Picking upon a recent thread, how much is a Perfect, Mint Concours level 914/4 car worth, if you could even find such a car to purchase?

I have seen Concours-winning, fully-restored 914/6 cars go for $20-25K, which seems about right, but I never hear anything about a 914/4 in similar condition.

This is the car I mean:

73-74 2.0L, with all accessories
*Perfect, Mint, Concours winning condition
*No PO 'upgrades'
*Fully restored or original in every way
*NO RUST ANYWHERE

My guess is it would take the following to make such a car, if you do most of the disassembly/reassembly work yourself:

5K Good original sound, complete car, needing restoration
4K Engine/trans rebuild
2K Wheels/tires/brakes/suspension restoration
4K Paint/bodywork
2K Plating/new exterior trim
2K New uphostery/interior
2K Misc weatherstripping/top refurb/missing parts

20-22K Total


My guess is this car might sell somewhere in the $12-15K range.

What would you pay as a buyer?

A neighbor of mine sold his concours-winning 1974 914 to a museum. Although he has never told me exactly what he got for it, he gave me the impression that it was around $15K.

Completely stock 914-4?
I would never spend over 8K for a perfect one. What are you getting?
The car is just not worth much. It is/was not "rare", fast, well known or even well liked by most people like a 911 is.
Sorry, but a stock -4 just doesn't have the value for the dollar.
Paul

"The car is just not worth much. It is/was not "rare", fast, well known or even well liked by most people like a 911 is.
Sorry, but a stock -4 just doesn't have the value for the dollar."

Thanks Ury, thats an interesting perspective...

Most 911s are not rare, but certainly faster than a stock 914...and for some reason I am not attracted to a 911...just not my style.

914s in Concours, unmolested condition on the other hand are quite rare...I guess it depends on what one person values...speed/condition/uniqueness

I would rather have a $15K 914 than a $15K 911 anyday...

I'm personally not into concours cars per say. I'm just too busy to worry if I'm reinstalling the correct type and properly marked bolt in the heater control cable trunion under the car. I have never heard of a porsche 914 concours show. Ofcourse I live in the rust belt so that goes without saying. I do agree that a concours 914 should be worth $ 15000.00. I'm just not sure I'm the buyer. The hotrodder in me would wreck the thing in a week...

Bowlsby,
I realize that everyone has things they like more than others and will pay more than the average guy would to own it. That is where market prices get a little out of whack. Look at some of the stuff (shit) that sells on E-bay and the prices people pay for it. A 914-4 LE black/yellow would be the most "rare" -4 there is, but I would pay more for one with all the right upgrades than I would a pure stock one.

Paul

I agree Jeff that it would be worth $15k for one. I am with Rich, if I had one I would be tempted to modifiy it. I like these cars for the driving pleasure not their styling. I do think they are going up in value, atleast for the nice ones. I do see a few here in Seattle at the concour events, just not my idea of fun. I prefer the autox track or twisties topless.
Geoff

I think that I would pay 12-15k for a perfect 914. I too would rather have a perfect 914 for the same money as a driver 911. Then I would take it to the track and auto-x it anyhow, and watch everyone shake their head. I mean what could happen to it right? Ferg.

as much as i like to see people to at least take "originality" into consideration, i agree with some of the other post, a stock 914/4, even in perfect condition does not sound very, hmm, appealing? it'd rather have the "upgraded" version. i think of it more like, what would a 914 look like if Porsche would make it today? upgraded suspension, bigger engine, different spoilers, bigger wheels etc etc etc ...

because of the excellent handling and fairly low price,
it makes for a perfect "customization" project ...

Andy

There was a '74 2.0L last summer from the St Louis area that went on e-bay for like $14,500. Marathon Blue I think? According to Bob D. it was MINT and documented well. It had 30k miles too. Anyone see that one? The "buy it now" was at $13,500.

Sorry. I should have been more specific. The car I was referring to won the CONCOURS EUROPA BEST GERMAN CABRIOLET POST-WWII category at the Greenwich Concours d ' Elegance. The car is in beautiful condition with 20K miles.

Last summer I bought (from Rennlist classifieds) a '74 1.8 car that meets some of Bowlsby's tests but fails others. I got it from the original owner who now lives in Tennesse. He bought it in Pennsylvania and drove it regularly for a couple of years. It has 31,000 total miles. It has been shown in regional PCA concours events in the southeast as well as autocrossed (often trailered to events). The rest of the story: The car was substantially modified by PO.
916 style bumpers with body color rockers (all other paint is original phoenix red). Sway bars front and rear installed by Stoddard in Ohio when car was near new. Console added with custom 4 gauge array. Camber truss in rear trunk, Koni externally adjustable shocks, hard suspension bushings and ATS wheels. The competition carbed engine came to me in a crate as it had tossed a rod bolt and fractured the case (why the owner gave up on it after 28 years). I am installing a carbed 2.0 in the next few weeks. The interior looks brand new (PO only used the floor carpets for show, drove it with bare floor). As to price: I won't say what I paid, but would not accept $10,000 if offered I have no good picture on file but the right front is visible in my Avatar.

Do you have a larger version of your avatar. I need to show that to my wife She actually was almost accepting of me getting a 4 post lift.

Bowlsby, check back issues of Excellence, like around last summer maybe. A fellow in Michigan has an un-real 74. I talked to him at a show near Toledo, OH. A very nice guy who definately has time and money. Hopefully he's on this site. I can't imagine any 914 being better than that. He ordered several duplicates of every part for his re-build, including nuts and bolts, and then used only the best. Its better in person than in the magazine.

tahoward,

are you talking about the green -6 ?

No, its a 74 2.0. Its in Aug. 2002 Excellence. The owner is Tom Bliznik. I Hope he's a member here. It is a yellow car.

So the basic current consensus on this and the PP BBS seems to be that a Concours 914/4 is reasonably worth:

$12-15K for a flawless restored car

and

$15-20K for a perfect original car

Values within the range are dependant on mileage, special status (Italian), original paint, etc. and preferences of wht a specific buyer is interested in.

I remember the Italian car...it was on the market for ever...

I think the value is whatever a prospective buyer is willing to pay.
It may not be unreasonable for high quality, desirable cars to go for $20k soon.
Especially so if more than one wants it at the same time.

Hi Jeff & Tahoward,
Thanks for the kind words on my car & Jeff great article on LE's. I believe my restored (Aug. Excellence) 914 qualifies as mint restored. I have been asked what my price is & it's $25 big ones if I decide to sell. I believe anyone who has the desire & money will step up & pay the price. I have $15K in parts alone, plus another $6k in outside services or a total of $21k into the car including my $400.00 purchase. I also have over 2000 of my free manhours in the restoration that's worth something. I believe any restored car will have 2000 to 3000 manhours plus material costs. Do the math & you approach big bucks having a professional restored car. Of course I didn't consider costs when I did my restoration. It was a labor of love. I understand not everyone has the money or effort to do what I did but you can be sure & back in the next five years and say "would have , should have" because the cost & availabilty of good 914's are drying up. Hope this picture comes through to show you the level of detailing. I have been a lurker & just had to respond. Thanks everyone. My 4 kicks butt on a local 6's till we hit 100. Right Gary!!
Tom Bliznik, HIPO-2L - Yellow

Tom-

If you want to post a pic from your hard drive, browse, find the photo, select it, and DO NOT preview your post, just click "add reply" post the sucker. That's the only way you can post one that's not on a server somewhere.

See attachment "Tom's 914".

Tom, that's a beautiful 914

I've seen it in person. I'd be afraid of driving it on the streets....

BTW. Is that the correct number of wraps on the wiring harness?

Hey Tom,

Nice car...in fact I remember showing your car to my wife when it was featured in Excellance...she too thought it is an exceptionally nice 914........

Hey Mr 914
To answer your comment on the wire wrap. In doing my restoration. I found out the German's used tape (cloth electrical) about 1/2" wide to wrap the wiring in the trunk area. I found out you can't buy this size as only 3/4" wide is available. I then cut down the vinyl stuff down to 1/2". I know the guy in N.Y. is laying in the bushes to pounce on it at the next concours meet. He's my best buddy Gary's friend and has one of the best 914's on the east coast. It's Bob or Jack?? Are you out there?? I left that flaw to make sure it's not perfect. It's a councours weenie thing. I am really not one, but got carried away in the restoration. Now it's just a nice 914 to me.
Tom Bliznik HIPO-2L - Yellow

Tom,
That's not a car.......it's art. You did good!

I've seen the car in person and it is truely somethink to behold. I'm sure it is as close to perfect as is possible (3/4" cloth electrical tape not withstanding). Tom, congrats on posting a pic. Now that you know how, how about posting some more. Here's a pic I have of Tom's car taken about 3 minutes after I saw it for the first time. The goose bumps I got hadn't even worn off yet.

Thanks Curvie,
Back to Jeff's original post "what would you pay for a mint restored 914-4" I know a lot of 914's are under construction and the future looks good for increasing values. I am in the stage of my life when I was able to put money into my 914. You know the dog died, kids through college, wife lets me spend money on my hobby & the rest is history. The best part of doing my 914 has been the friendship that developed with the 914 beaters to the high end 6's. I believe the high $$ 914 is already happening. Like in the stock market, it's already over when us little guys start to think about it. I believe in the next five years you will start seeing some very high dollar 914ers coming out.
Tom Bliznik, HIPO-2L - Yellow

914s are worth what people are willing to pay, or sell them for.

It seems like seeing that older couple willing to part with their cherry, original owner, '74 2.0 is getting farther away.

As far as value? Depends on who's buying. I think we will see clean cars go for more and more over the next few years. Prices seem to be climbing.

As far as driving, I like driving both my modified 914 and my stock 914. Both cars have a unique personality.

The stock one is due for some restoration work, but you will never see it for sale. $100K wouldn't get it from me because you can't put a value on a car that means something to you. I may upgrade from the 8 track though.

Fair enough. I, on the other hand, am 95% or so concours weenie - even for a 914/4.

Alfred

Allright guy's.. help me out here.

What is a concourse car ?? The Yellow car above is obviously a great car, but every pic posted has something "not correct" on the car.

The other day somebody posted a pic of a cherry engine compartment belonging to a guy who wins concourse events (and it had carbs) ????

I dont get it. When I visit the Palo Alto Concourse or Pebble beach... the cars are dead nuts stock, not SSI's and a coated Bursch.. or carbs.

This ranks right up there with "show winning" 1999 Boxsters ??? How hard could it be to keep a new Boxster clean ?? LOL

B

Does anyone know where I can buy the August 2002 issue of Excellence? Pelican Parts lists it as NLA.

Thanks,
Alfred

Alfred,

Call Excellence and ask for Stan Michaelman. Tell him Brad from SSI told you to call him. Ask him for the back issue you are looking for. Play the whole game and tell him how much you really liked the issue with the Yellow 914 in it. He is the advertising director and always seems to come up with issues that I missed.

B

Thanks Brad!

Hey Guys,
I need to defend myself (my yellow Excellence issue#112). I am like most of you guys built the car to my personal standards. Yes, it's 95% bone stock with internal motor modifications w/FI, Bursch exhaust, upgraded suspension, soon to have BMW-320 brakes, bigger tires, different radio, & polished Fuchs. I probably would not enter Pebble Beach & win, because it's a 914 or for that matter they don't want me. I built the car to better than the original 914. To my way of thinking this touches the hot button of all 914ers. Nuff said. (ok the price just went down .50 cents)
Tom Bliznik, HIPO-2L - Yellow

No worries (no need to defend yourself) I would have built it EXACTLY the same way. I enjoy show cars and street cars. I consider your's a "show car" not a concourse car. When I hear the word "concourse", I think about Hemi Chargers with proper grease pencil marks on the firewall. Batteries with the 1969 date code punched out on them... Red Line skinny tires from 1969 GoodYear moulds. This is concourse to me. I'm just trying to get a better idea of what people consider "Concourse". I personally think the magazines use the term too much.

Your car is the reason why we need a readers rides page dedicated to the cars.

B

The things I learned from this thread:

1. 914 owners are a mixed-lot…no two are the same…some are into testing their ingenuity by re-engineering and ‘improving’ the 914, others want a virginal factory timepiece. Both viewpoints are valid…feel the LOVE guys…

2. Driver 914s run up to about $8K…then there is a gap in pricing.

3. $12-15K buys a pristine restored 914/4.

4. $15-20K buys a pristine original 914/4…if they can ever be found, or a nice Six. $20K and up for a restored or perfect original Six.

5. 914s in better condition are becoming scarce and difficult to find anywhere and will continue to escalate in value, whether equipped with four or six jugs.

6. Hey Paul – How come the price guide does not reflect the LE cars when it lists all the others?…The LE cars are more rare than the 914/6!

7. Different definitions of ‘Concours’ are floating around. To some it means flawless condition, but minor invisible (or not) upgrades (320i brakes, subwoofers, wider tires, etc) are ok. To others, it can only mean the car is in exactly the condition it rolled off the assembly line…the original window sticker still on the window would be ideal…

8. The most rare LE car is not the Bumblebee, it is the Grasshopper!

9. Any car is only worth what another buyer will pay. A car with $50K in parts alone, without counting labor…may still be a $5K car if that’s all someone will pay for it.

LOL!!!

Somehow, I think you mean "exactly the way you wanted it", rather than "that particular shade of yellow, with the Bursch muffler and 320 brakes and..." Somehow, I don't see you setting up a 914 that way...

--DD

don't be too hard on brad!
it took me 15 minutes last night to convince him that a bolt, 5mm longer
than the original, for the top of the brake-bias on mueller's 914/6 would be OK,
because the original sucker just didn't want to get back into that lill hole ...

yes, he's THAT anal ...

Guys,
Heres Mine Owned It For 28years,Really Clean,Always Garaged,88k Miles.Ive Owned Many Cars And Alway Kept The Teener.I Think The Value Is In Clean Orginal Cars.Prices Who Knows Supply And Demand Will Only Tell. Thanks,914

Actually Dave..

I love that Yellow. He can keep the 320 brakes.

Andy,

That new bolt caused me to lose sleep last night. I'll probably fight the install of the OE bolt...LOL

As I get older (32) I'm really starting to understand the concourse weenie thing. These cars are getting harder and harder to find in decent shape.

B

There is one way to get a concourse car, do what 2 guys here did. Buy it brand new and park it in the garage. The first one was a Buick (hot sport model?) now 8-10 yrs old 22km on it & a guy at work has a Prowler with 8km on it.

Hey 914 (almost sounds like a Steely Dan song)!

Do you have any more pics? There is a thread for club members rides, you should post a couple nice shots there!

there was recently a factory 914-6 resto for sale what was as new as you can get. this was my all-time dream car. signal orange with tasteful upgrades (911s brakes, 2.7RS, koni's, etc, etc). everything on this car was brand new. it was on the market a long time and just sold recently (when I was just now in a better position to buy it!). anyone on here the new owner? this car probably sold for $25k, which I find to be a great deal.

that is just sick man ...

i just had my car completely stripped and sandblasted,
spent 5k+ on a decent paint-job and it looks quite nice
(from the top anyways) but nothing like THIS car ...

makes me wonder why my dad didn't think about buying a 914/6 new when they came
out and garage it for me. arrghhhh ...

sad, sad, sad ...
Andy

Vortrex-got any more pics of that car? One is not enough!

jim I've got a bunch I can email you, don't want to clog the forum.

here's one more teaser...

Hmm, looks like Dean Vanni's car. He's been showing that in the Zone 7 concours events (complete with photo album of the resto) for something like eight or ten years. Took 1st place in the 914 division at the 2000 Parade in Sac'to. (Though I liked the green 914-6 better myself...)

--DD

I think this is a different car dave, it's a 5 year old resto done in NY and sold to someone in montreal.

I drool over these shots every time. Here is the place that did the resto on the orange car(along with some pics):
Deman Motorsport

The yellow one from this site was in excellence about a year ago.