Autocross & Motorcycle helmets, The same? Different? Options

[Rusty]

I've been reading all the info I can about how to select a motorcycle helmet. Apparently, not all helmets are equal, and my head is worth far more (to me) than whatever I invest in a helmet. Within reason, cost is not an issue on this safety piece.

While looking around, I realized that many were Snell rated. So, does this mean that my motorcycle helmet can pull double duty as an autocross helmet?

-Rusty (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smoke.gif)

[Jeroen]

Depends on the organisation you're AX-ing with, so check there first...

There are 2 types of Snell certification
M for motorcycles
SA for cars

cheers,

Jeroen

[Demick]

Check with the organization that you autocross with for what their specific helmet requirements are. Most organizations allow M rated helmets for autocross, so yes, your motorcycle helmet can do double duty. SA rated helmets are quite a bit more expensive and are usually required for road racing or other track events. The helmets are built a bit differently for different kinds of impacts, but most notably, SA helmets are built using fire retardent materials (nomex) and M rated helmets are not.

Demick

[indydad]

I did a "Track Attack" event here and my Simpson Shark model helment intended for mortorcycles and Snell approved was accepted.
ole dad in INDY

[fiid]

Motorbike helmets are designed for "One Big Hit". Car helmets are designed for multiple smaller impacts - i.e. the kind caused by rolling a rally car at 140 mph.

For convienience, AX, and low end DE events - a motorcycle helmet is probably okay, but when you are going fast on serious tracks (i.e. with a lot of walls) you should have the proper safety equipment.

Your mileage may vary.

[davep]

I haven't needed a helmet recently, but for all the DE events I've been in the Snell rated helmet was mandatory. Usually they require a current Snell rating; look at the Snell rating date. I learned the hard way to use only a full face helmet; biker days. The rules will dictate the rating needed, but I would always go for the top rating personally.

DaveP

[Dave_Darling]

Often the motorcycle helmets have wider eyeports than the SA helmets, but not always. The SA helmets have Nomex liners, the M ones don't have to and usually do not have them.

Other than that, there is no real difference.

There are two things that are different in the Snell "M" and "SA" tests. The first is the requirement for fire-retardant lining in the SA helmets, and the second is a test that simulates a roll bar impact--a drop against a cylinder. (M tests include drops against a 90-degree corner, a sharp object, and so on. Those same tests are also used on SA helmets.)

A good friend said, "As an engineer, I would have to work very hard indeed to make a helmet that would pass the M tests and fail the SA-specific tests."

As is so often the case, though, the real answer to your question is RTFR. Read The Rulebook. It will tell you if M-rated helmets are OK or not. I would not use a helmet without a Snell rating, but IMHO the M-rated ones are just fine for autoX or the track. (Until you get to where a fire suit is required. Then you should use a helmet with Nomex lining--an SA helmet.)

The ratings are upgraded every few years. Most places seem to require -95 or later; some may only require -90. I don't know what the latest Snell rating is; the last I remember hearing about was -00. And there was some oddness after that??? I forget exactly. But I would walk away from any store carrying anything older than -00 helmets.

--DD

[GaroldShaffer]

I plan to go looking for a helmet in the next week
or so. My local SCCA rules state I can use a Mcycle
helmet for AXing but must be snell rated.

After doing some on line shoping I think I am going
to get a SA rated helmet. I know it will be hard to roll
my 914 at AXing event, but you never know what
might happen. I figure the extra $$ is worth it.
It will be a full face one also. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

I don't ride Motorcycles (not my thing), and if I know
me the more I AX, the more I will want to get in to
racing (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

- Garold

[Joe Bob]

If you are in a warm climate...the open faced ones are preferable. I agree with what DDD said on the SA/M ratings.....get a good one, don't buy online, fitment is different by different manufacturers and one head is not like another head. Try them on, live with it.....

[Greg]

One other accessory you may want to purchase if you buy a full face helmet is a padded neck ring. If you ever have a frontal impact while wearing a full face helmet you run the risk of breaking your sternum when your head snaps forward and down from the deceleration force and the chin of the helmet impacts your chest. the neck ring will prevent this.

[Demick]

It's always good to be safe, BUT...

A well run autocross is a very safe environment to drive your car. I'd be willing to bet that you are safer while driving at the autocross than you are driving on any public road at any given time. So unless you are so safety concious that you wear a helmet everywhere you drive, I think that the possible added protection of a SA rated helmet is unnecessary with autocross. Same goes with open faced vs. closed face helmets.

More important than the rating (beyond what is required) is getting a helmet that fits properly and gives you good visibility.

I am speaking for autocross only. On a race track - that's a whole different ballgame.

Demick

[RocknRollFrenzy]

a few things to think about when buying helmets: (in no particular order)

1. a cheap helmet has to pass the same impact tests as the expensive ones, however the expesive ones generally manage to pass those test with a lot less weight and bulk. on a bike this translates to a lot less of a beating on the noggin from wind. in a car it means a lot less force on the neck when you get thrown against your harnesses. you also tend to get nice things like removeable pads for the extra cash. makes it easier to keep the helmet from getting stinky. bike helmets also tend to have slighty heavier, thicker shells because they have to protect against the abrasion of sliding on pavement as well as impact.

2. an often overlooked difference between motorcycle helmets and car helmets is the venting. the vents on most car helmets are usually really open and free flowing because its assumed that you're behind a windshield. the vents on bike helmets tend to be smaller and rely on forced air flowing in the front and out the back to create their air circulation (which is why they fog when you're stopped and clear as soon as you're rolling). motorcycle helmets in cars tend to get really stuffy and fog easier, and you'll probably find yourself needing to leave your visor open a little.

3. another overlooked difference is that many car helmets are now made with attachment points for head and neck restraints. bike helmets wont ever have this (though you you could add fittings to a motorcycle helmet the same way you would to a car helmet that doesn't have them built in.) if you're planning on doing wheel to wheel racing at some point definitely take this into consideration.

4. do you actually ride a motorcycle? if you do, and you need the helmet to serve double duty till you can get a car specific helmet, then get a motorcycle helmet. if you don't, then why not just spend the few extra dollars for the sa rated helmet. chances are that you'll find yourself having to get one eventually anyway if you start doing a lot of track days.

5. all other things considered, the most important thing is fit. if it doesn't fit, it won't work.

[TimT]

If you are in a warm climate...the open faced ones are preferable

Dunno if I agree with that one... I use a full face helmet, and my shield in my closed car.

A few years ago I went off big at Watkins Glen I was wearing my fulll face helmet with the visor removed. As the car was spinning I took a facefull of grass and dirt, It hurt, thankfully I got nothing in my eyes..

Also Ive had the experience of driving through someone elses off and got a cockpit full of dust and debris......

So whenever I drive on the track its with my full face helmet, and visor closed.. you can roll a little wad of duct tape in the recess where the visor fits to keep it open enough for some ventilation.

In an AX environment I guess an open helmet is ok...

also my region allows M helmets in DE's and AX's


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

[KenH]

Be sure you can locate the SNELL sticker in the helmet. Some say "SNELL approved" on the outside but the dated sticker is nowhere to be found.

Ken

[TimT]

gratuitous helmet pic LOL

[aufaber]

My semi annual use the search feature post:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act...=4403&hl=helmet

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act...=7569&hl=helmet

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act...=2878&hl=helmet

That's just searching for "Helmet" in the topic name.

[Joe Bob]

If you are in a warm climate...the open faced ones are preferable

Dunno if I agree with that one... I use a full face helmet, and my shield in my closed car.

A few years ago I went off big at Watkins Glen I was wearing my fulll face helmet with the visor removed. As the car was spinning I took a facefull of grass and dirt, It hurt, thankfully I got nothing in my eyes..

Also Ive had the experience of driving through someone elses off and got a cockpit full of dust and debris......

So whenever I drive on the track its with my full face helmet, and visor closed.. you can roll a little wad of duct tape in the recess where the visor fits to keep it open enough for some ventilation.

In an AX environment I guess an open helmet is ok...

also my region allows M helmets in DE's and AX's


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

True...but Rusty WAS asking about autocross. Few AX courses have dirt get offs and you are pretty spaced out between cars.....

As you know....AX involves a LOT of waiting and an open faced helmet would be a blessing in the heat....

[914werke]

Hmmm as I read these response, I was a little ammused. Yes there are differances, Yes use your local sanctiong body as a resource, and lastly,
Yes If you ride a Bike and track a car BUY TWO FRIGGIN HELMETS!
ITS YOUR HEAD!!! Ya know the thing with your brain in it?
Have any of you had your head run over by a Motor vehical?
I have... and it wasnt pleasent. A $500 Shoei (MC) trashed but Im still walkin a talkin.
I had an experiance here in PNW where the local sanctioning body absolutly will not allow MC helments and they TECH for them.
BTW my car helment is an Open face (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[914werke]

Oh .. one more thing I own 7 helemts:
Street MC full Face x2
Track MC full face x2
Track open face
Dirt open face (+ chin guard)
Pit beanie
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/mueba.gif)

[anthony]

I don't think heat is a huge issue in AX because you generally put the helmet on for your 60 second run and then take it off when you are done. At least, that was my experience with SCCA autocross. Even comfort wasn't a huge issue because I think I wore the helmet maybe a grand total of 15 minutes for my three runs.

I agree with the comments about autocross being safer than driving on the freeway. Just buy whatever helmet you need for your motorcycle riding and then use it for AX. If you get into track events then get an SA helmet.