@Can-Am thanks for the lead. It’s definitely worth a call just to see what they say.

@wonkipop that samba thread is what I saw early on that really got me thinking about how far my car actually was

@Superhawk996 . Well apparently capital paint and refinishing is a franchise. The first one I found online was here in DC. So naturally I thought nothing of it…. Then another in TX, and now the same name in denver!

Maybe I just need to start spamming BASF until they put me in contact with a regional sales rep?!

PPG buddy - just sayin’

You can’t get deltron single stage anymore! They discontinued it a few years back.

PPG Concept is their acrylic urethane

have you got to this point in BASF Glasurit USA website?
i'm thinking you have but.......

you can do a search state by state.

https://refinish.basf.us/where-to-buy/

i typed in annapolis, maryland and got this.
its a biggish list.

https://refinish.basf.us/where-to-buy/

one of them might at least be able to give you a tip or give you the story.


btw, i did the same thing for australia,
and the distributor i gave you in PM does not come up.

edit,
given the quest for the AAV i know your not going to give up without a fight.

edit 2
i found some other stuff digging deep.
i guess guys who have taken original paint off 914s know this stuff.
what was on the cars was apparently 3 primer or undercoats.
1 - dark grey etch primer.
2 - light grey primer.
3 - white undercoat.
4 - single stage top coat. (ie two coats with short interval?).
those who know could confirm. never dug into mine.
the white undercoat under the top coat is interesting.

i can see what you are up to Van. you are going to go over the paint presently on car with some prep?
hence the 22 line?

I purchased Gasurit from capital paint in Denver about 4 years ago to do some touch up and repaint the hood. I ended up with 55 line and used it as single stage without clear. In my case it was an exact match to my car which was repainted in the about 25 years ago with unknown paint but the color matched to the re-painted and unpainted areas like the trunk, Frunk and engine compartment as well. My car is Olympic blue.

Click to view attachment

john

Hehehehe. The paint scientist I spoke with back then was maybe 80 years old. Would be close to 120 by now.

As a side note, ORM and refinish paints were quite different back then, too. OEM we’re oven bake dried while refinish was air dried (with catalysts later). Funny story: someone, maybe a sales person, had some excess or off spec auto paint but didn’t know this difference. Somehow it got out and a person used OEM paint to paint their basement. Of course it never cured. BASF spent a lot fixing that basement.

PS: My formula sheets have the name of that AG paint scientist if one really needs it. If not in the docs on Jeff’s site, I still have all of the for reference.

Like DuPont, BASF got out of much of the refinish paint business years ago. I think the main production plant is in Greenville OH. The plants in Belvedere NJ and Moorestown(?) NC shut down a few years ago. R-M was the big refinish paint line; they had several.

@wonkipop there are many areas that will need to be taken down to bare metal and re layered from the bottom up: etch, prime, seal, paint. That sealer step is almost always skipped on budget or home repaints. Which means poor adhesion and moisture penetration under the paint.

The BASF website and that stupid blue BMW profile shot have been a fixture on my chrome tabs for a few weeks now… along with this site:
https://www.chemmasters.net/VOCmap.php

I’m avoiding ultra low VOC states because my opinion is that a single stage paint needs VOCs in order to perform.


@StarBear I’m just kidding with you… unless that intern actually does run the company now?!

@targa72e . Would mind elaborating a little more on how you got topcoat finish out of the base only? I’m intrigued

You gotta’ remind me where did the paint OCD start ?

Why hooked to Glasurit?

Why not use base / clear vs fixation on single stage?

It's best you don't ask those kinds of questions lol... If I wasn't this way I wouldn't have this F'ing hobby or car! I would go lease a 992 and be perfectly happy!

indeed!

@Van B

time to try a different route for a while? less frustrating.
contact porsche restorers in Maryland and talk to them.

i don't know who is good.
but i just googled and a few came up.

https://classicporscheresto.com/cpr/

you might get the straight low down on where to still get the paint from.
with a bit of luck you might end up speaking straight with an american version of dennis down here.

am trying to work out what @targa72e means by only using the base coat.
don't know enough about paint. but 55 is still solvent borne - not water borne.
does that mean that base coat is not a flat coat - so it is doable.
but i'm just plain guessing.

his colour sure looks spot on in the photo he posted. nice.

interesting map.

the blue states are federal EPA standards.

here.

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-1998...df/98-22657.pdf

extract

Click to view attachment

Glasurit 22 line VOC data sheet.

https://techinfo.glasurit.com/en_UK/PKW_VOC...2_VOC_print.pdf

theoretically still complies in the blue states.
VOC level of 22 = 419 g/litre.
under fed EPA level of 600g/litre.

i can't see any revision of those EPA regs (that date from 1998/99 approx).
though anything that is not a blue state has its own tighter regs that over-rule.

if Glasurit 22 is difficult to get it can only be a decision by BASF to manufacture a uniform set of products within USA and to limit importation of paints from European Plants.
ie they have decided to simply manufacture to the more severe VOC standards of the other coloured states.

this may be the case in Australia too.
i am unaware to what extent BASF manufactures paint here, but i would think they would rather than ship it.
i know for a fact that the 22 line that you can get here is imported and not manufactured in Aus. and its not necessarily illegal. just a grey area.

EDIT

i'm thinking this is covid related. ie disruption to global sea shipping and freight.
this paint would be sea shipped. i reckon BASF and others would have pulled manufacture back to possibly one or two factories in Europe for 22. it would be a shrinking sales line restricted to really specialist use in restorations. strategy would have worked fine in pre covid world with sea freight the way it was. but now they have just dropped it in countries where they don't manufacture it. freight is too hard.

the retailer who sells it here is sourcing from the UK and is doing his own shipping.
i'm betting it takes him a while to get new stocks in too. the stories i hear about how long freight is taking to reach australia is fairly interesting.

hence what you are looking for is someone similar to the current supplier here.
some-one shipping in the paint and retailing it to small circle of resto shops who want and have to use it. for certain customers. thats my reason for suggesting you try directly contacting specialist restorers and talking to them.

as far as i can work out this would not be in breach of EPA in all the blue states.
the paint appears to conform to standards.

Last time we had to Mix Centari (as an example) we had to open $2400 worth of paint to mix a $120 qt. That was the last mix.

We chose and economy line that had different qualities to mix.

Kevin

Fair enuff’

@Van B

i've worked out the same thing is going on down here as USA.
i have a bit of an interest in this as m who owns the workshop is talking about repainting his "flachbau". i don't think its a real one. but its still pretty good.
i wanted to get an answer on this because i was getting a sinking feeling from this thread topic.

i checked through all the BASF dealers in aus. its not as big a list as USA. only takes the time to drink a coffee.
despite BASF website listing 22line, 55line, 90line and 100 - the only thing on all the dealers websites is 90 and 100. period. not even 55. seems to me BASF has withdrawn 100% from solvent based paint supply in aus!

i don't think the alternative aussie paint dealer here is doing anything illegal.
he is openly selling on a public website with a legit business that retails all sorts of high end auto paint. he must be tacitly tolerated by BASF because they don't want to manufacture or bring it in anymore themselves, so they just let him do it, still money in the parent company's pocket? it must still meet epa (aus) standards (for now) or he would be shut down. its too out in the open to not be kosher at present.

but what i can conclude is that its days are very clearly numbered.
the crunch may also be coming here sooner than folks think?

i reckon @Superhawk996 might be spot on here.
if you want urethane then you are going to be down to whatever supplier or manufacturer is left standing. and cross your fingers they can come up with the colour/quality.
australia always follows the USA scenario, so its only a matter of time in our neck of the woods.


EDIT
as a further clarification, the indi dealer has got 22, 55 and 90 but no 100.
he does not get access to the 100.

@wonkipop
I have painted a few cars but not a pro. Just enough to not be afraid to give it a try. I used Sikkens for years until I could not purchase it anymore and then switched to Glasruit. I did not know enough to specify a specific line when I was trying to purchase for Blue 914 I just asked for the correct color code and that I wanted to be catalyzed paint. That is how in ended up with 55 line. Nice thing with solid colors is that you can always sand and buff to get a nice finish. Hood was painted, sanded and buffed. Other areas were just left as sprayed.

john