Tried to find where new members introduce themselves then figured this is as good a place as any.

Well, today I bought my 3rd mid-engine Porsche - one I never dreamed I want or own, but as it dropped from heaven into my lap, I had to take it.

I drive a stunning dream car - a 2011 Cayman S, loaded, PDK, Sport Chrono, Turbo II wheels and much more - my 2nd Cayman. Always thought the 914 was the ugliest car Porsche ever made - but then, IT IS MID-ENGINE!

Well a true barn find (in a friend's barn for 12 years, but not his, about 40 miles from me) dropped in my lap this week, and I had to take it......a mint condition, virtually no-rust 1976 914 with an almost flawless body and interior - for a cost so low that if I told you I'd be arrested for stealing it!

Been a restorer of old Triumph motorcycles for years and never ever had a thought of restoring an old car - other than any old Porsche other than a 914!

But as condition of this 914 was incredible and the cost of this '76 was close to nothing, I could not refuse.

Am so glad to find this forum to help me through getting this car on the road. I do know it was running perfectly when it was driven in my friend's barn - he had been in it a lot that day, and was in it when it rolled in the barn, running better than new.

I'll fill you all in on the details shortly after my introduction here, and look forward to meeting many of you. I'm a frequent forum poster, and my thread on finding & restoring my 1972 Triumph Bonneville is one of the oldes and longest an highest rated threads on its forum - over 2,000 posts & replies, over 200 pages, and 5-Star rated:
http://www.triumphrat.net/classic-vintage-...-to-riding.html

I know I'm going to need a lot of help & wisdom, and glad to find a resource that can help!

GN

Welcome from another Virginian

Hey gatornapper.....this site only is open to people who can wrestle three alligators at a time....not just one.....what gives?? Picking on that little lizard?

HaHa...welcome aboard!!
gg

gg -

Thanks to you and the other guys for the welcome.

Yeah, 1 gator at at time is my limit. I'm a wimp. Actually, you would not believe where the name came from - I was so named in a headline by a major city newspaper in 1965 - after a close friend and I "borrowed" a full-grown, 6', 200lb. alligator in a northern state for a prank. Long hilarious story, with newspaper articles in my possession - no - we were not sober. We were facing $6k fines and 6 years in jail because while we released the alligator in a pond in the woods, the pond fed a creek that led to the largest lake in Indiana, and the gator got into the big lake. Lake residents, finding a full-grown alligator in a northern Indiana lake wanted us put away for life. But we got off with a good chewing out from judge (who made us think we WERE getting life) with a $35 fine. My first taste of the mercy of God, for sure.

True story. And I have a thousand more like it.....

GN

I like that you "own" that name. Now put up some photos or they don't exist....seriously, this is a good crowd and you will come to love the 914.

Michael -

Ok - hearing "you will come to love the 914" coming from an owner of a 997.2 says an incredible lot! Being used to a 320hp mid-engine car that is only a few lbs. heavier than the 914, I've wondered how I could ever get used to 87hp.......

The PO raced 911's in major races, even some of the 24 hour ones - and he said someday he wants a 914/6.

One of my options I'm considering is putting an older 911 engine in mine.

But tooling around in the Targa with the top off in the mountains sounds very addicting to me - so I may indeed be content with leaving it stock.

I am so glad this forum exists. Believe me - I will use it.

GN

Ok guys (& gals?) - here's the scoop on the car.

No pics yet - only took detailed close ups of possible rust areas as car is in friend's dimly lit barn. Will have pics in a few weeks after I get the car to my place. We are at Outer Banks, NC starting tomorrow thru the end of the month.

BTW, I am a pretty good mechanic (extremely active 72), having a full auto shop/4 -5 car garage at my home with 10k lb. lift. I do everything on cars, trucks, motorcycles except for machine work and body work. My garage is full of motorcycles, 3 old Triumph's I dearly love and ride regularly, a '72 Honda CB350 (nephews - helping him restore), '86 Kaw Vulcan that was my son's and I want to sell, a 20 year old Harley Wide Glide, a 2009 Harley CVO Road Glide, my son's '04 Yamaha R6 and a daughter's new 2017 Triumph Bonneville Bobber (I led her to it after she decided she didn't like her Sportster any more - she loves the Bobber and it's mine to ride when she's working! Sweet.)

I live in the hardwood forest of VA on 15 forested acres in 1,000 acres of woods with 2 log homes I and my sons built together. I am an electrical engineer who got into computers in 1979 and have a degree in English as well. Yes - I'm weird.

As I was surveying the 914 for notorious rust problems I saw something I've never seen, and it really puzzled me. Original paint & body are almost flawless. Just need buffing out. 3 tiny rust bubbles in original paint under driver side corner of windshield, driver door window, Targa bar behind driver door.

BUT, all interior body panels - front & rear trunks, engine bay, etc., are clearly new paint. All panel areas look BRAND NEW! No rust - anywhere. Well, 3 small rust spots, 2 bubbles under windshield trim, one rust spot behind driver door.........HUH?!?!?

WHAT? NEVER seen that in my life.

Then got the PO on the phone. Answered every one of my 100 questions MORE than satisfactorily.

The car had a "frame off" paint app. with proper prep of POR 15 in the original color by the owner before him. It was a clearly professional job performed by someone who really knew what they were doing. Every nook & cranny I could see is new paint. I just wish they had taped off some of the labels under the lids. I think this was done about 20 years ago.

The car has Dual Throat Webber carbs on each side - and modern Electronic Ignition. WHAT? #2.

PO said that he ECU died, and a replacement could not be found. The local Porsche dealer suggested new Webber's and new EI, and performed the work - it was clearly professionally done, well done. Carbs need to be rebuilt due to ethanol sitting in them for over 10 years - but I rebuild carbs with my eyes closed and one hand tied behind my back. Never done Webbers, but they can't be that bad.

Fuel tank was removed and professionally cleaned, waiting for POR 15 lining with comes with car. New fuel lines, pump, filters, pressure regulator come with car. All need to be installed. Piece of cake.

Interior appears flawless - just needs a good cleaning.

I do see paint flaking from rocker panels and under car members and panels. Not sure why, but will drill down on that once car is on my lift in a couple weeks.

New competition front brakes have been installed. Tires are very good, but obviously will all have to be replaced due to age.

Won't know more until I get the car here and go through it. I know there will be hidden issues. I've been around the block a long time.

Still think I almost stole the car, and can't wait to restore it.

Will tell you all more as I learn.......

GN

.....WELCOME to the WORLD!

914 FRIENDS -

The more I learn about this amazing little car, the more excited I'm getting to get it home and in my garage. I've been reading everything I can find on the web, and here, and I had no idea this humble little 2000 lb. car had so much going for it.

This article really got me fired up:

https://petrolicious.com/articles/why-the-p...-is-collectable

I and my large family are at the Outer Banks, NC for our beach week together, waiting to see if hurricane Maria is coming to visit us.

So I won't be able to pick up my new sweetheart (glad my '11 Cayman S can't get jealous) in October - but I'm thinking I'm going to have a good classic car Detailer visit my 914 in my friend's barn and get her looking pretty before I bring her home. That way I can get some great pics of her and post them here for everyone to see.

GN

914 Friends - thanks for all the warm welcomes.

QUESTION: Is there anywhere on this site where I can find/connect with other 914 owners in central Virginia?

TIA,

GN

'76 914 2.0
'11 Porsche Cayman S, PDK, Sport Chrono, Turbo II wheels in matching grey, loaded
'71 Triumph T100C Trophy 500, all original; '72 Triumph T120V Bonneville, mostly original; '74 Triumph T150V Trident, almost museum condition original (I ride all 3, last 2 fastest production bike '59-'69)
'97 Harley FXDWG Wide Glide; '09 Harley FLTSE3 CVO Road Glide
'96 F-150 4x4 w/factory Off-Road pkg.

One of the most important upgrades is ditching the plastic fuel lines that run through the center tunnel (if it hasn't already been done). There are a couple of sources for stainless steel fuel lines and they're sold by good standing members on this forum ... Robert (Rotary'14) is out here on the west coast, and Chris (Racer Chris) is on the east coast.

Looking forward to seeing your barn find

Harleys, Hondas and Yamahas in my stable too, but started off with a '38 Trophy 500 back in the early '70s ...

Thanks Mark - haven't seen them yet, but pretty sure the new fuel lines the PO is providing are stainless - the only way to go for sure.

Can't get to car til next week as we are in Outer Banks, NC enjoying the winds, waves & rain from Maria....;-)

Would love to see what a '38 Trophy 500 looked like - guessing it was a hot bike then.....but are you sure it was a '38? Didn't think the Trophy 500 existed then.....pretty sure what you had was a Tiger 500........

GN

My Trumpies - only this shows my '73 Trident, now have '74....

http://s890.photobucket.com/user/rahanes/m...d15d62.jpg.html

'11 Cayman S -

http://s890.photobucket.com/user/rahanes/m...c7185d.jpg.html

http://s890.photobucket.com/user/rahanes/m...abe226.jpg.html

Konrad

PICS! PICS! PICS!

These pics were taken by the owner from whom I purchased the car on the day he parked it in my friends barn/Quonset Hut 12 years ago. Car sits today just a few feet ahead of where pics were taken.

As I thought proper, I posted them under Members 914 Pictures.....here.......

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?s=&...t&p=2531643

The paint is oxidized, but should look like this after a good but shallow polishing......

Whatchall think?

GN

Could be I acquired it from one of my brothers when he shipped out for Nam ... and he acquired it from another friend who built it some time in the '60s. I was told it was a 'Trophy' ... what was a 15 y/o to know back then?

I'll see if I can round up some old 'Brownie' camera pix

It was gold metalflake with green metalflake flames, cut-down 'Z' bars, a peanut tank and a solo seat pad. Got my first ticket on it

from Yorktown VA

Anderss - PM me your phone # & a convenient time for me to call.....

know of any others here in central VA? Have to be more....

GN

Ok friends - brought the '76 home today and am overall very pleased with my findings digging into the car.

#1 of course is how rust-free the car is - everywhere. Few rust bubbles under paint under window trim, one 3/4" spot where targa rail hits body.

Lots to like - great 190/R60 tires on all corners for one - old, but like new. I know, they need to be replaced.

Generally this car is in amazing condition and I think worth - once running and well-detailed professionally - at least $15k...if not more....

Now's when I begin to ask the technical questions. What is the best way to do that here? Of course I'll search for answers before posting. But do I Post a list on the main Garage forum? Or on a technical forum?

Simple one now is original fuel pump electric? I have a new electric one and pressure regulator for it. Where is the original located as it has been removed from this car?

And sources for parts? I know of 914rubber.com. Body parts? Like wheels for trunk springs?

TIA,

GN

Your in the right spot, post all your questions here in the Garage....

P.S read everything in the 914 world thread > Lapuwali Classic Thread Forum
Also go to Pelican parts and read everything in there tech threads
and I can't forget Jeff Bowlsby 914 website, lots of great info.

The fuel pump on '75/'76 models is located in the lower driver's side area in the front trunk. Small metal cover plate down low, should be easy to see ... pump mounts behind it.

CoonDog - Thanks! Will do!

GN

Mark -

Found it this afternoon while just getting more familiar with the car - thanks! Cept mine didn't have a plate covering it. Tank is out of car...

GN

Yes, the plate that holds the fuel pump is there - thought you meant a plate above it. Allows access from Frunk w/o removing tank....testing pump tomorrow - was filled with what looked like fresh gas! After 10 years sitting......wondering how that could be.....

Thanks Mark.

Friends -

The more I tear into this car, the more pleased and amazed I am. A rock-solid, almost mint condition, almost totally rust-free car. Oh, little spots of rust here and there, but cleaned out frunk and trunk and they look almost new. I cleaned them and hit them with some detailing polish and they look great, as do both frunk and trunk carpets. Open them and it looks almost like a new car!

Cleaned interior, superb condition. Did look under custom carpet cover over dash and it is cracked in 3 or 4 places - anywhere I can get a replacement dash?

Interior is otherwise immaculate - just missing floor carpets....side & console/center carpets are fine. No flaws in leather at all, nor on door panels. Seats work fine.

Only bad news is fuel gauge sending unit is missing - guess I'll have to get one from Pelican.

Oil looks fresh and is right where it should be - but will be changed of course with filter.

Need to de-rust fuel tank, line it with POR 15 kit that came with car, remove and rebuild Webber carbs. Air filters look like K&N but don't see K&N on them so they probably aren't. In very good condition.

Cannot wait to get this car running then have it detailed by pros.

Only bad news is I don't like the ugly black front bumper and the car does not have fog lights - I'm a firm believer for all the light you can get in front. Plates where fog lights go are rectangular, not round.

Did any '76s come with chrome bumpers? The chrome seems to add quite a lot to me over the all black plastic ones. But then, I'm over 50.......

Feedback on my questions is greatly appreciated.

GN

The '75/'76 model bumpers can be back-dated and a lot of folks have done it, but there's a little bit of work involved (cutting off the front trunk ledge and tabs on the sides of the front fenders is required) ... and the mod is not too easily reversed.


From what I've learned, to add the correct square fog lights, some special brackets are needed, as they weren't supplied from the factory with the non-fog light big bumpered cars. A search in the classifieds might yield results.


Good original uncracked dashes are hard to find, and real expensive if you do source one. Problem is, it will probably crack eventually, unless always garaged. 914Rubber sells a really nice repro dash, made from more time-forgiving materials ... and you're in luck, they are made for the 'late' cars ('73~'76).

Thanks Mark - will check classifieds - no hurry on any of this.....probably will not make mods for the other bumpers....but will look for fog lights ...

GN

AH-HA!!!! Now I know why this car is so free of rust! It's a California car! Buena Park, CA exactly, and think it came here from there about 2000, and was driven only about 5k miles since then, and garaged most of that time......

A bump in value, no? Hot dog!

This car is a gift!

GN

A detailer I've known since his birth (first laid eyes on my wife at his parents home in Dec. 1972) is one of the best on the East Coast and his cars have won 1st place at Amelia Concours a number of times - he details million-dollar cars of all kinds and turns out Porsche's are one of his specialties - I didn't know that until he paid a visit yesterday.

He knows 914's well and said mine is a really rare find and once detailed and all minor issues are addressed ought to be worth top dollar. He said if he tells his Porsche collector friends of my 914 some will be knocking my door down to buy my car - but to not let it go until I have everything near perfect.

One of his clients is one of the nation's top Porsche owners and expertsin the world, with a collection of Porsche's in the $20+ million range, who also has a collection of original parts for almost every Porsche made. He said his client is also one of the top experts on Porsche's in the world. He encouraged me to get all original parts to fix rubbers, etc. and anything not in near perfect condition from this collector - who he plans to introduce me to soon.

I can't wait to see what he will do with the car - he was explaining to me things he does that I had never heard of that he does.

Rebuilding carbs now, hope to have running in a week. Glad to also hear my detailer friend also knows the top Porsche mechanic in VA whom, he says, can tune my carbs to perfection - with his eyes closed.......

This is getting exciting.......

GN

your detailer friend should have suggested that you source the correct fuel injection for your car (d-jet) i belive, to maximize resale value.

Mort - excellent point - well taken.

Not sure just yet how far I want to go with this car - so many options. I already think I know where a whole system might be, but at what price? Not just the cost of the system, but of proper installation with all of the input sensors needed - I used to work on old Volvo EFI systems and knew them better than most Volvo dealer mechanics....

Car has BMW 320i front brake calipers......they would need to come off too.....

Right now I'm inclined to just get it all running & looking great and enjoying it - knowing that at any point in the future I could go whole hog on a resto........

I'm a handling nut, and since I was in my 20's the first mods I'd make to any car I had was the suspension. Finding it hard to believe a mid-engine Porsche did not come with sway bars, and wondering how it can handle decently without them.

But now fearful about installing them because of the mods required to do so - not a simple add-on. And what would that do to the value of the car for a resto?

GN

Got the 914 on the lift yesterday and again - I could not be more pleased with what I found.

While a lot of the undercoating is flaking off, all the metal underneath looks like new - amazing in a 41 year old car. Not a spot of rust anywhere.

Rear brake calipers seized and need to be rebuilt or replaced...not a big deal....

GN

Mort -

Big question would be would the increase in value exceed the cost?

Seems to me doubtful - but then I really don't know the value of nice 914's.......

GN

i doubt the cost of getting fi and install would not be worth it. they run better and perform better, start easier warm quicker with the stock fi. they will run ok with carbs but it is a compromise without different cam and tuning. i think you could probably find complete d-jet for under $500.00. the more original the car, the better price it commands.

Mort -

Thanks for the input. A nationally known seller of classic cars is a friend of mine, his restorer partner a specialist in 914's (in GA) - he is telling me to leave the carbs in.

Gonna have to do a lot of research on this - I simply don't know enough.

I did discover that the 44 IDF kits are really for engines that have been fairly well modified and not stock engines - so that may be an issue in and of itself. This says a stock engine needs the 36 ICT carb kit, slightly modified takes the 40 IDF carb kit, and only "heavily" modified engines the 44 IDF kit. This engine is totally stock.

http://www.nationalcarburetors.com/weber/weber-porsche.html

And I think National Carburetors would know their stuff.

So the car could be "over" carbureted with the 44's. The PO purchased the kit on his own, took it to the Porsche dealer and had them install it.

So I'm looking for advice and wisdom here....

GN

bad advice on the carbs from mr. porsche in ga. if you are looking for max resale and originality, d-jet. did he put 44's on the car. if you are building a bigger diplacement type 4, yeah that setup can work really well. stock motor, way too much carb. i guess you can screw around with jetting and tuning to get them to work somewhat. the price of smaller carbs will exceed a used d-jet system. place a wtb in the classifieds. get the haynes manual and have at it. just like vintage english iron, the c6a points plate is now a boyer, no interest, the magdyno has been replaced with solid state internals, no interest. well setup lucas points work better than eletronic as does the a fully reconditioned mag. which wont fail on the road. fwiw. porsche used this system for a reason and the internals of the engine (cam) are designed for fi. not enough duration for carbs. can be addressed but alot more work than installing original fi.

Unfortunately, most of the time only one, or possibly a few people really know what is inside the engine cases in these old cars - until it's opened up for evaluation.

It could be totally stock, or it may have had a cam change prior to the carb install ... could have larger pistons & cylinders as well

If it's stock displacement, the dealer would have had to fiddle a lot with 44's to get the car running decent. Maybe they didn't get it right and possibly that's why it was parked years ago?

Need to check the size of the carb's internals ... knowing what jets and venturi size might shed some light on the subject, but again, it's hard to tell what mods have been done in the past without documentation.


I agree with 'Mort' ... the value will increase with the correct induction system. IIRC, only early European market cars were available with the ICT single choke carbs

Mort -

Sold me. All makes perfect sense.

The car now has new EI - do I keep it with the D-Jet system?

Not following all you said after "just like vintage iron....not sure what you mean by "no interest".

I'm a pretty good mechanic, but not looking forward to learning the new D-Jet system. Have a million questions.

Will get the Haynes Manual.

Who knows? Maybe some one on this forum has a unit.....

GN

The PO (a former 911 race drive, even 24 hr. races) gave this car to his girlfriend - after less than 2 years, she gave it back. He then bought the (wrong) carb kit, took it to the local Porsche dealer, and had them install the carbs for $1700 in 2002 - I have the invoice. The dealer should have told him they were the wrong carbs - but the dealer here has a pretty bad reputation.......

BTW, I have my own shop, lift, etc. Do all but machinist work.....

GN

PO owner today told me engine was totally stock.

Main jets are 135's, which I think is standard for 44's, venturi's are 45mm - way too large.

GN

The European 914's ran 40mm solexs and the early vanagons over there used the same, totally sell off the huge carbs and go back to EFI,you will get reasonable money for the carb setup...just make sure you buy a complete FI setup,no bits missing .
.

Again, my good friend, in whose barn it was parked for 12 years, was riding in it the day it was parked there and rode it into the barn - and he told me it was running fine then.

How the local Porsche shop got it running correctly, I don't know.

I am gonna finish rebuilding the carbs and throw them back on and see what happens......

Do I have to pull the engine to get the intake manifolds off?

GN

when i say no interest, i mean theses improvements are rarely so. the efi was often replaced because it was a cheaper fix than paying porsche dealer shop time for a car that was on the downside of the curve, local indy vw shop could install carbs for less. cheap does not make it good. i bought a bsa dbd goldstar with a concentric carb on it. the idiot i bought it from insisted it was an improvement. there is a reason a gp carb is $1000 plus and a concentric is $150.00. the gp was made for performance and is infinitely adjustable. the concentric is made of potmetal with pressed in jets.

Totally understand. Dealer (Weldon Early?) in Harrisonburg, VA sold my '72 Triumph Bonnie originally and I have a great pic of him somewhere (can't find it) next to his BSA Goldstar that he still has on his showroom floor! People want to put Mikuni's on old Triumphs, and they never work as well as the original Amal's.

So you put a gp on yours, right?

GN

The motor can stay in the car, the manifolds come off easily - only three nuts on each one (on 2.0L motors).

For the F.I. info, Jeff Bowlsby has a site chuck full of tech info/troubleshooting tips.

Scroll down to the D-jet stuff ... http://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/TechNotebook.htm

Mark -

You are worth your weight in gold.

Well, maybe silver, oz. for oz......

:-)

GN