John’s ‘73 Restoration, Light at the end of the tunnel Options

[Morph914]

Lookin good and thanks for posting your progress. Will you try to fire her up prior to installing into the car?

I would like to pre run before installing, but it looks like a lot of work to make this happen. So the answer is no, I’m going stab it and hope for the best.

[Morph914]

Finally got the engine installed, what a pain. I should have purchased the engine plate that sits on the floor jack. I had the engine on my floor jack but was not able to get it stable enough to my liking, so I put it on a four wheel dolly, rolled in under with ease and then used a cherry picker to raise into place. This was my first engine install and I will do several things differently next time. Like leaving the fuel rails and hoses off, these took a beating and made things much more difficult than they needed to be. Hopefully I didn’t cut a fuel line or worse break an injector.







It’s bout to get real (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)



Then I figured I would attach the axles to the trans and this where things went south. So the rubber bellows was not lined up correctly with the bolt holes so I proceeded to try and align them and all of a sudden one of the ball bearings drops out (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif) then another. I tied to get them back in but it wasn’t going to happen. So I started removing the outer CV joint, but then while I was maneuvering it around to remove the bolts the axles pulls out and all the bearings fall out. So I have this huge mess, grease every where. Then I tried to get the CV joint out but the dowels had a good bite and we’re not letting go. Then I remembered, I had not torqued the stub axle bolt down, so I was able to easily tap it out and pull it and the attached CV joint out together. I think I spent most of the day dealing with this mess. Of course I had to clean everything up again, and I had no more grease or extra CV gaskets. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)
Some days are just going to get the better of you, this was one.

[kroelofsen]

Yeb That’s one of those days when it is beter to walk away and try the next day again... Ask me how I know... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif)

[DRPHIL914]

yikes! i hear you, been there and done that too, especially with the fuel rail removal prior to install. it’s really tight with everything on there. i have done CV and this time with just transmission it was not an issue, but luck for you your stub axle was not torqued down! BTW thet motor looks great! do you think it’ll be running for the Classics opening in 2 weeks or Werks in 3?? hope to see you there!

Phil

[Morph914]

yikes! i hear you, been there and done that too, especially with the fuel rail removal prior to install. it’s really tight with everything on there. i have done CV and this time with just transmission it was not an issue, but luck for you your stub axle was not torqued down! BTW thet motor looks great! do you think it’ll be running for the Classics opening in 2 weeks or Werks in 3?? hope to see you there!

Phil

Hard to say, I never know how much time things are going to take. Some days a good amount of progress is made and others, not so much. I would guess probably not at the current pace.

Cheers,
John

[bbrock]

Oh wow! I feel your pain, but did you invent any new words? Still, this is a huge accomplishment and that engine looks sublime! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif) I also decided to use the chassis as my engine "test stand" and don't regret it. Also, if it is any consolation, I've lost count of the number of times I've installed a 914 (or bus) engine, but after a 35 year hiatus, it was like a whole new experience again, and not in a good way. Like an idiot, I tried to stuff mine in there with carbs on. Horrible idea. You are making great progress though despite the greasy little BBs running all over the floor. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cheer.gif)

[930cabman]

Most (close to all) of us have real jobs and turn wrenches as a hobby and often take one step forward and several steps back. I can't recall how many flat VW engines I changed back in the '70's, but after 40+ years the motions are not quite the same.

@BB - Thanks for the heads up with regards to installing the engine with carbs attached.

[Morph914]

She’s alive! Well most of her.





The one thing I really wanted to hear when I turned the key to the on position was the fuel pump, well, it didn’t happen. Before I put fuel in the tank and try to start, I need to figure this out. So far I have tested for power at the pump, no go. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif) Then I ran a wire from the battery to the pump and the pump is good. I have power to the relay, and I have switched the relay for another untested unit. One of the reasons I decided to install the pump on the back fire wall (close to its original location) is because the original wiring was there and it would be easy.
The original wires had the plug for the original fuel pump cut off, so I just lengthened them a bit attached the brown to the ground and the (I think) black and red to the positive side. I guess the next step is to check the control box?
If this turns into a big hassle I may relocate it to the front where I wanted it in the first place.

This is the battery set up I decided upon. I wasn’t keen on it at first but the weight savings was very attractive. If it doesn’t work out, look for it on the classifieds.







I have yet to test the headlights, I had the relays out, and ran out of time. The fog lights are not working either. So, as expected, I have some issues to work through (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif)

[bbrock]

Another great milestone! At this rate, you'll be driving before me.

A couple thoughts on the fuel pump. First, I'd make sure there is a known GOOD relay in both the power and fuel pump sockets before digging deeper (and of course double check the fuses).

If it still won't run, you could try by-passing the ECU by wiring the pump like you would for carbs. It's a simple jumper to ground (http://www.914world.com/specs/SirAndyCarbFuelPumpRelay.php). If it runs, then your probably looking at something amiss in the ECU circuit. IIRC, the pump should run for something like 2 seconds when the key is switched on and turn off again unless the engine is started. I would also deduce from the method to trick the pump into running with an ECU, that the brain is controlling the pump by completing and breaking the ground circuit, so that would be another clue of what to look for.

I have a weird relay that refuses to work with the cover cap on. If I pry the cap off to expose the relay, it works fine. As soon as I glue the cap back on, it stops working. I've repeated this twice now with the same result. Fickle little bugger.

[rjames]

Your CV joint story had me laughing and crying at the same time. I had the same thing happen to me a while back. You see one of those bearings fall out while you're lying on your back under the car and just have time to say oh sh*t before the rest go like dominos.

Your car looks fantastic. Great work!!

[Morph914]

Another great milestone! At this rate, you'll be driving before me.

A couple thoughts on the fuel pump. First, I'd make sure there is a known GOOD relay in both the power and fuel pump sockets before digging deeper (and of course double check the fuses).

If it still won't run, you could try by-passing the ECU by wiring the pump like you would for carbs. It's a simple jumper to ground (http://www.914world.com/specs/SirAndyCarbFuelPumpRelay.php). If it runs, then your probably looking at something amiss in the ECU circuit. IIRC, the pump should run for something like 2 seconds when the key is switched on and turn off again unless the engine is started. I would also deduce from the method to trick the pump into running with an ECU, that the brain is controlling the pump by completing and breaking the ground circuit, so that would be another clue of what to look for.

I have a weird relay that refuses to work with the cover cap on. If I pry the cap off to expose the relay, it works fine. As soon as I glue the cap back on, it stops working. I've repeated this twice now with the same result. Fickle little bugger.

Thank you, I will try to solve this mystery by starting with good relays per your advice. Electrical gremlins can be quite annoying. Sounds like your relay is afraid of the dark. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Morph914]

Your CV joint story had me laughing and crying at the same time. I had the same thing happen to me a while back. You see one of those bearings fall out while you're lying on your back under the car and just have time to say oh sh*t before the rest go like dominos.

Your car looks fantastic. Great work!!

I’m happy to provide laughter, it is kind of funny looking back. Not so much when it happened (IMG:style_emoticons/default/hissyfit.gif)

Cheers, and thanks for the kind words.
John

[bbrock]

Sounds like your relay is afraid of the dark. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) That's a good one. Just another indication that I'm not right in the head is that I somewhat enjoy chasing down electrical problems. Something about the process of isolating components of the circuit to zero in on the problem pleases me. What I don't like is discovering the "problem" requires tearing out the dash to access for a 10 minute repair.

[Morph914]

Sounds like your relay is afraid of the dark. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) That's a good one. Just another indication that I'm not right in the head is that I somewhat enjoy chasing down electrical problems. Something about the process of isolating components of the circuit to zero in on the problem pleases me. What I don't like is discovering the "problem" requires tearing out the dash to access for a 10 minute repair.

I too enjoy the challenge of fixing electrical issues, the problem is, I’m not very knowledgeable when it comes to understanding the way everything works. So I will be relying heavily on the world members to get me through it.

So far, I have no power to the fuel pump, headlights work but are not popping up, and the fog lights are not working. And even though we rarely get thick fog here, I want them to work.

On a good note, my horn works, stereo works, the fresh air blower works (thank God, I did not want to have to remove and reinstall that piece), blinkers etc. So god willing, I’ll be fixing some of these issues this week, with the fuel pump having the priority so I can get this baby started.

I can’t wait to see yours out on the pavement where you can open her up. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

[Morph914]

Still trying to sort out the lack of power to my fuel pump.



I have gone through Jeff’s fuel pump trouble shooting tests, and so far the first 7 are good, but #8 failed indicating a bad relay board. Should I stop here and replace the relay board. Or should I start testing the ECU board. I do have the ECU from the original engine (1.7)
I should fill you in on what I started with and what is currently in the car.
It had a ‘73 1.7 liter with d jet when I purchased the car. The PO ( who is reputable) posted a video of the car running, so I know everything was good several years ago. Fast forward, I purchased a 73 2.0 with the fuel injection components, and that is what is in the car now.

This is my current MPS and ECU. Are these compatible?





I also have this MPS off the original 1.7

[bbrock]

Definitely start with the relay because 1) it should be easy to test connectivity along the traces for the fuel pump, and 2) from what I understand, the relay is much more likely to go bad than the ECU.

[Morph914]

Definitely start with the relay because 1) it should be easy to test connectivity along the traces for the fuel pump, and 2) from what I understand, the relay is much more likely to go bad than the ECU.

I agree, I’m really hoping it’s not the ECU. It would be very difficult to replace it with all the wiring and such. I do have the extra ECU from the 1.7 if needed, and maybe I could just change the box out if need be and leave the harness in place.

Off to the classifieds to find a relay board.

[bbrock]

Definitely start with the relay because 1) it should be easy to test connectivity along the traces for the fuel pump, and 2) from what I understand, the relay is much more likely to go bad than the ECU.

I agree, I’m really hoping it’s not the ECU. It would be very difficult to replace it with all the wiring and such. I do have the extra ECU from the 1.7 if needed, and maybe I could just change the box out if need be and leave the harness in place.

Off to the classifieds to find a relay board.

Did you test the relay board? With a schematic you should be able to test conductivity along the traces and confirm that is the problem before throwing money at it.

[Morph914]

So, after taking a break from the car during the hot humid summer, I am back at it. As previously stated, I was having an issue of no power to the fuel pump when I turned the key. After replacing the relay board still no go, so I swapped out the ECU with an extra I had and this did the trick (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)
So now that I had power to the pump, it was time to put gas in the tank. I checked for leaks and found none, so it was time to light the fire. First I disconnected the coil wire and cranked it several times to get the oil moving. Then I hooked it up and tried to start and nothing.
I started checking to see if I had fuel to the pump, and there was not. I had a hell of a time getting the air out of the system, but after a fuel bath I was able to finally get fuel up to the injector rail. Once I had fuel to the engine she fired off immediately (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif) She ran pretty good for just having the timing close, and also idled nicely.
So after tying up some loose ends, I was ready take my first drive ever in this car.
The car was still without doors, rear trunk lid, engine lid, and the windshield. The purpose of this drive was to make sure I had a working transmission, I was not disappointed, it seem to shift smoothly into all the gears. Big relief! I did not want to install all the other pieces on the car until I knew the trans was going to work in case I had to drop the engine and trans. Less chance of getting dings or scratches if they stay stashed away under heavy padding.

So now that the drive train appears good, I am starting the install of the remaining pieces. The rear trunk lid was first. After bolting it on, I slowly lowered the lid to check alignment and latch engagement. It all looked pretty close with a small adjustment needed. When I went to push the release button, nothing happened, so I figured it was in the locked position, but after switching the position with the key, nothing. I must have put the latch together improperly (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif) Now my lid is shut and I cannot see how to get it open, what are my options? Help (IMG:style_emoticons/default/hissyfit.gif)

[jims914]

Hello John,

Nice build.
Thanks it gives a lot of information on the build. I am doing a 70 with a 2.0, side shift in Adriatic Blue.
Thanks again Jim