Exactly!

I'm interested in a set....

interested

This project is definitely heading in the right direction. I think this could be one of the most significant safety improvements one could make to their car to preserve it for the future.

+1

I've got a LED strip just under the roof, attached to the chrome - makes for a great 3rd brake light - easy to attach too.

Once this comes out I'm VERY interested in buying a set to replace the sad lights behind the plastic. Please count me in.

Cheers!

Interested

Would be interested if the LED's are of the correct lens color & sequential turn signals.

For a long time blue LEDs did not exist, so it is not a matter of adding a color filter. Once blue was invented they started showing up on all kinds of products and enabled RGB combinations (pixels) to create a wide range of colors.

most teeners get hit from behind these days. At least in the accidents where the other party is at fault. I remember a beautiful Irish Green '71 6er that I wanted to buy from the board...someone else bought it and got immediately HAMMERED in a rear-ender. Not his fault at all IIRC. We're too low not to have bright tail lights and a 3rd brake light any more. Thanks for the hard work on this.

So Volvo uses a diffuser that looks like a half a magnifying glass between the led and lens. I will try to post some pics. The red leds they use are not all that bright, but stack the assmbaly together and WOW bright brake light. Maybe a diffuser lens / red lad would give you the pop your looking for?


jcl

I'm looking for more powerful LEDs for my next test. Also looking for a red LED for the tail/brake lights. These have to be as bright or brighter than normal brake lights.

These LEDs are not cheap as it looks like the LEDs will cost over $1 a piece.

Time to order the LEDs below.

Red LED

White LED

Have you looked at LumiLEDs?

Philips LumiLEDS

Oznium.com

Piranha Super Flux

All Electronics

The super flux ones look just like the volvo 3rd brake light leds. I think the little dome on the top acts like a focus or diffuser?


jcl

My mom worked at LumiLEDS several years ago. She gave me a few of those SuperFlux LED's and they are bright as hell! I believe they are meant for automotive use.

I checked out the LumiLEDs. They look pretty good. I will get some Amber and White ones.

I found Red LEDs through digikey to be more cost efficient than through Future who carries LumiLEDs.

The plan now is to put red LEDs under the red brake lens and amber under the amber turnsignal lens.

I have orders some more LEDs to try out. I want to make sure that whichever LED is chosen it will be as bright or brighter than the existing bulbs.

Red LED Digikey

Red LED Digikey

Warm White LED Digikey

Cool White LED Digikey

Amber LED Future Electronics

Neutral White LED Future Electronics

Thanks for putting this together, Spoke. I bet you will sell a lot of them...

The test I did with 10 LEDs putting out about 40LM each didn't achieve the brightness I am looking for although they were bright as hell.

One item that is designed into all LED lighting is proper lense and/or reflector designed for the LEDs. This is true on all factory-designed LED lights.

So I've been looking into reflectors for LEDs and ran across the following thread on CandlePoweredForum discussing LED brake and tail lights.

I don't know any of these guys nor do I know their backgrounds but they sound quite knowledgeable about automotive lighting and LEDs.

Seems all of the "experts" on this thread indicate that the drop-in LED replacement bulbs are not very good and may even be illegal to replace filament bulbs with LED drop-in's in tail and brake light fixtures in some states.

They bring up good points about brake/tail light modifications and ramifications concerning liability if one is involved in an accident.

CandlePoweredForum Thread

In short, this LED implementation that I am doing could be illegal since it involves modifying a safety feature on an automobile. If I sell this to someone and they have an accident or get pulled over for having illegal lights, would I be liable? Maybe I'd have to state "for off-road applications only".

Here's another thread on LED automotive lighting and lenses.

Photonics Thread

Many years ago I modified a 69 mustang rear tail light lens and found out it needed so much reflector lens to pass tx inspection. I bet if you make a light setup and it's brighter than the original lights it will be good. I would not worry about it on my car but you how lawyers are. Off road only is also ok for me.
I tried those led replacement bulbs in a 86 blazer and they were brighter but didn't last very long for some reason.

For those thinking about changing to LED bulb replacements, research carefully. This guy tried them on his bike and didn't like the results.

Superbright LED vs Standard 1157 Filament Bulb

I would be perfectly happy for my tail light kit to come with a big sticker on the box that said "FOR OFF ROAD USE ONLY". I just really want this project to be a part of my build.

When I was involved with a colleague manufacturing custom cycle chassis, suspensions systems and other components, they were sold with a disclaimer stating "for show use only". Liability insurance quotes were astronomical

Lighting systems must meet DOT requirements, but there are numerous aftermarket lighting components on the market, as we all see on the road every day. I'm curious if they have a disclaimer included in their instructions

Yea, I'm OK with "for off road use only". Anything to keep this project moving forward.

Thanks for running with this.

DAvid

Obviously I would only be using these on my track car.

OK stupid question... how about finding a newer car with an existing LED setup that has a pattern similar to what we need? Could that be used as a starting point and modify/add from there? Too expensive? Maybe an American car that has plenty in the bone yards? I'm a complete novice on this....just popped in my head.

I like this project and I hope you are able to follow through with it.

I think I would try and locate a light meter. This judging by comparison is not the best idea. Photographers use meters to get the best results. It shouldn't be too difficult to locate a reasonably priced meter.

The issue finding a late model car with working LED tail lights is that the tail lights would command a good bit of coin as replacement parts.

I got more LED samples and mounted them on my test board.

I have more powerful white LEDs as well as several red and amber LEDs for brake and turn signals. I will be checking these out over the weekend.

Awesome!!! I hope this project comes through, so I can just buy them, instead of making my own

Ah, got it...see I knew it was a dumb question!

Glad you started this thread before I bought LED bulbs...was just about to pull the trigger. I'm in for sure on these.

The more I see LEDs on vehicles the more I'm convinced I will need some type of reflector to channel the light. Here's one I found online that looks like it would work.

Wholesale LED Reflector

Try a piece of clear acrylic. Sand blast one side. It should diffuse the light enough.

I started testing the next batch of LED samples looking for some more efficient LEDs. Also doing red, amber, and white LEDs.

To get higher lumens, got to go to LEDs with higher current capability. The one in this post is a red LED with test lumen of 71lm @ 350mA and max 170lm @ 1Amp.

These suckers are BRIGHT! I quickly realized when testing these that viewing them with my eyes is dangerous. I was running 150ma through 5 of them and I would estimate that they are about as bright as my current filament brake light bulb. I plan to use 20 of these.

So for this testing, I have to be careful not to look at them at any angle. I put my hand on them and I swear I can see my bones.

Cree Red LED

Here's a pic about 6 feet away from the LEDs at about a 90 degree angle with no lights on.

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Red LEDs viewed through the brake lens. Being only 5 LEDs. With 20 LEDs I will have no issue with brightness. After about 10 minutes at this intensity, the temperature of the LEDs is barely above ambient.

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so far!!!

What will the total current draw be for a complete set (both tail lights)?

What is the total current draw of OEM incandescent bulbs (both tail lights)?

Oh hell ya spoke. I think those are the best so far. Looks like you found the answer. Now just get em into production.

Making nice progress. I really like the way this going.

After looking at your board, you might want to move the DC/DC converters to the top of the board. This will make it much easier to manufacture if you decide to have the board stuffing done by machine. Also if you buy LED's by the reel, the price is much cheaper. I have a PCB manufacturing line at my office, if you need to have boards stuffed some time.

ok so i got around to getting some pics of the volvo 3rd brake set up. The first pic is crappy but the bright part is magnify piece in place the not so bright are just the leds.
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second is a side shot

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And then the diffuser lens lifted so you can see it

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So maybe brighter leds are not the answer? Are there any "focuser" lenses out there that could be added to the board end of things?

The other car tail light leds i was looking at had a cup around the led. It was the old flashlight idea. Small light but the reflective dia is bigger/brighter.


just giving input.

jcl

Thanks for the visuals. The lenses are an important part of the LED lights. I think pretty much all LED lights have some type of lens or reflector to focus or diffuse the light as needed for the application.

I'd be interested in a Euro tail light spec set.

Next, can someone do something to modify the fog lights to add a halo driving light? I'd be interested in that.

I'm relocating to the South Bay so I'll be driving the 914 alot more and want it visible day or night!!

Sean

For the tail lights, the plan is 20 LED at about 50ma each. This works out to about 0.25A draw.

With brake lights on, the 20 LED will do about 200ma each or about 0.9A

The 1157 tail light is about 7W or 0.5A draw. The brake light is 21W or about 1.6A

Thanks for the offer. We'll see where this goes.

The dc/dc converters won't fit on the top of the board because of the way the LEDs are lined up. I thought about that at first and came to the conclusion that they must be on the back of the board.

I'm looking for an economical supply for lenses. Here's one I found for individual LEDs. I will have to get a few samples to test them out.

As with the LEDs, these in particular are not cheap at $2 per LED. 50 LED per taillight assembly starts to add up. The LEDs also are looking to be about $2 each.

I should be able to find similar lenses through Asian wholesale supply companies.

15mm LED Lens

I never expected these to be inexpensive. I am in for a set and appreciate all of the work you are doing to make these the high quality parts that our cars deserve.

I'm in for a set as well regardless. There's nothing worse than seeing a car bearing down on you in the rear view mirror an wondering if the driver sees your brake lights.

I've ordered some sample reflectors from Future Electronics. They have good prices and seem to have stock in hand.

I stayed with a tight beam angle 12 to 18 degrees assuming the light needs to be focused behind the car as much as possible.

I should have these in a few days then I'll do some testing to see which works best.

General Luminaire

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Polymer Optics

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Carclo Optics

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Great and thanks for the update.

I might have a contact for you on lenses.

Got the lens samples in this week. 2 of the samples seem to work well.

The only issue I see at this point is the beam angle (12 and 18 degrees) may be a little too tight. These collect the light very well but produce more of a focused beam than a distributed light. I will need to put these behind the 914 lens to see the diffusion added by the 914 lens.

This first one is the Polymer Optics lens. This has a 12 degree beam angle.

I have only 3 samples shown here. This is with 200ma current through the red LEDs. At 200ma, the LEDs remain cool as ever. I've run these for 15 minutes at a time and they are just above ambient temp.

HereClick to view attachment

This is the pattern on the ceiling about 6 feet above my desk. The light is quite bright but as is observed, very focused. This is 3 LEDs, I'm planning to have 20 LEDs for the brake/running lights.

Click to view attachment

Next up are the Carclo lens with 18 degree beam angle.

The lenses are tiny items only 10mm across and are very efficient at focusing the light energy from the LEDs.

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Just a comparison of the light with and without a lens. This is with 4ma of current.

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This is the pattern on the ceiling with 3 LEDs running 200ma. The beam is a bit more dispersed as compared to the Polymer Optics lens. I'm liking these ones more but I still not sure if the beam is too focused.

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