The REAL question is "Why did they design an engine that needed oil?" Did they Eff that up too?

Napier is a diesel in the marine application I would guess.

Appears you've had your sea legs for a lifetime.
Been to the Bay of Biscay?(Cockney)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rogue_wave

Yes the Deltic is a Diesel in Marine form. It had two types of starter motor, the first was an air turbine, the second was a holder for shot gun cartridges, that you fired and the explosion cranked it over!

As for sea legs, yep you could say I've had had more than my fair share at sea and sailed the bay far too may times to count.
That rogue wave info is interesting, like the Clooney movie "The Perfect Storm", I've been at sea in these conditions twice. once in 87 and again in 96. In 96 I was Marine Engineer Officer of the watch on a Type 23 frigate (they were brand new back then) and we got into a terrible storm. The ship started to split in two. Cracks developed on 1 Deck abaft the beam forward of the hanger and aft of the superstructure. We had two teams around the clock with tape and marker pens, measuring how wide it opened and how fast it moved across and down through the ship, marking and timing each progression. It went completely across 1 Deck and then started going down through 5 Deck and then below. The Frigate was being tossed like a cork, we didnt sleep for 3 days, being thrown around inside, pumping out water while the crack only needed to go a few more feet before it got to water level and the ship would have flooded, broken in half and been lost.

Never underestimate the power of nature.

Fortunately we limped back to Portsmouth and I help the dockyard shipwrights repair the damage. From then on all Type 23 had an enormous gusset welded in between the hanger and superstructure on 1 deck to strengthen for this calculated 1 in 100 year event.

So back on track....Any news Geoff on your AFR D-jet trace?

Did Porsche eff up?

Been reading on different types of fuel delivery systems and their pro and cons.

Many of the Guru's (about 5 to 1) prefer carburation.

With this being the case, Did Porsche mess up when they went the EFI route with the 914?

WHY DID THEY DO IT?????

I would like to keep my car stock with the factory EFI, but increasingly getting more difficult to do with so little information backing it up.

If you really want to know the answers to your questions, you need to do some reading offline. Take it directly from the horse's mouth:

Get a copy of "Excellence Was Expected" by Karl Ludvigsen.

You will not only get an explanation of WHY Manifold Air Pressure Fuel Injection was chosen for the 914, but how Porsche went about making their decisions. You will also get the entire history of the company.


If you don't walk away after reading that book with a great deal of respect for the company, the decisions they made, and their place in history then it staggers the imagination why you'd suffer through the expense and hard work of owning and maintaining an old German car.

Part of owning a Porsche (even a NARP 914) is appreciation of the brand and the engineering. If none of those matter to you, sell the 914 and get a Honda.

If you really want to know the answers to your questions, you need to do some reading offline. Take it directly from the horse's mouth:
Get a copy of "Excellence Was Expected" by Karl Ludvigsen.


You will not only get an explanation of WHY Manifold Air Pressure Fuel Injection was chosen for the 914, but how Porsche went about making their decisions. You will also get the entire history of the company.
If you don't walk away after reading that book with a great deal of respect for the company, the decisions they made, and their place in history then it staggers the imagination why you'd suffer through the expense and hard work of owning and maintaining an old German car.

Part of owning a Porsche (even a NARP 914) is appreciation of the brand and the engineering. If none of those matter to you, sell the 914 and get a Honda.

I see what you did there with the subject change. Having second thoughts about the "eff up" question?
Now you are asking if they expect excellence. Well, of course they always strive for it. Some things work better than others, but over time it's always about improving over the previous technology.
Are all your questions rhetorical?

I see what you did there with the subject change. Having second thoughts about the "eff up" question?
Now you are asking if they expect excellence. Well, of course they always strive for it. Some things work better than others, but over time it's always about improving over the previous technology.
Are all your questions rhetorical?

Nope nothing rhetorical at all

Excellence was Excpected is the name of a recommended read.

No second thoughts, More what could have or should have been done by the engineers at Porsche to supply the end user with a "True" Porsche. That's all

Now you want to play the "True Porsche" card??? I wish you'd learn to use search features so you wouldn't clutter up the board with 'loaded' comments and questions.

... but this one keeps going over the same old ground. D-jet & L-jet FI from the 70's ... it is what it is

I think the OP simply has too much time and would like to bump his tread up so he will be noticed as a value contributor.

I think the OP simply has too much time and would like to bump his tread up so he will be noticed as a value contributor.

What do you mean by "bump"

OP is working on a time machine. He will convince Porsche they should have kept carbs

Alright simple question

914/4 EFI. 914/6 Carburated ...why?

Obviously many here would gladly trade
Their 4 for a 6 which didn't come in a fact
EFI configuration back then....if the 6 was
Truly all Porsche then why put a set of
Garbage (?) carbs on it? And go with what
Some are saying is the far superior EFI?

I just doesnt make sense.

Either Porsche was lazy and didn't want to go all the work to inject the 6, or they thought it to be in exact and not worthy of installing on the 6.

I don't know...maybe there is another reason?

The 914/6 engine is simply a 1969 911 T engine which had already been designed and was in production at the time the 914/6 started production.
They chose a low end 911 engine to avoid the 914/6 out performing the 911.

Jim

Alright simple question
914/4 EFI. 914/6 Carburated ...why?
...
Either Porsche was lazy and didn't want to go all the work to inject the 6, or they thought it to be in exact and not worthy of installing on the 6.
I don't know...maybe there is another reason?

What do you mean by "bump"

I believe we all know what forum means.

Alright simple question

914/4 EFI. 914/6 Carburated ...why?

Obviously many here would gladly trade
Their 4 for a 6 which didn't come in a fact
EFI configuration back then....if the 6 was
Truly all Porsche then why put a set of
Garbage (?) carbs on it? And go with what
Some are saying is the far superior EFI?

I just doesnt make sense.

Either Porsche was lazy and didn't want to go all the work to inject the 6, or they thought it to be in exact and not worthy of installing on the 6.

I don't know...maybe there is another reason?

Did Porsche eff up?

No they didn't eff up, they did the best they could with the new technology they had. It seems as though the technology was purchased by the folks at Bosch from the aviation component of Bendix. That said most Injection systems were originally good at idle and full open throttle, so primarily racing applications. So in there infancy not well suited for automobile applications.

Been reading on different types of fuel delivery systems and their pro and cons.


There are very few con's to todays EFI systems, there were however performance and reliability issues with the original designs. Even today Claims of increased HP, Fuel economy, drivability, reliability and so on....some still dispute
how much these differences really mean. It appears the main thing EFI does extremely well over Carbs is in the pollution factor, or in this case the ability to pollute less. Carbs are a some what open system allowing hydro carbons to escape/vent in to our atmosphere even when the engine is at rest, where as the EFI is essentially a closed system releasing no vapors or gases unless the engine is running and those gases are then coming out of the tailpipe from the exhaust cycle.

Many of the Guru's (about 5 to 1) prefer carburation.

The above Statement isn't correct, although what confuses this OP is the sheer amount of photographic evidence on this site and others including evilbay and CL showing most engine compartments with Carbs installed. Many here have spent thousands on their cars, and what do you see when the lid is lifted? a Carburated engine..... So while my intentions will be keeping my cars in their stock or near stock form, with EFI, I cannot understand why so many Carburated cars. (Because its easy isn't an answer, because its simple isn't an answer and because its cheap isn't an answer)

With this being the case, Did Porsche mess up when they went the EFI route with the 914?


I do not believe they messed up, I believe they did the best they could with the available technology they had. Granted they did sort of use the end user as of a kind of a guinea pig/test bed, but what manufacturer doesn't in some way.

WHY DID THEY DO IT?????


I think that just as much as seeing the Ljet and Djet as a performance and platform to develop future EFI systems off of, Porsche and others also incorporated EFI into there products to show they were progressive company's in design and practicality.
EFI, Unibody, Targa, Mid engine, four wheel disc, and many more attributes can be cited as Porsches View into the future.

I would like to keep my car stock with the factory EFI, but increasingly getting more difficult to do with so little information backing it up.


Above statement is also incorrect. In my case I think I am fortunate because I believe I have most the parts needed to reinstall the factory EFI's on all three of my cars. There is a plethora of info on both sides, but for now.... just for originalities sake, EFI will be the way I go.

To those that added constructive comments and or facts to this thread... it is much appreciated...to those that took this thread as some sort of attack on their beliefs, or way to "clutter" the site, I can appreciate how you feel, but I just see those arguments as shutting down the free flow of ideas and the give and take of facts that get each of us to arrive at our own understanding of the information.
Click to view attachment

Enough already. I cannot ban you but I can ignore you.