Carpet color/pattern correct for 1974 Options

[jhynesrockmtn]

Hi, working away on a refresh of some items on my Bumblebee. One of the items I want to address is the cheap carpet kit it has that has not been installed very well to boot.

I am going to place an order for a kit. The question is which color. I want to go with the German Loop. There is a black, early charcoal and late charcoal.

Which color is the most appropriate for a Bumblebee with a black interior.

[wonkipop]

@Mikey914

you have to be cautious these days matching carpet to original samples.
its all 50 year old material you are dealing with in original cars.
it seems not only was the brown carpet notorious for fading, it looks like the later type of black carpet also fades significantly.

here is some shots of that very original 06/74 1.8 i had on file.
with carpet lifted to show areas that have not been subject to UV exposure and wear.
its actually pretty dark in terms of both the thread colors.

(mind you, i will bet the black stayed stable for a lot longer than the brown. the brown carpet resistance to UV could be measured in days instead of years. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) )

in the last image you can see just how much fade there is in the original carpet exposed to UV.





also. mr. b will be dead right with his tracking of the precise week it switches over to the later carpet. its got nothing to do with limited edition production. its there in the 1.8s as well - just we never got the date narrowed down as close as he has. but our 1.8 data confirms his.


------

and why do they change the carpet?

this tells you why.
they start up the production line in 04/74 for the scirocco at karmann.
or at least that is the date most sources give for when the scirocco commences.
i have read other sources which indicate early pre production cars came down the line in oct 73 and they were gradually running batches of cars sorting out the line from oct 73 to march 74 before scaling up to full production but only for domestic and european supply.
the lines were further expanded in 1975 as production commenced for the USA market with the 76MY. at that point the 914 was restricted to a corner of the factory and a dribble of production.

here is the color/interior palette for the 74 scirocco. its the german brochure and its dated 01/74 for printing.
you will recognize everything in it pretty much. bit by bit the 914s received these fabrics and changes in material beginning with 75 MY 914s in earnest. but a bit also dribbles in at random points along the way with 74 914s. (as we have been finding out even the AFM unit for a 6 pin 74 injection loom gets revised quite a bit internally for later bosch spare part replacements).

as a side note the scirocco, golf and passat (rabbit and dasher in the USA) also had plastic fuel tanks. world first in a car. in may 74 the 914 received the plastic expansion tank on its fuel tank as part of this innovative product development. its all connected to the water cooled car R&D updated materials. there is other stuff along the way dotted throughout the 74MY that makes me think the 914 was benefiting from approaches to materials and components being developed for the new water cooled models. all of which no doubt were aimed at better outcomes in terms of manufacturing cost amongst other engineering considerations.




i've never found a good picture of a 74 production scirocco (which is actually a 75 MY, even though production starts in 04/74. but this is a 76MY produced in 75 showing the carpet.

[cholland_]

as a side note the scirocco, golf and passat (rabbit and dasher in the USA) also had plastic fuel tanks. world first in a car.

Do you have a source on that? I've spent much time with mk1 VWs (including currently restoring an early '75 Scirocco), and I've never seen a plastic fuel tank.

[b]but this is a 76MY produced in 75 showing the carpet.

Based on the steering wheel, single wiper and silver cluster, that is for sure a 1977 model. I will say, the original carpet is my '73 914 and my '75 Scirocco are both very similar pile.

[wonkipop]

as a side note the scirocco, golf and passat (rabbit and dasher in the USA) also had plastic fuel tanks. world first in a car.

Do you have a source on that? I've spent much time with mk1 VWs (including currently restoring an early '75 Scirocco), and I've never seen a plastic fuel tank.

[b]but this is a 76MY produced in 75 showing the carpet.

Based on the steering wheel, single wiper and silver cluster, that is for sure a 1977 model. I will say, the original carpet is my '73 914 and my '75 Scirocco are both very similar pile.

very certain on the plastic fuel tanks.
we got them here in the passats and golfs.
but sciroccos never came to australia.
date for the introduction was 73 MY on the passat first.
first VW water cooled to go into production i believe.
slightly before the golf and the scirocco.
main point being thats where the plastic expansion tank comes from for the 914.
VW developed it with a component manufacturer in germany.

https://www.kautex.com/en/about-us/who-we-are/history

https://www.sae.org/publications/technical-...content/740289/

you would know about north american cars however.
maybe you guys did not get the plastic tanks?
i'd have to dig into a bit more.

i found out about it researching my 94 ford falcon ute.
that particular model ford has its roots in the 79 ford falcon XD (aussie falcons).
from the info i have ford australia were the second manufacturer to use plastic tanks.
done for weight saving.
ford australia brought out a VW engineer in the mid 70s to assist them with the design and production of the tanks.

----
re carpet
again you would know your stuff re sciroccos.
however that german brochure i have posted is print dated 01/74.
all the material palette is there for the slightly later 75-76 914s.
including the changed flatter basket weave vinyl - and the colors.
white for the first time.
as noted in the post i have never been able to find the carpet choices in an interior materials brochure or a photo of the early scirocco carpet, but i know there was two grades of carpets for the scirocco as there was also for passats and golfs. depending on whether you got a lower spec or a higher spec model. the lower spec cars got the usual needle pile (slightly fuzzy) type VW carpet. the higher spec luxury models got the loop pile carpet. which the "salt and pepper" is. question would be what spec scirocco have you got?

i wouldn't mind trying to find out more specifics on the carpet for that first year of production of the passats, which is 1974 and is a 75 MY. i believe these were not sold in the USA or canada. starts with a 76 in canada.

i think even 914s got the two different VW carpet specs - or did until at least the end of 73 MY. not sure about 74. might have just been the upper spec woven pile. the lower spec was called needle loom and was available.

on that front of two different grades of carpet.
you can see that VW spec even in the hand built prototypes for the EA266 if you look close at the photos of the two surviving cars.
VW has a lower spec car in its collection. it has the black/grey needle loom (or fuzzy) type of carpet. Porsche retained a high spec sports variant in its collection. the carpet in it from the few photos that exist looks suspiciously like the later loop pile "salt and pepper" in the 914s being discussed here. those prototypes were built in 71 i think.
you would have to see one in the flesh to know or get hold of some better archival material but it looks to me like VW and Porsche were working on a new palette of materials and colors with those cars and that then found its way into the FWD water cooled cars they went ahead with.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[cholland_]

as noted in the post i have never been able to find the carpet choices in an interior materials brochure or a photo of the early scirocco carpet, but i know there was two grades of carpets for the scirocco as there was also for passats and golfs. depending on whether you got a lower spec or a higher spec model. the lower spec cars got the usual needle pile (slightly fuzzy) type VW carpet. the higher spec luxury models got the loop pile carpet. which the "salt and pepper" is. question would be what spec scirocco have you got?

I've got a very base model American-spec '75 Scirocco, so originally had the 1.5L engine, Scirocco steering wheel, and the loop pile carpet. But, no options (it even has a cubby hole where the radio would normally be). October 1974 build date.

Here's a great example of a very base-level Euro-spec Scirocco, with the TV headlights, a 1.1L engine and the fuzzy carpet: https://ruylclassics.nl/ClassicCars/volkswa...t-1975/?taal=EN


Very interesting about the plastic fuel tanks. I've never seen or heard of this before. Of course, all the replacement tanks made today are steel and are the fuel-injection spec tanks.

[wonkipop]

Very interesting about the plastic fuel tanks. I've never seen or heard of this before. Of course, all the replacement tanks made today are steel and are the fuel-injection spec tanks.

i went into VW classic de -
no parts book for scirocco.
but was parts book for passat. said it was for 78 - 80 something models. not earlier.
but found interesting bit.

its all in german but got the google translater out on it.
they had plastic tanks and metal tanks in the passat.
(possibly same for scirocco but got no specifics on that).

i'd have to dig through the whole parts book and brush up on my german to find out where it mentions which cars got the plastic tank and which the metal.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) learn something every day.



@cholland_
studying this parts diagram a bit more closely its clear the carbed versions of passats got the plastic tank. you can see the carb dotted in at the top left hand corner.
explains why anything north american had a metal tank.
and why the aussies got plastic tanks. we still had carbs on VWs at that time not EFI.

also an interesting note under the parts says when translated use ----XXX (part number).
and its all the same part number. so a replacement tank for all the different cars is the same part number. probably a metal tank? from a later component manufacturer.
which would make sense. it was probably not the same manufacturer who made the original tanks in either plastic or metal version but a different company. likely the original plastic tank manufacturer was not willing to run a limited number of plastic spare parts as an order. as far as i can work out there would be no reason a metal tank could not go in to a car as a replacement. the mysteries of VW.