Coming from the BMW world (and 4x100 ) where there are a ton of made in china replica wheels of the original quality, I always stay away from anything thats not authentic. I feel the same is the thought with these, but I was hoping to hear some actual experience with these... you never know?

Im mostly concerned with 2 things.
#1 Quality? The BBS reps were crap and could be easily spotted
#2 Weight? They are notoriously heavy wheels and besides the look of the Fuchs wheels they are also pretty light from what Ive seen.

Thanks

-Simon

Quality - not as nice as the real thing
Weight - not as light as the real thing
Strength - cast - not as strong as forged Fuchs.
Price - not as expensive as the real thing.
Investment - real Fuchs hold their value or appreciate, fakes do not.
All depends what your needs are.

Only time will tell whether they are worth it or not.

I'm running 16x8 fuch replica's on all 4 corners on my car. I love them & have had no problems. They are definitely heavier & under close scrutiny people know they aren't real. I have not had a problem with quality of the wheel itself.

Biggest thing is cost. New you can buy 16x8 replica's 250-300 a piece. So you are into a full set for $1000-1200 new. Used you can find them cheaper. Especially if you buy them one at a time.

Real Fuchs are an absolutely awesome wheel. Just harder to find & super expensive. Especially in the 16x8 size. They are difficult to find & demand top dollar. Your looking at $2500-3500 for a nice restored set of real 16x8 fuchs

I have had 2 set's of 4 for my car over the last 3 years. Neither have made it onto my car. Had other things come up & they are easy to sell. So I've just sold them & kept my replica's

EMPIs 15x6.............$ 150.00 each includes cap. No tax

Little heavier but made up by removing my 75 bumpers.

Really couldn't give a Rats Ass about originality, where not talking about a car that's going across the Barrett Jackson blocks at 100 K.


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but you also have a Subaru motor in yours. you have no loyalty

Which Fuchs wheels? There are a number of different kinds.

AFAIK, all of the "windmill" style Fuchs wheels that were put on Porsches were forged aluminum. That includes the four-bolt ones used on four-cylinder 914s.

The replica four-bolt wheels are cast aluminum. They are heavier and not as strong as the original forged ones. But they are new, and don't have a zillion wear cycles on them with possible curb rash and all of the ills that can happen to a wheel over the years. The ones I had on my old 1.8 did not fit as well as the originals on my 2.0; they tended to grab ahold of the centering rings on the front hubs and not let go. I believe there have been a couple of different manufacturers for these over the years, but the quality seems to have been similar on all of them--decent but not great.

Most of the replica five-bolt Fuchs are also cast, but I'm not sure if they all are. There are several different manufacturers, and the quality varies widely. The "Fuchsfelge" wheels are made by the original Fuchs company, and I believe that they (or at least the centers) are forged. The cast wheels tend to be heavier and/or less strong than the original forged wheels.

The replicas tend to be cheaper, all other things being equal. They are also available new, which the original wheels aren't really. (Or if they are, it is in very low numbers at jaw-dropping cost.)

I didn't like the look of the four-lug replica Fuchs; the painted recessed areas aren't to my taste. I also really did not like the way they bonded to the front hubs after being on for a while. (Even worse after the car sat for months.) I do like my real ones.

--DD

I'm never getting rid of the last Pair of 16x8s I have!

I wish I had waited a few years selling my 15x9s - I could probably retire for what they are worth today!

http://www.braidusa.com/Wheels/Comp/BZ/BZ.htm

Not cheap replicas, have not heard a single negative thing about them. Lot of 911 guys over on Pelican run them and a few guys here have them as well....

Pretty sure the guy with the LS powered 914 that hit 165 mph a few weeks ago is running these.

If looking for quality 4 lug sorta-replicas, Magnus walker just had some made by fifteen52 wheels, pricey but shouldn't have any quality issues being new billet.

I also don't think I've seen anything bad about the $99 2.0 Fuch replicas. Of course I doubt anyone is running race tires on them and abusing the daylights out of them.

Unfortunately Porsche people can be biased (edited to be nice) just like BMW owners, factory original or nothing at all. I'm with Dave, with these factory wheels approaching 40 years old with no idea how treated perhaps a quality knockoff wheel isn't all that bad.

I absolutely resemble that remark .

In all seriousness for the price of real over fakes. Unless you have money to burn or come across the rare once in a lifetime deal. Just buy a nice set of replica's. The way the value is on them now. Even if you find a set your probably better off mothballing the damn things. Just worth to much to want to put on my car for daily driving. Another reason I sold both sets I had worked so hard to find.

I have a real set for sale at pelican , anyone here need them ?
Fuchs weels

They're not that much, $1-2k for a decent set.
We've already sold 10 sets of Fiske wheels this year. $4-5k a set

Guess I'm still in cheap 914 mode! I forget all the prices have gone up. Never would have considered spending 1k for a set of fuchs 10 years ago. Now I'd do it in a heartbeat. The Fiske wheels are sweet. Wouldn't mid trying a set of those on my 914

I think the smallest diameter is 17". I haven't warmed up to that size on 914's or early 911's.

Are those prices per wheel or set? Per set that's really not bad for a high quality wheel. The weights coupled with the fact that they are a TUV-rated is a pretty good indicator of their quality to me.

1 wheel .... if old stock Fuchs are going for $500 to $1000 each (that might need another $1000 for refinishing), not too bad for a brand new unit.

Eeek. I was optimistically hoping it was not per piece.

I agree though, for a new high quality wheel it's expensive but definitely not out of line.

For a high quality wheel,that is still cheap. Look at the price of those Fiske's or BBS's. The money spent on ugly wheels in the Pro-Touring or RestoMod arena is Insane!

A word of caution buying used original Fuchs wheels. With todays tire technology and highly modified engines, original Fuchs forged wheels can be put under stress levels way beyond their original design specifications. Hairline cracks can and do form and, in some cases cause catastrophic failures. This usually occurs under race conditions rather than street driving. There are several articles relating to this subject. Make sure you know the history of usage (street or track) and inspect closely. Just because they're the real deal doesn't guarantee that they are road (or track) worthy. The metal does fatigue over time with hard track driving.

Dave

Dave's words are wise ones.

I just had a crack appear in one of my 15x8s:



And also found cracks in a pair of late 70s dated 15x7s that I had bought with a plan to refurb.

The simple fact is, buy a used pair of these wheels and they are 30 to 45 years old by now. Who knows what a life they led in the past? I guess you take your chances (as I have clearly done!)

There are now some VERY good replica wheels available, looking very close to the real thing, weighing less, and available to buy brand new... with a 3 year warranty.

I would put the Braid reps at the top of that list, at least in terms of reps that are easy to get hold of: Braid's US website


Here in Europe we have other options which are even closer to the real thing, but only available to order, and at a very high cost!

you dont even own a 914 to put them on?

which ones actually weigh LESS? I thought most, if not all weight MORE???



me? I know, but I try to be as knowledgeable as possible and I am definitely getting a 914 next. If/ when I sell my E30 I will have the cash to buy the car and I usually move quickly. Main thing Im trying to decide is whether or not I want to convert to 5 lug, and this is a big part of the decision.

I put 17" Euromeister's on my 911 and love them. They were 20lbs for 17x9 and 17 lbs for 17x7. No issues after 5000 miles. Not sure if they make a 914 variant.

The original Fuchs were long gone when I bought my car and I just didn't want to take a chance on 30+ yr old rims.

[/quote]

me? I know, but I try to be as knowledgeable as possible and I am definitely getting a 914 next. If/ when I sell my E30 I will have the cash to buy the car and I usually move quickly. Main thing Im trying to decide is whether or not I want to convert to 5 lug, and this is a big part of the decision.
[/quote]

I have a E30 and a 914. do both

The problem with doing both is that the E30 would absolutely never get driven if I have a 914 also. Its one or the other and I know which one I would rather have right now.

back on topic...

how many different manufacturers is there in the replica Fuchs market? Empi? Euromeister? Braid? anyone else???

Late to the thread but I am using two sets of 15x9 Braid replicas on the rear of mine because (a) they fit and (b) they are new. Cost was not the factor for me and these replicas are $700-900+ ea -- my factory 9's would not fit my car's bodywork so I sold them.

I have been happy with Braid in appearance, strength and weight but not a lot of miles/events on them yet. They seem to be on the nicer side of the aftermarket wheel options for our cars though.

My key caution with Braid is to watch out for international shipping and customs fees. Mine were built to order and drop-shipped from Europe -- I used the same well-known SoCal reseller a couple times and they botched import and shipping costing me extra and possibly inducing delays.

On the front I use NOS factory 15x8 Fuchs. Lucky score of a few pair a few years ago.

Is a pound or two heavier really going to make or break your vehicle setup?

Hi Mueller, a pound or two, no. However, I look at the car as a whole and evaluate everything individually, but look at the overall goal.

For example, on my E30, I bought the lightest model that was brought to the US which had manual windows, locks, no check panel, etc combined with an aluminum 24v block (only brought to the US in the 97-98 Z3), added 11# SSR wheels in 16x7 and now my car as a whole weighs ~300# less than a comparable 24v swapped car and can beat the M3 powered 3.2L cars with only 2.8L and returns better mpg. Its a fun car thats not a stripped out track car, but is a full interior, big stereo, carpeted car.

The plan is very similar with the 914, though I plan to stay with a 4cyl motor, so if I plan to stay on the -6 guys tail, I need to look at everything I do especially since there is less of a variance between the 914 models than there was with the E30s

like I said earlier, I do my research in advance and try to keep it generalized, but since people keep questioning me, this is my full disclosure response

If that is the case I wouldn't be looking at 5 lug at all, nor would I keep the stock 4 lug, I'd redrill for 4x100mm and run one of the numerous good quality rims available for Miatas in 15x7 which will also allow a near perfect offset.

http://www.good-win-racing.com/mazda/miata/process.html

Only "bad" rim I've heard about are the Rotas which I don't think anyone sells anymore.

One thing going for you with a -4 cyl is you probably won't need 9-12" widths in back which gives you more wheel/tire options and saves weight and cost. I say probably as certainly there are some insane high-powered -4 widebody cars out there that do run wide slicks. With my -6 build I literally had no choice, as once I added power the car became nearly undrivable even with a LSD. So I went from a square setup with 205 (~8") DOT-R on all 7" Fuchs to 10" full radial slicks on the new 8/9" rims.

haha trust me Ive looked into going 4x100 because the SSR wheels I have are near and dear to my heart, but it doesnt seem like a good idea because of the centerbore and spacing. I actually think the other very common jap wheel pattern of 4x114 (or something) would be better as the offsets are common to the 30s and 40s with a selection nearly equal to the 4x100.

now were really getting OT

I had asked asked someone selling some western/ dan gurney wheels what their weight was and the reply was that they were less than 9# !!

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=282194&hl=

not sure how true that was but the fact that he was basically giving them away and then threw them away made me quite sad. Im always looking for a good deal and even though I dont have a 914, I would definitely have stored these wheels until the right one came around.

certainly a better deal than replica Fuchs

16x7 Konig wheels, 4x100 offset

Better choices in wheels than when I did this 8 years ago.

If somehow I sell the E30 and still have the wheels, I will have to seriously consider going 4x100. Mine currently have an et35 setup, but I have a friend with the same wheels in et42 I think. Im going to PM you about the whole 4x100 thing. Im trying to keep this on topic

Advantage - Real Fuchs look uber Cool!

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Street or race? If you want light weight, the four-bolt hubs AND BRAKES are the way to go. For the track, air ducting will be required. I've seen some very serious guys who had ducts to the rotor and to the caliper--the duct covered all of the exposed rotor so you couldn't even see it!

Custom wheels will be the way to go if you want light and wider than the stock four-bolt 5.5" width.

I sincerely doubt that the Gurney wheels were less than 9 lbs, but it is possible.

If you're going to run on the track, I would find new wheels rather than trusting 40-year-old ones.

--DD

Don't do it, not if you drive hard.

Its crazy to me to be asking these kinds of questions for a car you dont own.
Granted a good discussion has come out of it but
if you would rather own your e30 then stick to that?

Im not sure what your problem is. I tried to search for my answer. I couldnt find it, so I posed a question, not specific to myself, more for an informative thread and I keep trying to keep it that way.

The E30 will be going to auction once its BAR legal in California. As soon as it is sold I plan to buy a 914.

at this point, Ive gotten my answer but I will keep reading any other posts. I suggest being helpful or quiet.

-Simon

Wow! I have heard of that happening. Would the euromeister wheels be OK for a street set of wheels? I haven't heard anything bad on those.

The Rota Fox's also seem like a good choice if you like 17's.

Anything can happen to old parts but if we are going to give up on older Fuchs, we migh as well give up on old engines, transmissions, ect. Forget about 356's. Just drive priuses.

If anyone is looking for 15" Fuchs Deep 6 or Deep 7R replicas, take a look at Group 4 Wheels. They make a real nice product cast in Italy by a real wheel mfg, not some china knock off.
As many have stated earlier, some of the 40+ year old Fuchs wheels that have been driven hard can be cracked.

http://www.group4wheels.com/wheels_dp6.php

Cheers!

The picture I used was the failure of a fake FUCH, not a real one. I've never seen a real one fail like that. As far as driving a 356, I drove mine all day Saturday.

Simon: Dominic's advice is good. Take a look at their campagnolo reps. They look very nice in gold, especially on white or red teeners.

A failed rim can be a little more fatal than a failed motor or transmission.

First, it's FUCHS. The "S" is part of the name, not a way to make it plural. (It's German for "Fox", hence the fox-head logo. You wouldn't say a single fox was a fok, would you?)

Second, I've seen the real ones fail like that. One of them happened to a friend of mine, though the wheel in question had been (professionally) converted to a three-piece wheel. Cracked right between the lug holes, came apart, and damaged the car. He was thankful that it happened on the way to a DE and not at the DE.

I know of several more instances where real ones have failed in similar fashions, even without having been turned into three-piece wheels.

They're old, and it is very difficult to tell how hard they were used before you got them. You can Zyglow them for cracks, you can X-ray them, you can just decide the odds against it are really steep, or you can buy brand-new wheels.

For my car, at least so far, I'm choosing to ignore the problem and use my old wheels.

--DD

45 year old aluminum hubs, aluminum trailing arms, aluminum cross members, ect. Lots of critical aluminum parts on 914/911's.

I'm sure some real FUCHS have cracked like that, but the repro I showed was fairly new if my info was correct, so it should not have cracked like a decades old wheel, it's like the new flywheels from China that hand grenade quickly. Repro stuff is fine for cosmetic stuff, but I never trust it with hard components, not if the real stuff is available.

New or Old Wheels can crack! Stresses from Track Use & Grippier Rubber put forces on wheels that they sometimes can't overcome. Remember the Fuchs that were on our cars were never intended for slicks or downforce.

The Picture from unobtainable can happen to Real or Fakes, but most I have seen are Fakes. This is because the "Casted" area around the Lugs is not Thick enough or Strong enough! Many Multiples of Impact Guns can worsen that area.

If I'm tracking a Car, I have more faith in an INSPECTED 40 year Forged Wheel than I would have on a New or Used replica Cast Wheel!

4x114 >> 4x4.5"
It's much more common OEM, most asian and Chrysler. FWD and RWD offsets. Larger center bores, though none 914. I've toyed with the idea as you can get some really nice track worthy wheels at mass market car prices.

The good news for us in the U.S. is that all U.K. products just got a lot cheaper due to the British pound losing ground against the USD, and it's predicted to go lower.