You all know the drill, find the car, make the call and go see it. The seller in question is a little strange on the phone but I made arrangements to drive 50 miles to go see a "CLEAN" car. He said he would be at the location at 4 pm until 6 pm. Got there early and looked at the car and said it would take it. He goes, you will have to bid on it, there are other people coming to look at the two cars.
He had stated what the price was in the ad and I had the cash in hand. I said I was not bidding and left.

This certainly was a new twist for me!

What a jerk. It was probably a pile underneath anyway! Move on!

Not surprising. When his phone rang continuously he prob figured he wasn't asking enough for the car. I went thru a similar situation only to find that it was going to be an auction after I got there.

Gents, this is the exact situation we are seeing here in Australia for the sale of aircooled 911... Most of the sellers are genuinely listing their car for a price, but when they get 50 phone calls with people offering higher amounts sight unseen, I can imagine it would twist them inside out...
No one wants to sell something for half of what they can originally get, but I guess it depends on how they go about it too..

Good luck in the search.

All they have to do is start at a higher price and work down until the phone starts ringing.

I'll start with mine: 1974 2.0L Alaska Blue Metallic. Good chassis needing some minor hell hole repair. Runs great, but currently half the car is torn apart in my garage. $50,000 or best offer.

Either that, or he's pulling his own shill tactic

I've been in those kind of situations before too - and walked away pissed off. The seller is just another jerk. Hopefully it's not your dream car

Had a reverse situation too. Several years ago, I made an appointment to go look at a bike (Honda CBR) and spoke with the girl who was selling it at 10 am. The ad had numerous good pix and the bike had extremely low mileage, so I agreed to the price (sight unseen) and told her it would take me two hours to get there. I drove up with the cash and when I arrived at noon, it was gone! ... she sold it an hour before I got there and didn't bother to even call me!

When I asked why - she said she wasn't sure if I was coming or not ...

that sucks....if you found it on craigslist I'd flag his ad and make another ad calling him out for that practice to warn others!

Had a similar event a few years ago. Told the guy I would buy the parts car, what time I would be there, confirmed when I am 15 minutes away and when I get there I find a person I knew had bought the car and was loading it up. Let the guy know what a jerk he was in no uncertain terms. Hope karma bites him in the butt.

That is buying cars. Many years ago I was looking at a 914-6. It was an hour and a half away. 3 hour drive round trip. I asked the seller if it had ever been in an accident, he said no. I asked him again, had it ever been damaged, he said no.

I get there, the car had been cut down the middle, they grafted a front end from another car. I really, really wanted to punch him. He said, well, neither half had been wrecked.

Lots of assholes out there. Lots of good people too. It's just hard to completely avoid the assholes.

So he was telling half truths then?

Neither half had been wrecked. Hey that makes sense.......to him! What an idiot!

Had this happen with trying to buy a boat - three buyers showed up at the same time... We walked away - wasn't going to play that game.

Same thing with my nephew a few years ago in Loudon County in Virginia when looking to buy a relatively newer house; told the realtor to make an offer of X - $10k.

Realtor called back and said price is now X + $5k because there are other buyers. He ended up getting the house at X + $15k.

This happened to me about 15 years ago as well. I agreed on price on the phone, set up a time to comes out, drove out there, saw the car, and was told it was already sold. The 2nd person they talked to offered them $500 more vs the asking price. Good for the 2nd person though!

As others have said, it has happened to me too many times to count.

First incident:
1988 - a seller had a one owner 1971 XKE for sale. Called the owner at 9:00 pm and said I would be there in the morning as soon as the bank opened. Drove over with cash and some dealer was loading the car. Seller said the guy claimed to be me!
(Seller said are you Bill?... Guy said Yes). Seller was pissed but he had already signed over the title. Dealer heard us talking and just gave me a sh!t eating grin. Saw that car for sale in Hemmings a couple months later for almost twice the selling price (this was pre-internet for you youngsters...lol) Karma is a bitch...dealer was killed in a car wreck about a year later. Fvck him.

1994 - seller had a Maserati 3500. Had always wanted one. Made plans to drive to see it that day (remembered my previous experience). Drove 2 hours to see it....guy said he "forgot" that I was coming and sold it 30 minutes earlier

Multiple similar stories on less expensive cars

Most recent - Saw a craigslist ad for a '69 911. Price was good (but not that great). Drove to see it with the intention of leaving a large deposit while I transferred the rest of the money if it checked out. Saw the car, was ready to buy and the guy says he was taking bids and I would have to give a $1000 refundable deposit to bid! Said no thanks and walked...

Just a thought. If a car/part was listed for $1000 OBO we typical think oh I could get it for probably 800. OBO could mean higher than 1k...

I took some major shi t here for not allowing test drives and
Only inspecting the car where it is

But my price was my price


If people wanna auction off their cars ,maybe an auction is the place for that or eBay

And I always thought buying a car was a first come with the money
First serve but lately I see tons of cars priced thousands over blue book.

When I point that out to sellers and say I'm not paying 1500 extra cause your a nice guy
They get all pissed off

And then there's the ole

Blue book is always lower then actual value

Or

Honda's are worth 1200 over book value cause it's a Honda

Or

I just fixed the ,ac and alternator so I need to get back that money in addition to k b b value



This is stuff I've actually heard from people


I ask em where did you come up with the price your asking
From off the top of your head.cause this 10 year old car is really worth x
People get really offended




But this is modern cars I'm talking


When you start talking aircooled of classic cars then
There is no blue book value and stuff does get weird but

Like this car will just go up in value so I want 3 times what it's worth today .






" Marcellus Wallace "

The world is filled to the brim with unrealistic mother fucckers .
Mother fucckerss who thought their ass would age like wine ."

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/cto/5138969109.html


Like this s#it I forbid anyone to pay 5 k

For this .

Unless you dreamed your whole life of owning a
Old Honda civic


If its your dream car go ahead and pay the 5 k

The undisclosed auction thing is a pita.
Others Sellers are a pleasure with to do business
It's a numbers game.

Working at a car dealership, and working with trades for new purchases, blue book comes up alot. Well blue book says my car is worth x amount. Normal response is when and how is Kelly going to pay you. Do they mail you a check or give you cash when the wrecker gets there. Do they adjust the price stated when they actually see it? Makes people think a little more about what they said. Of course this mostly happens on high mileage, engine light on, body damage, french fries under the seat trades.

And we all know dealerships are the most reputable sellers out there.... Sorry, I could t help myself...

Lol. Good point. I try to be as honest as possible without hurting people's feelings.

Do you really speak to potential buyers like that? If encountered that attitude while trying to spend my money, the next sales person in line would be getting my commission to pay their mortgage.

Not in those words exactly but to that point. I am just summing up the point that blue book is a guide and not a bible. And to the point of my attitude, well everyone knows text comes out different then actual words spoken. I am sure in person you would like me. I don't sell cars. That's someone else's job. I choose not to sell cars to people that can't afford them. I'm sure everyone here has bought a car they wish the salesman had been more honest about and can appreciate what I'm trying to say. Example being a 750 dollar car note when you make 3000 a month. LoJack installed because the finance company knows their getting it back. I just can't do that.

K b b. Trade in and private seller are two different stories



But I'm saying to people I will not go above k b b

You telling em you won't even go to k b b value





So let's clarify those statements

Defiantly would pay above kbb if the car warrants it. The point being it's a guide only. Example 2000 Boxster, 133000 miles, 2nd engine, 2nd engine bought off ebay, rbay motor is smoking and has a whine, top does not work, tail lights cracked. Rough trade is 3500. Is it worth that to me who is going to have to recondition it for sale to make a profit? No, it is an auction piece.

I suppose it's like everything in life some deals are sweet some are sour ! first 914 .... Turned into a rust bucket second purchase was blind but through McMark and its nearly here ... 3rd Aug the container lands, I'm praying for tooth decay !
As for dealers , Ha 2010 tourag to trade in one dealer offered £12k the next £6k, sold it through a dealer friend who made a turn and ended up with £10k both the previous quotes were from VW franchises !

So one over valued it and one under valued it. Right in the middle sold.
Frustrating for sure.

No offense but any body who spends more then 500 bucks
On any m96 engined car makeing any funny noises is dumb

2nd

This thread is more about buying cars private party to then own
Not fix an flip like some dealship vulture

And I just bought my boss's old work truck
(2001 ranger 226k on the clock with a 1 yr old jasper engine and trans replacement in it ) for 1200

Think I'm getting a good deal ( only thing that matters) since I drove the truck for 9 months at work and it's solid

But he initially tried trading it in and Ford dealer told him
They would not even take it because it no longer has original drivetrain .

No offense but any body who spends more then 500 bucks
On any m96 engined car makeing any funny noises is dumb

2nd

This thread is more about buying cars private party to then own
Not fix an flip like some dealship vulture

And I just bought my boss's old work truck
(2001 ranger 226k on the clock with a 1 yr old jasper engine and trans replacement in it ) for 1200

Think I'm getting a good deal ( only thing that matters) since I drove the truck for 9 months at work and it's solid

But he initially tried trading it in and Ford dealer told him
They would not even take it because it no longer has original drivetrain .
[/quote]
everything but the vulture comment.

Never thought about it in that light

I used to work for an independent repair shop that had KBB access. It was a pay per month service. One day we looked up what certain Volvo's were worth,( we did Volvo's). The problem with KBB is once you hit a certain numbers of miles it devalued the car to the same degree.

In other words, a car with 230K miles was valued the same as a 450K mile car.

Since then I've put little value in KBB's opinion.

A good rule of thumb I use when I sell is, "leave a little something for the next guy". I try and price it right so everyone feels they got a good deal. You tend to make and keep contacts in the community and eventually it works its way back to you.

I've never run into the auction when a set price is asked. I'd walk on something like that. Seems underhanded, especially if terms have been set prior to showing up to complete the deal.

I gotta defend 914nola a little here. I used to own Exclusive Motors back years ago, we sold primarily used older Porsches. EVERYONE that walks in the door thinks their cars are worth more than they are and ALWAYS quotes KBB on what they should get. We would make them an offer that we felt we could do. It was always the seller that would immediately get defensive and start quoting prices. You start out being very cordial saying "This is the best we can do", but if they keep arguing and arguing, sure, eventually you say "well then ask Kelly to send you a check" or something along those lines. Remember, all of you deal with one or two transactions, one or two asshat buyers or sellers here and there. With a small independent dealership, you deal with them every day!!

Back on topic, Like Bill, I had many, many similar experiences as noted above. I distinctly remember the worst:

I had negotiated with a guy to buy a car that was a 7 hour drive away (14 hours round trip). I had talked to the guy for a week (because he was traveling and didn't have the documents I asked for until he got home), got all the info, negotiated a deal, even got a bill of sale he signed and faxed back to me and I overnighted him a $500 deposit. He was great, easy to talk to, very honest sounding, gave me everything I asked for. I drove up early in the morning with a cashiers check for the balance, only to see the car leaving his neighborhood on a trailer and finding out he sold it to someone else!!! I said "but we have a signed bill of sale and I sent you a check" He said 'sorry, this other guy gave me more" obviously I wanted my check back, to which he said he never got it but it was a cashiers check so I couldn't stop payment, I started to argue more and he pulled out a gun and said 'get off my property or I'll shoot you!!!" He then called the cops while I was standing there saying I was harassing him. I wanted to wait for the cops to come to explain, but it seemed obvious he knew the cops personally... so I left and lost the $500.

So...when you deal with this kind of BS on a somewhat regular basis, you may start to understand a little why dealers can be such asses. I tried my best to be honest and fair, and I think we developed a very good reputation in the Porsche community, but episodes like this make you hate dealing with ALL people....

I certainly would not buy a car from someone who refused to allow a test drive. Even the Ferrari dealer nearby will allow test drives so I would think the seller was definitely trying to hide something.

When I bought my 914 it was across the country. Even in that case, I arranged for a knowledgeable Porsche friend to go take a look and drive. His telling me that it was without question the nicest, most original, 914 he had ever seen sealed the deal.

Funny thing is that I will bet that you set a double standard and that YOU would never BUY a car where the seller refused to allow you to test drive it.

I once sold a bug to a guy that drove 6-8 hours both ways, guy agreed to my $1500 price sight unseen. While he was driving another guy offered me $2000 and I wouldn't do it. At the time $500 was a week's pay, but there is no way I would do that to someone.

Another time 3 guys showed up within 15 minutes of each other and got in a bidding war with each other for a motorcycle I was selling. I stopped them and sold it for asking price to the first guy who showed up (maybe 5 minutes before the next guy).

I think a little integrity goes a long way.

You have class and I like that! My Dad used to tell me your word was bond.

When I was selling my Audi allroad I had made the sale over the phone after the guy had his mechanic look over the car in detail and given me a deposit to hold it. The guy was going to pick up the car from me at my work ( an hour north of me, and 2 hours from him) 2 days later per our agreement.

I got 3 calls on it that next day after the verbal agreement, 2 was a guy that wanted to come down right then and buy it for $250 more than my other agreed buyer, and another was a guy that wanted to look at in and was in the area (Which I let look at it, but explained there was another buyer and he would be contacted).

The guy that I refused the extra $250 basically cussed me out since I refused to sell him a car I already had a buyer on.

I had a similar experience when I Craig listed my Harley Davidson. I set my price below KBB and said or best offer. Very first caller said he would take it for what I asked. As the calls kept coming in I kept explaining that I already have a buyer but I would be more then happy to put them on the list. I was called many things which doesn't phase me one bit. But what actually bothered me was being cussed out by a guy that wanted to go 1K over my asking price. I said no, he wasn't happy and I really didn't care. Integrity is rare these days.
Andy

This brings up the other side of the story.... To me, a deposit trumps everything. Our policy was: if we agree on a deal, a deposit will hold the car for the mutually agreed upon time, no matter what. We immediately put a "Sale Pending" sign on it. However, the deposit was refundable ONLY IF the car was not as described...i.e. if you just got cold feet or your wife found out and said NO WAY, then we kept the deposit. (unless you called us before we even got the check, then I would either return it or tear it up). If we are holding it and effectively taking it off the market, we need SOME protection.

It all comes down to mutually agreed upon communication and the integrity to follow through what you agreed upon. Every situation is different, but doing 'the right thing' is usually pretty obvious...

Hopefully you took the guy to small claims court to recoup the $500., if nothing else.

I don't know how bad the argument escalated, so I can't comment on that issue, but it sounds like you had a legitimate paper trail, and if the cashier's check was cashed or deposited to his account, he committed fraud, in addition to brandishing a weapon

Double standard , No ,Fuck No



First off I was more then willing to take potential buyers for a ride with me driving


And when I bought the car ,the po
Took me for a ride ,went thru all the gears ,demonstrated
The brakes etc

And is one of the nicest 914 around and a joy to own and drive

But I'm sure you meant no offense

Being 7 hours and a few states away, it would have taken way too much effort and cost way too much to deal with. Plus, I'm sure he would have brought all his neighbors in to back up his innocence at least as far as the gun goes...remember I was just some "vulture car dealer"....

I saw your website and I thought you couldn't make 914 s into competitive race cars ,guess I was mistaken



And aren't cars supposed to have women's names ?

I think I'll take that first comment as a compliment

Yeah, supposedly. But our 'kids' aren't nice and well behaved like a lady - they are loud, aggressive, get into trouble, and can take a beating then fight back. More like adolescent boys...

I can tell you this though, Papa Smurf really SHOULD be a woman - cranky, bitchy, moody, VERY high maintenance, argumentative and extremely stubborn. He's an absolute joy and pleasure to be around when all is good. But when things aren't to his liking..watch out!!

We only named two of ours - mine, the "Black Bastard" (non-gender) aka: the 'BB' (to be PC) - because the car had been totally bastardized by at least one PO ...

... and then there's my wife's 914, "Howard" (or "Howie" for short). I guess women typically name their cars after men

Now that I think about it, we never named a 911 or a 912 ... or for that matter, none of our other vehicles, except for our Westy camper van ("Eileen")



Too bad about your $500. loss, Bob - I would have figured a way to write it off on my income taxes

oh we did...that was long ago...and like I said, the MOST stand out of the PITA dealings we had...we had MANY, MANY more, but not that bad.

Our worst from a money standpoint was for a car we were going to buy. My biz partner talked to the guy for over a week, got pictures, details, everything, agreed on a deal and mailed a $2000 deposit (it was a $30k, car). A week later we sent a truck up to pick it up, only to find out that the place, guy and everything didn't exist. We got scammed.

After that, we always found someone to put eyes (and hands preferably on the car before we committed to anything. Lesson learned...

I guess I got lucky when I bought my 914. I'm in MD and the seller is in OH. Talked on the phone a few times, he emailed me pics and we even did a facetime walk around the car. We agreed on a price and I offered to send him a deposit. He said that wasn't necessary, that my word was good enough. Drove out there a week-and-a-half later, the car was as described, we concluded the deal for the agreed price, and I drove the car back home without a problem. Well, we did have one problem -- the water pump on my wife's car gave out less than 10 miles from home on the way back. The 914 did fine.