A Real One For Ya, Straight from the doctor me thinks Options

[MoveQik]

Cool, let's all welcome Alpha to the conversation (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wavey.gif)

I'm so glad he's from Colorado. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

[LvSteveH]

Cool, let's all welcome Alpha to the conversation (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wavey.gif)

And what a breath of fresh air he is (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Note to self: don't buy cars from alpha or "several of his friends"

[Dr Evil]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/jerkit.gif)

[Joe Bob]

I see a short yellow bus, with flashing lights and the door slowly opening.....

[Gint]

Maybe back in Goat Fuck Holler it's OK....but sure as hell, unethical....

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I have not laughed so hard since the Route66 run with a Carrera GT. Thanks Zstring.

[Gint]

Dammit I'm still laughing! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

[rick 918-S]

Who needs a title? I purchased Sandy's 1959 Austin Healey from a guy that saved it from a junk yard. He told me it was in the yard for 10 years. It sat in his barn for 10 years. No title. I went to the DMV with a bond I purchased from my insurance company and they sent me a title. What's the big deal. Now if were talking about saving a 6 tub by using a 4 cylinder car as a parts donor, that's another thing. I could get a title for that 6 shell easy with a receipt and a bond. I could also patch that car with many sections cut from several 4 cylinder cars or one. When it was done you may be able to tell there were some repairs done, or not... People will fix some really bad stuff. Who am I to tell them how not to spend their money?

edit: I just sped read this thread. I didn't know there were no stamping for the chassis. Now, that's a new twist. The dash shell is worth a couple bucks.

[Twise]

Wow - George really man - What is to stop me from buying your tub and the vin/paperwork - then crushing your tub and associating that vin/paperwork with a converted four? I could sit on it for a couple years and then sell the car with a legit appearing vin tag. That is the issue here. People don't own cars forever - they die - go bankrupt - gamble... For you to just thumb your nose at the whole system of vehicle identification numbers is just irresponsible for a guy in your position. That VIN should have died with the car you crushed. Where is the vin that belongs on the tub? How many times have you done that? How many people own a 914-6 that really isn't ??? Sorry man - I just cannot see your side of this.

[dw914er]

i do wonder

what exactly separates this from, lets say using an existing 914-6 that was wrecked, and using a 4 donor to fix the section? Lets say the whole front end as smashed, and you decided that is as possible to swap in a new front end. In theory, you would have to replace at least 1 vin to make sure you dont have a 4 vin in the front, and the 6 in the window? Could it be that this applies in a similar action. It doesnt have the original motor so the chances of really making the car worth more for a collectors stance is limited, but would you rather save a 4 or a 6?

[jd74914]

I agree with Trevor. Swapping VINs is illegal, plain and simple. I too wonder how many renumbered cars are out there waiting for unsuspecting people to buy.

The 930 situation we terrible too. Why would anyone not notify the owner first. And then buying the car afterwards--in my mind that all seems a ploy to get a cheap line on a good car rather than helping to sort out the problem.


Circumstances like these speak volumes to me about your business ethics.

[jd74914]

i do wonder

what exactly separates this from, lets say using an existing 914-6 that was wrecked, and using a 4 donor to fix the section? Lets say the whole front end as smashed, and you decided that is as possible to swap in a new front end. In theory, you would have to replace at least 1 vin to make sure you dont have a 4 vin in the front, and the 6 in the window? Could it be that this applies in a similar action. It doesnt have the original motor so the chances of really making the car worth more for a collectors stance is limited, but would you rather save a 4 or a 6?

In that case the car should have a salvage title and all further owners should know what happened. Otherwise it is fraud. Stuff like that has been pointed out here before. As far as 914's go, for all intensive purposes a /6 VIN is more important than an original motor. The VIN gives so much more worth than the original motor in the case of most Porsches. For examples in equal condition a speedster with a C engine is usually worth more than a numbers matching C.

Renumbering a totally different car is much different than repairing one that has been wrecked. In my mind once the VIN rivets are drilled out, if it does not go back onto the same car then that is fraud.

[dw914er]

i do wonder

what exactly separates this from, lets say using an existing 914-6 that was wrecked, and using a 4 donor to fix the section? Lets say the whole front end as smashed, and you decided that is as possible to swap in a new front end. In theory, you would have to replace at least 1 vin to make sure you dont have a 4 vin in the front, and the 6 in the window? Could it be that this applies in a similar action. It doesnt have the original motor so the chances of really making the car worth more for a collectors stance is limited, but would you rather save a 4 or a 6?

In that case the car should have a salvage title and all further owners should know what happened. Otherwise it is fraud. Stuff like that has been pointed out here before. As far as 914's go, for all intensive purposes a /6 VIN is more important than an original motor. The VIN gives so much more worth than the original motor in the case of most Porsches. For examples in equal condition a speedster with a C engine is usually worth more than a numbers matching C.

Renumbering a totally different car is much different than repairing one that has been wrecked. In my mind once the VIN rivets are drilled out, if it does not go back onto the same car then that is fraud.

yea, the numbers matching reflects my muscle car train of thought (i worked at a classic car dealership)

though, for the car, when you did register it, would it be defaulted to salvaged anyways? If it does, then the vin doesnt really help the value (salvaged will always hurt the value), but you get a blank canvas to work with.

(if you notice, im jusdt trying to piece things together, i have no interest to piss off george. I just think its a rather odd situation. <My bet, he just wanted the shell gone, and just said here)

[So.Cal.914]

Who needs a title? I purchased Sandy's 1959 Austin Healey

I don't know, maybe its me, but that looks like an early SL not an AH. Can you post more pic's?

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[jd74914]

You can "escape" getting a salvage title. IMHO that's where one of the problems comes in. If you want a black canvas than why not start with a /4 VIN. I have a car that was salvaged and now has a good title (we found that while looking through records). In my limited experience, most suspicious activities stay behind when cars leave the state.


George may have thrown out a bone to those looking, but he should have never done that. Just the fact that he thought to offer something such as a VIN indicates that he doesn't have a problem transplanting them to other cars (and the rhetoric really doesn't help that case).

I'm out.

[Grngoat]

I thought that the 914-6 ad and the defense of it was one of the most shocking things I've read in a while.

Then I read the 930 article. Shameless. To do something like that is bad enough. Then to brag about it, repeatedly. Never bought anything from AA. Think I'll avoid it if at all possible now.

Then I read Alpha's post. Wuh. I wouldn't brag about that too much, buddy.

[dw914er]

am i missing something?
the 911 article i thought was good. he suspected a stolen car, and then called the police. The 'owner' told a few lies about the car, like the year, and when he 'bought' it. They found out the car wasnt to the real 'owners' name. So he called the cops again. The car was stolen, and therefore impounded. The real owner turned up, then later decided to sell the car.

what is the matter with that. If some dealership found my car and someone trying to sell my 65 914, id want the dealership to call the police. Last time i checked, it was a 73, so it obviously wasnt me selling it, and im glad the thing would have been sorted out but the proper means.

Who else do you call? Ghostbusters?

[Ferg]

I fail to see where you see that the "real" owner turned up or was found, and decided to sell the car...

It's not uncommon for collectors to never register cars in their name if they don't plan on driving them, just because registration was not in the "customers" name does not IMO give the go ahead to call the cops, that's nuts.

Even if the car was stolen, and did not actually belong to the "customer" it's still very possible he was the victim, not knowing what he owned was hot...

Ferg

[rick 918-S]

Who needs a title? I purchased Sandy's 1959 Austin Healey

I don't know, maybe its me, but that looks like an early SL not an AH. Can you post more pic's?

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

It is an SL. My purpose for posting the photo is to show the extreme some owners will go to get the car they want. This SL is still coming apart further. The morale is you can fix any car with enough parts and time.

[dr914@autoatlanta.com]

And when I was first introduced to the 914 in 1974, I drove up a driveway on Lenox Road and saw at least 20 very low mile badly wrecked 914s cut in half and Phil a licensed rebuilder for whom I later worked for for free) was clipping them back together repainting the back half (or the front half) of them finally reassembling and having the Georgia inspector look at them and approve them for the road, the unused serial number eliminated from the wrong half.
I wonder how many of the two piecers are still on the road these days??

Then my shock to see that the factory reassigned a serial number to a four cylinder and made it into the 916 we have here.........shocking! All that money for a converted four cylinder.

Yes over the years I have rebodied at least thirty 914s into new bodies purchased blank from the factory before they were discontinued and if new bodies were available today, I would rebody many many more. It is the very correct way to repair a badly rusted and/or wrecked car, and I am very proud of the results. As a licensed rebuilder I am approved by the state to take the worst wreck or rusted piece of crap and bring it back from the grave. Every car I ever rebuilt was inspected and approved and are with happy owners somewhere.

[ericread]

As I see it:

1. Person brings car into shop.
2. Shop has questions regarding legal ownership, calls police.
3. Police find reasonable cause to impound car.
4. Original possessor of the car (the one who brought it into the shop) was unable to provide police with a good enough story or documentation to make claim to the car.
5. Police were unable to find rightful owner of car.
6. Police auction car.
7. Repair shop wins car at auction.

It's doubtful that the police and AA teamed up to steal this car from the original possessor. Many shops, upon finding questionable vehicle ID, may call police to protect themselves from liability. I was told of a person that brought his teener to a shop in SOCAL that was owned by a LAPD (or some such agency) officer. Upon looking at the reg numbers, the shop (police person) discovered the car had been reported stolen. The guy that brought the teener in lost the car, as it was not rightfully (in the eyes of the law) his.

Not fun. Not good for the person bringing the teener to the shop. But it is what it is.

My only criticism is the appearance of the "bragging" that AA got such a good deal on the car. AA may have done well financially, and may have acted in a moral and legal way, but the bragging in the article was a bit over the top.

Anyway, my $.02. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)