So eloquent and pointed.

I am on this stinking Nexus pad.

If I type out a response half the time it deletes before I post, or it posts it 16 times.

Glad to see you made it home safely

The local PCA region has just under 200 members. At any given event (autocross, day drive, etc) there are only 15-20 cars. At less than a 10% participation rate, you can see it takes a very large membership base for a decent turnout at an event.

Perhaps, but I'd consider 10-15 cars to be nice turnout for a 914 gathering compared to anything I've seen.

It just takes a very large base of 914 owners within a certain distance to reach that number. So many of these cars are on jack stands or the owners don't trust them enough to drive a distance or scheduling conflicts come up, etc.

This is why my wife and I host our annual 914 BBQ (shameless plug CLICK HERE FOR MORE INFO) This will be our 7th year doing it. In years past I organized a monthly 914 breakfast in Orland Square and was part of the Fall Foliage Classics.

While I hope we would have 100+ cars and people attend (need a big place for that) it is ok if only 1 person shows, but usually we have 15 - 20 cars and about 40 people throughout the day.

For years Glenn Stazak and I have talked about how we could get a real Porsche only swap meet going in the Chicago area like the old Tweeks or Doc & Cy's.

While I think local chapters are great, I really think all that is needed is for someone, anyone in your area to say hey..... Who is up for XXX on the XX day and then follow-up and do it. Hence our yearly 914 BBQ.

If someone wants to step up and be the official Chicago area chapter leader I am willing to help support them, but until then you can count on our yearly 914 BBQ.

We have about 3,000 members in our local PCA. Today I went to a Padres vs Giants baseball game the local PCA sponsored... only about 15 attended. So, you may be right. Still, I'd be interested in any local 914 clubs or events.

I agree with all of the above. I think the way it is fine. Just advertise more events in the Garage in hopes of getting people more together. My car has been apart the last two years, so I haven't participated in any local driving events. I attend the three major So Cal events which is the biannual G&R and the Phoenix Club car show and swap meet. As soon as my car is running, I will start announcing when I will be at Irvine Cars & Coffee in hopes of other 914's showing up and maybe get breakfast afterwards.

I would agree. 10 cars at an event really sucks. I know past WCC and Red Rocks events have had 30 cars. Those days appear to be gone for the moment. I know there are 914's in AZ but there are only 3 or 4 of us that make events on a regular basis.

We tried a Yahoo group for AZ for a while but it went nowhere. I am pretty sure any regional group would result in 3 guys meeting each month.

But I also agree with Bowlsby.

One thing I feel like has contributed to the decline in attendance is a general increase in the level of restoration. There are so many nice cars that some people feel intimidated about bringing their 'crappy' 914 to an event. There are also more FULL restorations going on than people driving and maintaining their cars. Personally I would love to see more people in cars that run and drive, but aren't pristine at these events. I keep brining my POS hoping to inspire people.

I could support the above "fact"
I've sponsored many Northeast events or get-togethers.
back in the day, we had members that had tons of energy, and supported those events.....Aaron (I-love-porsche) Pete Travnic and of course Richie (NYchef)

we'd spend weekends wrenching away, helping with each other's 914s.
They sold their cars....got married....moved on...just not the same.

I keep trying to build up the tri-State contingency, just not that easy these day.

just a sample of threads of the old days...never a dull moment:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=54155&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=62428&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=64628&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=72622&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=73219&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=73103&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=77730&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=79067&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=110190&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=131091&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=130893&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=191006&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=201749&hl=

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=201665&hl=

unfortunately a huge drop off of interest from the first thread to the last....
it was like herding cats after a while

Economy and distance is a problem. 2008 put me out of work and I now work 6 days to provide a 4 day income of past years. Then the distance. With a several day drive to attend - well it's too far. And then the leadership. Only a handful of people organized MUSR and they burned out.

I'd love to do a Sunday drive but that's AX day in Texas.

I'd vote for more local 1 day events but at this time as a participant not an organizer.

So here's my two cents from a long time 914 owner, president of PCA and pretty much a lurker on 914world......

We all know PCA is the largest Porsche club in the world-by leaps and bounds. It is also one of three Porsche clubs in North America recognized by Porsche (the other two are POC and the 356 Registry).

PCA has had a 914 Register in the past. I would love to see it revived again. It would not replace 914world but rather provide resources to host 914 related events under the PCA banner AND insurance. Yes, there are rules, guidelines, etc. You need these to get decent insurance. We want not only our organizers to be protected if something goes wrong but entrants, regardless if they are members or not.

Because the factory recognizes PCA as an official club, they allow us to use their crest, script and images. Something that is worth quite a lot, especially since Porsche has two lawyers in the US that are in charge of copyright violations.

We also have the financial and volunteer resources to help with event planning and promotion. As an outsider put it to me recently "I have to spend thousands marketing my item, you just have to send an email to 117K members".

I know some folks say that PCA doesn't care about 914s. Personally, I think that was in the past-if it ever existed. I joined PCA with a rusted and barely running 73 1.7. The members could have cared less what I drove. It wasn't the car that determined whether you were accepted, it was your personality. I became President of the region with that same car.

Now when I bring my 914 2.0 to events, it always draws a crowd. Some curious, other appreciative of its survivor status. However, it is as rare to see 914 as it is seeing 944's.

While I'm a car guy, I love hanging out with fellow Porsche nuts. Driving the 914 is great. Driving it in a caravan of Porsches is even better. Having more than one 914 in the group is icing on the car.

Thanks for chiming in here.

Great idea for raising the bar on future events. Having the chapter/club status that could lend the factory to join as a partner, or at least approve official logos ETC, could go a long way towards attracting other sponsors. Good events can break-even or come out ahead on $$$ with raffles and auctions of goodies donated and then distributed to paying attendees. As someone who has planned and hosted public events for non-profits, I can definitely see the value of forming a formal 914World Chapter with dues, insurance, swag etc.

Doing it under the PCA umbrella seems like a great idea to me

I'll just add that I attended WCR in 2006 but since then have been under-employed and not able to prioritize "car club" events like I want to due to competing needs for my $$, time, etc. My 914 now has lots of commuting duties! I live vicariously through all of you via 914World

If new Chapters don't start, oh well. We've got a great thing going now!

How aboot creating a space at the top of the main page and sticky-ing the events there until they have passed, in addition to highliting them. That way it is always in readers faces instead of getting lost on page 2,3,4, if on one bumps it

That's how we used to do it. Then we started having 5-10 topics stuck at the top of the page regardless of whether they were in your area or not.

I recently joined the PCA and did a run with with North Country Region in the White Mountains last month.

I had a great time, the driving was fun, the people and conversations great, and overall it was a great experience. We all signed the PCA waivers that are standard at events.

James Smith was there with his 914-6 so there were two of us. To be honest, there weren't that many air cooled cars there period, but we all had a great time. I would encourage any one of us to join.

However, the PCA crowd is a very formal group in my opinion, and that can be a turn off to our DIY, drive the pants off, run them till they break and call the tow truck kind of guys.

PCA recently proposed a revision to their Bylaws, and they sent out a 14 page document of fine print..

Not that there is anything wrong with the PCA, but it's services and needs are different than ours.

I think we all want to see more of our cars and see them driven and appreciated. Tying in to the PCA doesn't make sense to me. The informality of this group is what makes it so easy to drop in and visit or stay and put your feet up for a while. No hassles, no expectations, and all the advice you need or don't.

I like Scotty's idea, but wouldn't ask the administrators to do more than they already do.

John

As recipient of the Jack Stand Award at last year's Okteenerfest, 100% with this.

When viewing photos from events throughout the past couple years, I have noticed most of the 914s are (or at least appear to be) very nice Where are the daily drivers? The works-in-progress? I have often wondered if some members are discouraged from attending events because their 914 isn't as nice as they think all the others are!

every day

Ray, I read thru some of those threads and it did seem like interest waned over the years. But part of the problem may be that there are a number of owners who do not belong to a forum such as this and therefore aren't aware of events. How might those owners be informed? What if certain owners have no interest in organized events?

I met a guy over the weekend local to me who brought his car to Tangerine and doesnt belong to any forum but is interested in attending Chris' open house ( whenever that is ) and a coworker spotted a white one in the Westbury area also this past weekend. I have no idea who that might be.

You'd think that as the number of cars diminishes that the owners would seek out some sort of camaraderie for support/assistance/whatever as i don't think 914's are viewed as a typical used car these days. But what do I know. I've been guilty of not doing my best to attend events, hopefully that will change as I've become 92% or so confident in travelling with the car. So much so, that I'm actually contemplating Okteenerfestivus...

How bout you?

Manny,

I would love to see this revived as well and would be an active member supporting it. I joined the PCA in 2006 when I had a 911. I'm now on my third 914 and the 911 is gone. I participate in my local PCA events as I have time and I was the only 914 registered for the 2013 Escape. I was fortunate to win the Magnus Walker award at the event.

This site is the best resource for 914's in the world (pun intended) and it would be great to incorporate at least a link from a PCA 914 register to this site. I think there is a stigma among 914 owners that the "911 crowd" looks down on 914's. Although I have experienced this in the PCA, it is a small minority. Most of the events are very, extremely 914 friendly. I was amazed at Escape how many PCA memebers came up to me to tell me about the 914 either in their garage or the one they used to own.

I feel the premise of this thread is to figure out how we as the 914 World can get more involved and supported like the PCA or the clubs in Europe. It would be great if the PCA could dedicate more resources to the lonely 914...

I think there is a stigma among 914 owners that the "911 crowd" looks down on 914's.

Mike, in response to that, allow me to offer an amusing anecdote...

The weekend before last I was up at a family reunion up in Mass.; I drove the teener. My brother in law was there with his recently acquired 9whatever (I'm clueless with the newer ones) after selling his 930 (what a car!). A couple of family friends said they wanted to check out their "dream Porsche" or something to that effect. He kind of smiled somewhat smugly, but his jaw dropped when they walked over to the orange car...

It's just that they've become so rare on the road. I think a lot of newer Porsche owners may have no idea what these are. Nevermind the typical driver. What was once thought of as funkugly is now looked on as pretty unique. No, nothing looks like these. Not even that dang Italian car

So there.

How about the long-time 911 guys who are suddenly taking notice of the 914 and (gasp) selling their tail-dragger to purchase a 914

I have been answering a lot of questions posed by a local 911 owner who once was very active in track events and autocross and is now searching high and low for the perfect 914 for both street and track.

He drove my 914 and even in its "daily driver project" status, he loved the car.

I don't think it's a stigma that 911 owners look down their noses at 914's. It's a fact! Now that the our cars are starting to increase in value there's a new found interest in our 914's. The 356 crowd are the worst of the look down on 914's crowd. Of course, most of those folks are crochetty old farts now with more $$$ than they know what to do with. So, they started buying up early 911's and drove their value into the stratosphere. If these old farts live long enough they'll do the same thing with 914's.

I entered my 914 in a local concours. I was the only 914. They weren't quite sure where to park me. A 356 guy walked up and said "put him with us, we're all 4 cylinder air cooled". that's when I knew the 914 had arrived:)

Honestly, as a longtime 911 owner, we don't look down at any owner. Now if the guy is a jerk, then yes, they'll probably say they were ignored. You could own a 918 Spyder. If you're a jerk, I'm walking away.

I am part of a few groups of various things in the North Bay Area..... here is a thought from my experiences:

1. My biking group is the least formal, most successful, and the closest to what I envision a 914 local group to look like.

2. The key to the bike club is that we have one thing that we all bought into, the jerseys. In our case it's easy... the car.

3. The only other thing we do is have a set date every month (in advance..... 3 or 4 months set in advance, at least) for rides. This way, people (members) can plan in advance to "save the date".

4. They rides are short - 2-3 hours tops. Start early, home in time to spend "quality" time with the family.

5. In our case, we could plan to meet somewhere, chat a while, take a a drive on a pre-determined route, optional lunch after - leave if you must.

No pressure to show up..... and you have to make the best of it if even 2 people show.

Works for a bike club, without the need for Presidents and Dues.

Hope it can happen..... I would participate.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

Lonewolfe wrote "The 356 crowd are the worst of the look down on 914's crowd. Of course, most of those folks are crochetty old farts now with more $$$ than they know what to do with."

I guess I am the exception to this?

I am only interested in the performance aspect of 914's..an older car that with quality mods that can be a giant killer on track days... not always with a porsche powerplant...I would really like to hang with Miguel and Shane at Sebring on track day...working toward that end...but country side drives and stop and eats hold little appeal for me ... so this site is as close as it gets...the PCA..... was member and instructor for a long time has little interest in our hybrid cars

Well; I've owned a 356 for many years and have participated in the clubs (all of them ). I think I can say , with some experience, that the 356 guys have pretty much abandoned PCA, for many good reasons. not the least of which is that most PCA members wouldn't know a 356 from a karmann ghia. go to a PCA event and you will see what I am talking about. this same mindset applies to PCA/914's (maybe even more so). PCA is not a good venue for us.
That said, it is true that a lot of 356 guys are buying 914's now, seeing the potential there.
we'll see
Randy
74 1.8
65 C coupe

Well, I can be counted as a previous 356 guy. The dirty truth is that the 914 is a much better car in every way. You can spend your 100 plus grand on a Speedster or Cab and how does it drive? It is certainly Porsche but nowhere near a 914 so let's try to keep it to ourselves!

It used to be the 356 guys were us. Guys just working on simple cars that yield maximum enjoyment.
Then the restorations began and the over restorations and trailer queens. Prices skyrocketed and now they sit in garages with wine sippers staring at them.

Hey I would buy one in a heartbeat, but to me they are still a $4500 coupe and $15,000 cab. I enjoy my 914 much more than any 356 I have owned.

Sorry for rant. Back to thread topic.


John

I do not like the idea of local chapters.
Most locals pretty much know who their neighbors are. I am lucky to have several around me, and we manage to get together a few times a year.

Folks tend to read mostly one or two forums. If we split things into the local areas, we will become too fractured.

Besides, we already have an events forum. I don't know of anyone who actually uses it, but we do have one. If you want your event to be seen, post it up in the garage. Ask one of us mods to color it for you. As your event gets closer, find a reason to bump the thread daily. Put adds for your local event in your footer.

Planning an event is a lot of work, and the guys who plan tend to burn out after a few years (I know I did). If we want events to thrive, we have to step up and make it happen. Splitting the forums won't help events. Stepping up and volunteering to help plan an event does.

Zach

Want a get together.

The SF Bay Area group has had some success with breakfasts at various restaurants. The last was Alice's Restaurant on the Peninsula. 12 - 14 of us showed up on a rainy cold morning. A group of us met in Hayward and caravanned to the restaurant. Over an hour trip for most of us.

The thing is, someone has to decide it's time and has to commit to setting it up (not that hard).

Pick a date, pick a restaurant with adequate parking. You may have to arrange with the restaurant to have tables ready at a certain time. We met at 9:14, stood around in the parking lot and BSed until 10, then went to breakfast. I set a couple up in San Ramon and someone from the restaurant staff came to get us when the tables were ready.

If someone doesn't like your choice, they better be prepared to offer an alternative.

Try it, it works.

You guys that think the PCA looks down on 914's should drive a 924 to a PCA event to put things into perspective .

I don't believe this topic has anything to do with the forums, just forming local clubs.

You're welcome to hang trackside anytime.
Here's the most teeners I seen in one place. Miguel, Joe and myself.

And so the point would be... what exactly?
How would "just forming local clubs" be any different from the way things are now?

The 914world MidA region has events 3x a year, and sometimes 5 or 6.

We don't have these events because we have a "local chapter." We have them because kick ass people like Rod, Jim, Matt and Scott who step up to plan and run them.

If you want to have a local 914world chapter club thingy - but don't want to have special forums and don't want to have special whatever, what exactly do think you are going to get, and how would it be any different form what we already have?

Zach

I've been calling on all 914 owners for 10 years now to come to the ALL AIR COOLED GATHERING in September. Maybe if enough attend we could start a chapter in New Jersey????

Last year we had 19 Porsches attend out of 300 air cooled cars total. A 914 won best in class, beating out 356's and 911's.

I would love to have so many 914's show up that I would have to make a separate class. This is our 10th year for putting on the show- let's make it a banner year for 914 participation.

The show is listed in the Event section of 914 World. Or you can go to the website to get all the information:

http://www.allaircooledgathering.com

Dave

Make a thread in the garage and ask me to highlight it for you. Talk t up in the garage not the events section if you want people to see it.

Zach

I have some experience with PCA at different levels and non-PCA Porsche clubs. The key ingredient is the people. If you have common people with similar interests, it mostly works. If you have inconsistent people you don't really have much in common with, you split.

Sorry to the socialists, but money is a factor... Concours people will likely prefer concours people. Racers / racers. Ricers / ricers. You can try and do it all but my experience is that people eventually split up.

The Euro experience intriguing though. You have to recognize like it or not that our cars are becoming collector pieces and while I used to race, used to build, used to club with PCA, all I really want to do is hang out with 914 people who love these cars. I love seeing the art people create. I love seeing people I like. I love learning about our cars. We are becoming old guys and will either ride this hobby into the sunset or will do nothing.

That said, I'm willing to be a part of the effort in N Cal because I know there are many many great people in N Cal and I like most of them.

I would suggest a small group with a small footprint and a small focus. Get the right core set. Do everything later. Have a bunch of small groups.

Cheers!

So my Sacramento Porsche Family Reunion events weren't local, regular, or organized?

Ok Al! I'll get something together! Especially if you'll come!

I plan on showing up this year Dave.(unless daughter give birth to first grandkid)...look forward to meeting the NJ 914 folks

I like this comment. I think where Jeff was going and was reflecting on was the cultural aspect in Europe. Culturally it is a different place than here.

I think the question might be is that it would be fun to have an event/drive and have a hundred teeners show up like in Italy.

I think the notion and question was that if having regional organization would help that happen on this side of the pond. It was meant as a discussion.

...this is one of the best shows in the area. Great venue (although they added some speed bumps, very bad for our cars and the 356 I drove in with).

Yep, local 356 guys here are in the POG (Potomac Owners Group).
That 356 crew is all about all air cooled rust-prone cars (early 911s and 914s) and to be honest a lot of them drive cars from 928s, boxsters, and newer 911s too. Maybe I'm just lucky to have found some good 914 and 356 guys in the area.

I'll be showing up too Dave. Leaving Wildwood early Sunday. You guys put on a great show....nice venue, friendly people, reasonable food and drink prices, and some seriously nice air cooled.

Paul makes a good point here. To prevent breaking up the World with regional areas, why not add a property to each users profile that indicates their chosen region of activity. This property could then be used by regional coordinators to identify and communicate thru World to their specific group when needed.

Sounds like a good direction to go to improve opportunities for gatherings

Some folks don't enter a location or a region when they fill out their profile, but both of those identifiers are already available for other members to see (if utilized). I don't know if Andy has it set up to allow sorting though

I see a few replies to this topic referring to the recent euro meet, and, why can't we be like that? well, I wonder how many here really understand how different the euro's see 914's than we do. here, it wasn't that long ago that 914's were a teenagers $400 rat rod. that's a hard vision to overcome. that was never the case in Europe and they have gone way beyond that with interest and values. google 914 values in Europe and you will see why they have no problem drawing from an (apparently) affluent owners group for these long distance events. It will happen here as well, the comparison to the 356 scene now is very apt.
I would compare 914 world to the early days of the 356 registry (with a little higher tech)
don't overthink this or overorganize. it will evolve on it's own.
Randy