes, its the usual.
Anyway... I finally managed to get the cooling system working. I stay right around 195 even in the triple digit TX heat. I have fought corrosion in the motor, air bubbles, and a few other problems. What finally worked? 20% antifreeze, a bottle of water wetter and the rest distilled water. Burp well. Bleed well and then allow the system to work. The biggest improvement was the etching flush I made with oxalic acid to get rid of the old scale and rust. The owner of this engine must have let water sit in the system. Lots of yucky crud came out during the flush. Glad that's over.
The engine is tuned nicely. Currently running 12psi boost. The car is really quick as it is. I will still work through tuning to 18psi as I get time.
Now my problem is fuel delivery. The new Bosch fuel pump I installed a few months ago just took a dump. I was wondering why the car kept going lean above 3K. Turns out it just can not deliver enough fuel. Tomorrow morning I will get a new one and have that fixed. Only takes a few minutes to swap them out. I think it takes longer to remove the access panel and unbolt the pump compared to swapping lines on it.
After the new pump is installed I will get some video up and take some new pictures. I am just glad to be able to drive outside my neighborhood.
Penny is now legal for driving. To celebrate I took her out on a nice drive this morning to meet some friends for breakfast. Its funny driving a fully stickered up car around town. Lots of waves and thumbs up. Also lots of drivers that ignore everything around them. Yes, its the usual.
Anyway... I finally managed to get the cooling system working. I stay right around 195 even in the triple digit TX heat. I have fought corrosion in the motor, air bubbles, and a few other problems. What finally worked? 20% antifreeze, a bottle of water wetter and the rest distilled water. Burp well. Bleed well and then allow the system to work. The biggest improvement was the etching flush I made with oxalic acid to get rid of the old scale and rust. The owner of this engine must have let water sit in the system. Lots of yucky crud came out during the flush. Glad that's over.
The engine is tuned nicely. Currently running 12psi boost. The car is really quick as it is. I will still work through tuning to 18psi as I get time.
Now my problem is fuel delivery. The new Bosch fuel pump I installed a few months ago just took a dump. I was wondering why the car kept going lean above 3K. Turns out it just can not deliver enough fuel. Tomorrow morning I will get a new one and have that fixed. Only takes a few minutes to swap them out. I think it takes longer to remove the access panel and unbolt the pump compared to swapping lines on it.
After the new pump is installed I will get some video up and take some new pictures. I am just glad to be able to drive outside my neighborhood.
congrats jamie, looking forward to seeing / hearing Penny making a few runs
I managed to grab a few videos today. The car is running well now. I am currently at 13psi. Time to start turning up the boost. Though I am not sure how much more these small turbos can crank out.
http://contour.com/stories/file0033--498
http://contour.com/stories/porsche-914-subaru-ej20tt-swap
http://contour.com/stories/file0033--498
http://contour.com/stories/porsche-914-subaru-ej20tt-swap
jamie,
hows the car tuning coming along? you gonna make the 2013 challenge next month? hoping so!
hows the car tuning coming along? you gonna make the 2013 challenge next month? hoping so!
Hey Ron,
No, I am not going to FL for the event. Current work status (and thus financial concerns) have me in a cash conservation mode.
Penny is running and driving great. Registered, legal and lots of fun. In fact, She has been my DD for a few weeks now. Although, I am not quite ready to give up the usual DD.
So, I don't know what will happen to her. I will probably hit a few track events this spring and then she may have to be sold so that I can move on to my next project. I am almost ready for something new.
The one thing I do not like is the TT setup. The turbos spool late and I do not get full boost until after 3500 rpm. The car pulls well to redline (currently 7K) though I am maxing out my injectors under full boost. They exceed their duty cycle and dump fuel by basically staying open. Its not a problem of going lean, Quite the opposite. The car quickly goes rich due to lack of fuel metering control.
Another problem I have had is IC temps. Of course, the car has been in TX and up until last week we have still been in the 90s. I have not driven in the recent cold front and rain to see if this is all under control. I am concerned that the engine bay is siphoning cold air from below, heating it across the engine/exhaust and then pushing hot air across the IC at the top. Remember, the downward airflow in a stock 914 is due to the engine cooling fan - something I am missing.
I may have to reconfigure the IC to get really low charge temps.
So, If anyone is reading and interested please let me know.
No, I am not going to FL for the event. Current work status (and thus financial concerns) have me in a cash conservation mode.
Penny is running and driving great. Registered, legal and lots of fun. In fact, She has been my DD for a few weeks now. Although, I am not quite ready to give up the usual DD.
So, I don't know what will happen to her. I will probably hit a few track events this spring and then she may have to be sold so that I can move on to my next project. I am almost ready for something new.
The one thing I do not like is the TT setup. The turbos spool late and I do not get full boost until after 3500 rpm. The car pulls well to redline (currently 7K) though I am maxing out my injectors under full boost. They exceed their duty cycle and dump fuel by basically staying open. Its not a problem of going lean, Quite the opposite. The car quickly goes rich due to lack of fuel metering control.
Another problem I have had is IC temps. Of course, the car has been in TX and up until last week we have still been in the 90s. I have not driven in the recent cold front and rain to see if this is all under control. I am concerned that the engine bay is siphoning cold air from below, heating it across the engine/exhaust and then pushing hot air across the IC at the top. Remember, the downward airflow in a stock 914 is due to the engine cooling fan - something I am missing.
I may have to reconfigure the IC to get really low charge temps.
So, If anyone is reading and interested please let me know.
Jamie,
sorry to hear about the work status! that really bites. i'll keep my fingers crossed for a speedy resolution to that.
i agree with you on both issues and unfortunately, i think it will take bigger injectors (what size are they currently?) and switching to a water air IC system and remotely mounting the IC radiator (or ice box reservoir it that is sufficient volume.)
hope to see more of the car in action vs selling it for next project but if the next project is another suby conversion, bring it on
sorry to hear about the work status! that really bites. i'll keep my fingers crossed for a speedy resolution to that.
i agree with you on both issues and unfortunately, i think it will take bigger injectors (what size are they currently?) and switching to a water air IC system and remotely mounting the IC radiator (or ice box reservoir it that is sufficient volume.)
hope to see more of the car in action vs selling it for next project but if the next project is another suby conversion, bring it on
Ron, Thanks for the suggestion on larger injectors. I thought I would try another route based on parts availability in the garage. I am finally making progress on Penny.
One of the issues I have had with Penny is that the engine would cut out at high rpm under boost.
I have datalogged and looked and looked to find the problem. The AFR holds steady at 11.1 (good target for boost) until about 4900 rpm. Then all of a sudden it starts to go rich. Despite lowering the fuel value in that area of the map it still goes rich. I finally realized that the injectors were maxing out on the duty cycle. Effectively, the electrical signal is trying to switch on/off faster than the injectors are physically capable of handling. This means they basically stay open and then dump fuel. Too much fuel drops AFR below 10 which causes a rich misfire.
So last night it was time to fix the problem. I did not have larger injectors. But I can make more fuel flow through each cycle by raising fuel pressure. I took a stock Subaru fuel pressure regulator (FPR) and cut the end off. This meant I could pull the regulator portion out. I welded a cap onto the end. I should have taken a picture.
Having bypassed the stock regulator I installed the FPR from the ST. Its adjustable. I raised the pressure from stock 32 to 44. then adjusted the fuel scaling factors and the engine was running well. Basically, I had to lean it out because I was flowing more fuel. on the way to work it would pull to 6K without any issues. It still goes rich but that is a result of tuning, not duty cycle limits. At 6200 and 16psi I was just below 90% duty cycle. The stock injectors did not start having problems until about 95% duty cycle in my previous datalogs. Cool! Now I just need to fine tune the EFI again.
Honestly, she runs even better. I suspect higher fuel pressure is giving slightly better atomization of fuel.
WooHoo!. Oh, and cold weather is good for boost.
Another note. If the stock 420CC injectors are maxing out this should occur at a calculated 270 FWHP. HMM. If I have exceeded that limit I wonder where I am now. How about a little math.
From my calculations increasing the fuel pressure changes should add 6.8% fuel flow. Converting this to HP puts me just over 300. Of course, I am also loosing volumetric efficiency (BSFC). So somewhere close to this is fine with me. The car feels really quick above 4K rpm now.
I will report back after some more tuning.
One of the issues I have had with Penny is that the engine would cut out at high rpm under boost.
I have datalogged and looked and looked to find the problem. The AFR holds steady at 11.1 (good target for boost) until about 4900 rpm. Then all of a sudden it starts to go rich. Despite lowering the fuel value in that area of the map it still goes rich. I finally realized that the injectors were maxing out on the duty cycle. Effectively, the electrical signal is trying to switch on/off faster than the injectors are physically capable of handling. This means they basically stay open and then dump fuel. Too much fuel drops AFR below 10 which causes a rich misfire.
So last night it was time to fix the problem. I did not have larger injectors. But I can make more fuel flow through each cycle by raising fuel pressure. I took a stock Subaru fuel pressure regulator (FPR) and cut the end off. This meant I could pull the regulator portion out. I welded a cap onto the end. I should have taken a picture.
Having bypassed the stock regulator I installed the FPR from the ST. Its adjustable. I raised the pressure from stock 32 to 44. then adjusted the fuel scaling factors and the engine was running well. Basically, I had to lean it out because I was flowing more fuel. on the way to work it would pull to 6K without any issues. It still goes rich but that is a result of tuning, not duty cycle limits. At 6200 and 16psi I was just below 90% duty cycle. The stock injectors did not start having problems until about 95% duty cycle in my previous datalogs. Cool! Now I just need to fine tune the EFI again.
Honestly, she runs even better. I suspect higher fuel pressure is giving slightly better atomization of fuel.
WooHoo!. Oh, and cold weather is good for boost.
Another note. If the stock 420CC injectors are maxing out this should occur at a calculated 270 FWHP. HMM. If I have exceeded that limit I wonder where I am now. How about a little math.
From my calculations increasing the fuel pressure changes should add 6.8% fuel flow. Converting this to HP puts me just over 300. Of course, I am also loosing volumetric efficiency (BSFC). So somewhere close to this is fine with me. The car feels really quick above 4K rpm now.
I will report back after some more tuning.
Penny just keeps getting better. As I finalize the engine tune she is much easier to drive and more responsive. The tach swings very quickly from 4-7K. Yeah!
I did find out that she does not like sitting in traffic. Temperatures begin to climb without airflow.
Doesn't matter, she is still my daily driver for a while until I sort everything out.
I did find out that she does not like sitting in traffic. Temperatures begin to climb without airflow.
Doesn't matter, she is still my daily driver for a while until I sort everything out.
great to hear you were able to incr fp and get a little more out of the injectors! im surprised the stock fp was only 32 psi, i though for sure it would have been in the 40's. i dumped my stock fpr as well and run an aeromotive that was already in my engine bay from the prior ms/t4. i don't recall any change in my tune though going from the stock to the aeromotive which is set at 43psi.
i'll have to look back thru your thread to see how your venting, i think it was to the side in to the wheel wells but maybe you should go thru the hood.
i'll have to look back thru your thread to see how your venting, i think it was to the side in to the wheel wells but maybe you should go thru the hood.
Ron,
I am venting through the hood. I just don't have a fan. Without it the car does not have any airflow. Maybe I need one. The radiator is relatively small for a car without a fan. When moving the car stays nice and cool.
Yes, the factory spec for fuel pressure is relatively low. It is a rising rate regulator. Its just that the initial rates are not good enough considering I am running both turbos wide open into an open exhaust.
I am venting through the hood. I just don't have a fan. Without it the car does not have any airflow. Maybe I need one. The radiator is relatively small for a car without a fan. When moving the car stays nice and cool.
Yes, the factory spec for fuel pressure is relatively low. It is a rising rate regulator. Its just that the initial rates are not good enough considering I am running both turbos wide open into an open exhaust.
QUOTE(DBCooper @ Mar 18 2013, 04:41 PM)
All I have to say about that is
Car gets to be a LOT of fun when that boost comes in, doesn't it? You totally stop trying to drive subtle. Lee. Aim and shoot, hold on, repeat. It's serious fun, and mine isn't even as strong as yours.
.
Made Me Laugh
OldSchool courtesy of Playboy Mag.
Click to view attachment
There has got to be a story or caption to that picture...
I am finally changing the title. I am now calling it a former GRM Challenge car. Its time to put a little money into this car to really enjoy it. I have been working on suspension and now need some new injectors. This will probably put me over budget. This is not a problem for this year as I am not able to go to the event. Maybe next year. Until then there are quite a few track days to complete.
Current Development Update:
Over the past two weeks I have been studying and configuring the vacuum lines on Penny. Originally, I left most of the factory connections in place. Maybe that was not the best idea.
It all started with the swap of the BOV and wastegate connections. They were connected with the BOV above the throttle and wastegates below. This was opposite of the way it should be. This is mostly my fault when I swapped the wiring harness and disconnected everything. After that, the car ran much better.
I had added a manual boost controller and yet, the car still would not pull more than 10psi. I found out that this is the factory spring setting on the wastegates. After some digging I found that the DS turbo had a vacuum bypass that connected the pressure side to the WG. HMM. This meant that my boost controller was bypassed. No wonder it would not hold boost.
AFter swapping and plugging a few vacuumports on the turbo I can now easily get 16psi. This is a whole different level of high rpm fun. Oh Yeah! Now I can finalize the tune and set an appropriate boost level.
the downside is that my injectors are way too small. I will be replacing those in the next week or so. Time to go spend a little money.
I am finally changing the title. I am now calling it a former GRM Challenge car. Its time to put a little money into this car to really enjoy it. I have been working on suspension and now need some new injectors. This will probably put me over budget. This is not a problem for this year as I am not able to go to the event. Maybe next year. Until then there are quite a few track days to complete.
Current Development Update:
Over the past two weeks I have been studying and configuring the vacuum lines on Penny. Originally, I left most of the factory connections in place. Maybe that was not the best idea.
It all started with the swap of the BOV and wastegate connections. They were connected with the BOV above the throttle and wastegates below. This was opposite of the way it should be. This is mostly my fault when I swapped the wiring harness and disconnected everything. After that, the car ran much better.
I had added a manual boost controller and yet, the car still would not pull more than 10psi. I found out that this is the factory spring setting on the wastegates. After some digging I found that the DS turbo had a vacuum bypass that connected the pressure side to the WG. HMM. This meant that my boost controller was bypassed. No wonder it would not hold boost.
AFter swapping and plugging a few vacuumports on the turbo I can now easily get 16psi. This is a whole different level of high rpm fun. Oh Yeah! Now I can finalize the tune and set an appropriate boost level.
the downside is that my injectors are way too small. I will be replacing those in the next week or so. Time to go spend a little money.
will you have to upsize on the fuel pump too?
Its not a stock fuel pump. I am running a Bosch Motorsports fuel pump with dual filters. I have no problems with fuel flow, either in pressure or volume. Just delivery to the intake tract.
I am running a Bosch Motorsports fuel pump with dual filters. I have no problems with fuel flow, either in pressure or volume. Just delivery to the intake tract.
I took my longest drive yet in Penny. I put almost 150 miles on the car this weekend prior to our local Cars and Coffee event. She was running very well and I am just starting to get used to the car and her capabilities.
4th gear pulls to triple digits were effortless.
I still have some tuning issues to sort through. The acceleration has a hesitation right as boost builds. I can see AFR that is a bit rich on the transition and this is easily fixed. I am also leaning out the AFR under full boost. I was very rich (too rich) for safety.
Now the fine tuning begins.
4th gear pulls to triple digits were effortless.
I still have some tuning issues to sort through. The acceleration has a hesitation right as boost builds. I can see AFR that is a bit rich on the transition and this is easily fixed. I am also leaning out the AFR under full boost. I was very rich (too rich) for safety.
Now the fine tuning begins.
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