Coondog,

I thought Rich advertised his SS 914 bumpers as USA made - or used to do so? Has that changed?

Ergo the higher price from HPH than Harrington or AA etc. from Vietnam.

Just curious ....


Tom
///////

Christoph,

Why don't you contact Mark directly & see what could be worked out with him, & about the other "specials" such as the GT front & early sharp cornered rear bumpers & the 73-74 front & 74 rear with the rubber bumper guards & 2 extra back braces behind them, etc., & his compensation for taking on all of this work to date & what he would lose by leaving PTT????

As it is so far, it really sounds more like you're another vendor hijacking the topic from Mark, where you should really go through him as an alternative negotiated between you two, then come to the group.

While I understand that PTT was perhaps planning to just fulfill Mark's GB order with cleaned up "factory seconds" from Harrington, & all of the industrial espionage, unfair competition, theft & non-disclosure issues that entails - the proper way is to conduct business directly with Mark.

Also, if the PTT plan was to take Harrington's factory seconds to fill Mark's GB sets, then I think that many folks in on the GB may not be happy, & Mark would probably find the quality & fitment problems which made them "seconds" in the first place.

That's my 2 cents worth as a business owner for almost 40 years now.

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Tom for president of the USA. REALY

Bob

That would be a very, very bad idea Bob, to have another real estate guy in there!

.... even if I never shorted my subs & contractors, consultants, etc. - as someone else did regularly & BKed many many projects & deals to short the investors!

Besides, I really really usually don't talk with double adjectives, except for humorous effect!

Maybe we could send Tillerson to negotiate this on behalf of international relations!

But I'm not clear on whether he'd go to the UK or 'Nam, cuz it's not clear whether Harrington is a UK corp or `Nam!!??

If they are a UK corp., then at least Mark is in part of their Commonwealth with whatever legal advantages that imparts (if any), him being in Canada.


Tom
///////

Nope he gets them from Vietnam

Same with AA. George claimed his were exclusive and not from Harrington group but then an employee let slip the truth. George even dings you for core bumpers.

Do you want some cheese & crackers with that whine Epstein!?

George was up front with me from day one that he cut a deal with Harrington to produce them for his company, & paid significant dough for the additional tooling to have them produced for AA as needed. His ARE an exclusive deal with the manufacturer Harrington due to paying all that cash up front for the tooling.

I don't think a core is required to get a single, or set of SS bumpers.

He gets the cores for the restored & rechromed OEM steel bumpers that AA sells.

I think you're confusing the 2 product programs Mark, & are certainly twiting around the facts here!

Also, apparently George is now selling his to Rich at HPH.

From the horse's mouth.

PS - I have confirmed that the bumper cores are NOT required to buy AA's SS bumpers & special kits/sets - period.

However, they will give you a DISCOUNT off the price if you send in your old OE factory bumpers, which they then use to restore or resell as-is to folks needing them.

Hardly a crime, & hardly a cheat, & absolutely misrepresented by you Mark!

So - do you want to correct yourself on this matter?


Tom
///////

We need Mikey to make these.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I am committed to being in with Mark on this group buy. He started this and he will choose which way to go.

"we do not want our bumpers to be sold by him, we will match his price for this group buy"

So PTT is now a competitor with his former employer through circumstances we will likely never fully understand.....but his product has yet to go through the verification process which is substantial. Don't underestimate the effort in this step to get properly fitting bumpers.

Has Harrington's offer been fully considered?

So, if Harrington is THE source for PTT's bumpers, how long do you think PTT will be in business?

Yep, it's Mark's baby. I'll send him money when he tells me it's good.

Yes, at this I'd say lets stop the speculation.
If Harrington's bumpers are being stolen then they have a huge hole to plug in their security as my guy has 4 sets ready.
I told Harrington to get the police involved and have them charged with theft....I got back peddling.
I asked them what deal they are offering ...I got more back peddling.

If what they say is true and Harrington plugs the security leak, then PTT can't deliver can they.

Obviously there's bad blood between the two, I also believe there maybe other players pressuring Harrington.

As far as Mikey goes, he already tried to make a deal with Harrington and without going into details (IMHO confidential) he told me it didn't pass his sniff test.

I'm going to take PTT to task on this Monday and see how this unfolds.


The samples will be the tell on quality, I totally plan to use escrow for the main orders.
Worse case if the samples are crap and unusable to recoup my costs something along the lines of a "go fund me" will be deeply appreciated.
If usable, but what I deem unsaleable quality I'll use them and eat it.

They already know if the quality is shit the deal is dead. I have a zero accident 914 (mine) to check fit and a perfect set of painted bumpers to check dimensions, plus decent OE tops and OE as well as 914rubber fog grills. I have the capability to check tolerances to less than 1mm, I totally made notes and spec'ed out the bumpers I sent them.
I had already made the decision to do QC on all sets myself on my car. Plus I will be the one drilling the option holes.

Really this is far beyond the point of being "worth it" for me, if you guys want to bail go for it. If not I'll press on.

Mark, for me, I am happy to place my trust in you. If you say it is good to go, I am on board.
I know this has been a huge amount of work for you already and that is greatly appreciated.
There are so many of us that are excited about the opportunity, especially the GT front bumper option.

Thanks again for tackling this!!!

Mark.

If they are good enough for you to put your name on the deal that's good enough for me.

I'm still in.

Tom

Mark,

I'm still in; thanks for all of your work on this.

Michael

Mark,

I hope that you'll hold the PTT guy's feet to the fire on whether he's selling you factory seconds from Harrington, & how he's getting them.

I think that there could be a market on here for factory seconds for DD cars & those on a tight budget - but he should've disclosed that to you so you're not caught in the middle on this.

That guy puts you in a very uncomfortable position with whatever he's doing on this venture, & not telling you the whole story.

Also, keep in mind that the legal system is vastly different in Communist countries such as Vietnam & China - not to mention their politics - so the Harrington guy may not be back-peddling, but just recognizing the difficulties of getting enforcement as UK owned or based company, with a factory in Vietnam, & going up against a local.

If these bumpers are in fact found to be stolen from Harrington, then there's also the ethical & moral question of dealing in the stolen goods.

JMHO,
Tom
///////

wow, this sucks for Mark. I hope it works out.

Rich

Well here's something you can't get from Harrington.

Samples will be shipping soon.

Wow! Very nice.

Be very careful.
I just tried mounting my new set today and the fit was not even close.
My car has never been hit or restored. The Harrington bumpers are so inaccurate that you can see the difference in the "bow" of the front bumper as soon as you open the box.
I may have gotten a "bad" set, and maybe you will have better luck, but either way, after waiting 9 weeks, I am not interested in any more dealings with them.
Will charge back through Amex.

Ouch. Got pics to save other folks from the same fate?

Standing by to see the PTT bumpers—because it is the product that speaks volumes.

Were they damaged in shipping perhaps?

I have bought two sets from Harrington group.
They are absolut perfect fit.
Very Nice!

Niklas

Any word on the group buy Mark?

I too am curious

I am also curious about the group buy. I am not on the list, But I am interested.

Hey Mark,
Looking good! What is the finish on these bumpers? Is it polished stainless or is there a coating?

The sample bumpers are in transit
We'll see how long they get held up at customs

Stainless no coating. Nice thing is if you get a scratch you should be able to sand and buff it out.
Con is bare SS technically can oxidize from salt, etc., but that shouldn't be a issue for a garaged 914 and especially if the bumper has a nice coat of wax.

I can't wait to see the sample's. I am ready to be added to the list if they are nice! I want the GT front bumper & the early rear. I can even swing the $1200 at the moment so hopefully they will get through customs quick

Funny AA is saying on the club site your GB is dead and offering up bumpers. I'll make a special for front and rear tops to help support this GB.
Id offer a special for those that have stepoed up to support Marks efforts here.
Ill talk to mark about how to handle, but will offer up a good discount with free domestic shipping.
Mark

PS put me down for an early set!

George is such a sleaze bag. He'll lie to his mother to make a buck. I'm still shocked he has a presence in the 914 world. It seems all the 356 & 911 guys know his reputation and stay far away.

Do Tell

I can't wait to see pictures of these things in Mark's hands. The more I think about it the more enticing getting a set is...

I called AA when I was looking into buying Stainless Bumpers.
I really wasn't crazy about giving my Credit Card Info to a Company in Vietnam..
The people at AA told me lie after lie and insisted THEIR bumpers were better than
Harrington Bumpers because Harrington was using worn out molds.

Pretty funny considering AA buys their bumpers from Harrington.

I finally bought direct from Harrington and had no issues at all.
I wouldn't buy anything from AA

Mark, assuming the quality of product makes you happy, I'd like to get in for one set, options B & C. (If it had option D I could live with that too.)

OK, first sorry this is taking so long.

Samples are here, 3 sets, but it's going to take me till the end of the weekend to do all the QC checks.
I have to work at the jobs that put food on the table and my 996 engine program is consuming most of my time.

Overall pretty good, but I'm finding numerous small issues that need to be corrected before they are ready for prime time.
These include things like the opening for fog grills is not cut out enough for the grill to sit down correctly and grill mount holes are off slightly. The one rear the brackets are about 1/8" proud, might be able to correct this one by trimming the dogbone steel insert a bit, but I again want this corrected.
They went and frick'n welded nuts to the inside front bumper brackets.

There's a few more things but let me scope them totally out first.
All these things need to be corrected.

From a visual check the GT bumper looks outstanding.

I was hoping that I could drop ship to some who wanted no options or only GT (option E), as it would save on the 2nd shipping from Canada cost, but I really don't think that's a good plan.
I think I should QC every bumper, also I think I'm going to demand a 20% holdback from the manufacturer till they pass QC.

I was also hoping to sell a couple of these sets to recoup some cash, I might be able to soon, but these ones need work on this end which I wasn't planing on.

So progress, but it's slow going.

I really want a GT bumper.. And don't care to much about qc. Maybe I could work you a deal on my prototype muffler.?

Mark,
Thanks for the update. No rush at this point, better to get it right after all your work so far!

The GT bumper looks awesome by the way!!

Thank you for tackling this.

The GT bumper looks really nice...thanks for taking this arduous project on!

Hi

"I was hoping that I could drop ship to some who wanted no options or only GT (option E)"

I'm more than willing to buy, right now, the option E front bumper as I'm on the list for that. I'm not worried about shipping or customs costs.

Jon

Good Day
Very Impressive, they will be a wonderful improvement in place of the black painted steel one I have now.
Walt

OOH, they look nice.
I have months of rust work so no rush on my end, but I am glad to see ithe project is still moving.

So I've been fitting the GT bumper, it's a fair bit of work as a bunch of the holes are a bit off and the grill holes need a lot of trimming. I'm going to make the manufacturer cut them proper as I don't want to do this for every bumper. But I'll likely tell them I'll drill the holes for the grill mount screws.

The holes for the rear top was spot on, but the fronts were way off on studs #2 and # 4. I'm going to get that corrected, I don't mind a hair off as that's easily fixed, but these two were was way off,

One side fit's perfect the other is a hair down, but I think the washer I'm using is too big and hitting the 914 mount indent. I'll try the correct OE size washer to see if it corrects this issue.

One thing about the crappy colour change on my 914 is it makes I nice line for checking the fit.


Overall I'd say with corrections these will be a pretty good fit.

One thing I noticed is these are 914rubber grills they are quite a bit brighter than the stainless steel. Not that bad, but it is noticeable.
Maybe a little road grime will tone the grills down a bit.

Fit in the corners, like I said I'll see if the correct size washer will let me raise the left side a bit more.

Ignore my "custom" LE bumper valance with cutout.
It will look better with the correct valance.

Looks good.. I would be good with that on my car.

Yep overall I'm happy, just have to get the little details worked out before it's ready for prime time.

Oh and my wife said it looks bad because the bumper is green!
I laughed as I told her it was the reflection of the grass.