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Mueller
QUOTE(Cairo94507 @ Mar 25 2018, 11:01 AM) *

Hey Mike - I believe that is the same place where I had my 6 steam cleaned after I bought it. Mine looked like it was at the bottom of an oil drum for years and had oil and caked on crud that was like 1/4" thick all over the bottom.

The steam cleaner did a good job. Ultimately, that is what allowed me to realize the whole car needed to come apart rather than just fixing the major components and trying to drive it. Not a lot of places with a lift that do steam cleaning anymore. beerchug.gif



3rd gen operators there, the hot water tank is from 1927 and looks in great shape.

Mueller
Test fitting muffler ...... Flowmaster 80 dual in, dual outlet. Want to make a poormans GT muffler. $50 brand new on Amazon for the muffler.

I found a company in Germany making these for 911's (cannot find the darn link now)

Plan is to cap the lower outlets on the side.

Once I get my HE's I can model up the rest.

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tygaboy
So that muffler has an "X" pipe inside, like this one?
I'm looking for something like this pic, a true cross over that I can use to have an inlet and and outlet each end - but I'm limited to about 5" height/thickness.
This schematic is for a 370Z muffler but it's 6"...
Mueller
No, not a crossflow

Roughly like the pic below. Harry with the 3.5 Honda/Acura V6 powered 914 has this muffler however his only has one outlet. He didn't know of the 2 outlet option when building his car. Sounds great with his motor.

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Chris914n6
QUOTE(tygaboy @ Apr 28 2018, 11:55 AM) *

So that muffler has an "X" pipe in side, like this one?
I'm looking for something like this pic, a true cross over that I can use to have an inlet and and outlet each end - but I'm limited to about 5" height/thickness.
This schematic is for a 370Z muffler but it's 6"...

Sounds like you want the Magnaflow I've been eyeballing for my 3.5L upgrade.
tygaboy
QUOTE(Chris914n6 @ Apr 28 2018, 02:06 PM) *

QUOTE(tygaboy @ Apr 28 2018, 11:55 AM) *

So that muffler has an "X" pipe in side, like this one?
I'm looking for something like this pic, a true cross over that I can use to have an inlet and and outlet each end - but I'm limited to about 5" height/thickness.
This schematic is for a 370Z muffler but it's 6"...

Sounds like you want the Magnaflow I've been eyeballing for my 3.5L upgrade.


Is this what you're talking about? Hmmm, not quite the same as the Borla and its two, separate inner pipes, but maybe... I'll have to give Magnaflow a call and see what they say. Thanks!
Andyrew
QUOTE(tygaboy @ Apr 28 2018, 11:55 AM) *

So that muffler has an "X" pipe inside, like this one?
I'm looking for something like this pic, a true cross over that I can use to have an inlet and and outlet each end - but I'm limited to about 5" height/thickness.
This schematic is for a 370Z muffler but it's 6"...

Why not just build one yourself? smash.gif

I believe your looking for a Camaro style muffler. I believe magnaflow and flowmaster make one similar. Various sizes.
Mueller
Well......

Got an offer I couldn't pass up and the wife didn't offer any resistance when I brought it up.

Remember a month ago when I drove a Honda/Acura 3.5 J series V6 converted 914? (250 to 275+ hp depending which model it came out of)

I'm buying the entire engine swap minus radiator setup and transmission. He is not sure what he'll be replacing it with but I'm sure it'll be at least twice the power.

Going with Celica GT based radiator and fan setup.
Radiator should be here this week and then I'll start cutting holes and picking up the aluminum sheet for the shrouding.

Now to see if I can unload the 1.8 I was building, lots of nice parts for it.

Anyone know off hand which is the primary and secondary fan?
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Chris H.
smilie_pokal.gif

Nice buy Mike! You'll love it...but then again you know that if you have experienced the drive train already. Maybe you can coordinate a swap weekend and get that thing installed! Is the adapter plate for a 901?

I'll send you some measurements for my shroud when it gets here.
Mueller
QUOTE(Chris H. @ Jul 10 2018, 04:55 PM) *

smilie_pokal.gif

Nice buy Mike! You'll love it...but then again you know that if you have experienced the drive train already. Maybe you can coordinate a swap weekend and get that thing installed! Is the adapter plate for a 901?

I'll send you some measurements for my shroud when it gets here.



Yes, 901 which I have 2 to choose from smile.gif

It uses a factory Honda ECU with a modified Honda harness so only 8 wires needed to hook up to the engine or something crazy like that. No need to tune or dyno which is nice.
914forme
Nice Mike, the 3.5 is a great engine and so many out there. Should move that car along nicely.
tygaboy
Welcome to the wild world of engine swapping! sunglasses.gif
Let's see if we can come up with other custom stuff can you add to the list of mods that'll ultimately slow down your build!

(Ask me how I know...) lol-2.gif

Seriously, that is a cool engine. If I wasn't doing the LS, I think I'd have gone Honda.
I gotta get out your way and check this out in person...
Andyrew
Love this! My wife's Pilot has loads of power and is twice the weight of a 914!

That's a good motor right there. Great initial punch and amazing power on the top end!

I think the Celica radiator should do well for it but I would think 1.25" hoses might be a better choice.
Chris H.
QUOTE(Mueller @ Jul 10 2018, 07:07 PM) *

QUOTE(Chris H. @ Jul 10 2018, 04:55 PM) *

smilie_pokal.gif

Nice buy Mike! You'll love it...but then again you know that if you have experienced the drive train already. Maybe you can coordinate a swap weekend and get that thing installed! Is the adapter plate for a 901?

I'll send you some measurements for my shroud when it gets here.



Yes, 901 which I have 2 to choose from smile.gif

It uses a factory Honda ECU with a modified Honda harness so only 8 wires needed to hook up to the engine or something crazy like that. No need to tune or dyno which is nice.


8 wires???? You're bypassing the WORST part of the conversion process. It takes weeks and a huge piece of plywood to parse out an entire donor car harness. You don't have to deal with any of that!
Mueller
QUOTE(tygaboy @ Jul 10 2018, 05:59 PM) *

Welcome to the wild world of engine swapping! sunglasses.gif
Let's see if we can come up with other custom stuff can you add to the list of mods that'll ultimately slow down your build!

(Ask me how I know...) lol-2.gif

Seriously, that is a cool engine. If I wasn't doing the LS, I think I'd have gone Honda.
I gotta get out your way and check this out in person...



Only complaint I have with the Honda motor is how tall it is since it is a 60° narrow V6 and the manifold they use is huge!
Andyrew
QUOTE(Chris H. @ Jul 10 2018, 07:43 PM) *

QUOTE(Mueller @ Jul 10 2018, 07:07 PM) *

QUOTE(Chris H. @ Jul 10 2018, 04:55 PM) *

smilie_pokal.gif

Nice buy Mike! You'll love it...but then again you know that if you have experienced the drive train already. Maybe you can coordinate a swap weekend and get that thing installed! Is the adapter plate for a 901?

I'll send you some measurements for my shroud when it gets here.



Yes, 901 which I have 2 to choose from smile.gif

It uses a factory Honda ECU with a modified Honda harness so only 8 wires needed to hook up to the engine or something crazy like that. No need to tune or dyno which is nice.


8 wires???? You're bypassing the WORST part of the conversion process. It takes weeks and a huge piece of plywood to parse out an entire donor car harness. You don't have to deal with any of that!



agree.gif
That's just not fair!!
Mueller
QUOTE(Andyrew @ Jul 10 2018, 08:19 PM) *

QUOTE(Chris H. @ Jul 10 2018, 07:43 PM) *

QUOTE(Mueller @ Jul 10 2018, 07:07 PM) *

QUOTE(Chris H. @ Jul 10 2018, 04:55 PM) *

smilie_pokal.gif

Nice buy Mike! You'll love it...but then again you know that if you have experienced the drive train already. Maybe you can coordinate a swap weekend and get that thing installed! Is the adapter plate for a 901?

I'll send you some measurements for my shroud when it gets here.



Yes, 901 which I have 2 to choose from smile.gif

It uses a factory Honda ECU with a modified Honda harness so only 8 wires needed to hook up to the engine or something crazy like that. No need to tune or dyno which is nice.


8 wires???? You're bypassing the WORST part of the conversion process. It takes weeks and a huge piece of plywood to parse out an entire donor car harness. You don't have to deal with any of that!



agree.gif
That's just not fair!!


Hey, I still have to struggle wiring up the fans correctly smile.gif
Andyrew
What water pump does it use? What ECU does it use?

My Davies Craig water pump and controller is awesome... Highly recommended and let's you pick the maintained temp....

The fan wiring should be really simple. Just link them together and go. Run a big enough wire to the relay and to the fans themselves to deal with the load and you won't have anything to worry about.
Mueller
QUOTE(Andyrew @ Jul 10 2018, 08:37 PM) *

What water pump does it use? What ECU does it use?

My Davies Craig water pump and controller is awesome... Highly recommended and let's you pick the maintained temp....

The fan wiring should be really simple. Just link them together and go. Run a big enough wire to the relay and to the fans themselves to deal with the load and you won't have anything to worry about.



Factory water pump is all that Harry ran and he was told it was good enough for the sand rail guys.

Factory ECU, uses a MAP sensor in the manifold. Should be very reliable and depending on serial number of unit, can be data logged and tweaked with a Hondata $300 program/hardware.

For the fans I have an older SPAL pwm controller that I got dirt cheap due to a bad assembly procedure at the factory. They soldered a few capacitors too far off the board and the leads would break due to vibration. Easy fix.

or just going old school with a temp sensor and simple relays.
Chris914n6
Pretty sure I figured out 1 is drivers side, 2 pass.

I ran an 8 gauge from the battery to the frunk --> fuse distribution block --> relays to fans and headlights with a couple extra for amps.
Also ran the fan trigger wires past idiot lights in the gauges just to be in the know.

Just 8 wires... I hate you grouphug.gif I basically copied the factory fuse box for like 3 dozen connections.

Amazon had the 50ft roll of Gates hose down to $100 at one time.

Now that you have a water pumper, use the 924/944 combo gauge plus the temp sender. I can't imagine Honda didn't use a 1/8npt like everyone else.
Andyrew
I am using one of these cheap controllers for the intercooler fan. Seems to be working fine and I dont see why it cant work for something bigger like a radiator with an appropriate relay setup.

https://www.amazon.com/outstanding-Temperat...+controller+12v

If I were to do it again I think maybe I would go with this one, as I cant find the one that had my nice black lexan overlay with buttons.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B008KVGWT4/ref=ss...customerReviews

My radiator fan controller, electric pump and electric pump controller were all Davies Craig which was completely awesome.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Davies-Craig-150L-...JAAAOSwjUxbLFVK
Mueller
QUOTE(Andyrew @ Jul 10 2018, 10:49 PM) *

I am using one of these cheap controllers for the intercooler fan. Seems to be working fine and I dont see why it cant work for something bigger like a radiator with an appropriate relay setup.

https://www.amazon.com/outstanding-Temperat...+controller+12v

If I were to do it again I think maybe I would go with this one, as I cant find the one that had my nice black lexan overlay with buttons.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B008KVGWT4/ref=ss...customerReviews

My radiator fan controller, electric pump and electric pump controller were all Davies Craig which was completely awesome.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Davies-Craig-150L-...JAAAOSwjUxbLFVK



I just ordered the cheaper unit, can replace the 20A relay with higher amp solid state relay I have already that is similar to the units Mike B is running.
76-914
Welcome to the "Dark Side" Mike. beerchug.gif
Chris H.
I knew we'd get him biggrin.gif . Mike didn't you stuff a VR6 into a green 914 a long time ago? My memory stinks but think you aborted the mission to focus on a Volvo 200 series maybe?
Mueller
QUOTE(Chris H. @ Jul 11 2018, 09:02 AM) *

I knew we'd get him biggrin.gif . Mike didn't you stuff a VR6 into a green 914 a long time ago? My memory stinks but think you aborted the mission to focus on a Volvo 200 series maybe?



I got the VR6 installed in the white 914 that had the cage in it, I want to say California was changing the smog requirements again so I bailed on it thinking it'll never pass smog. The guy I sold that car to still has it....just sitting around collecting dust.

The motor went into a sand rail from what I understand.

Mike Bellis
QUOTE(Mueller @ Jul 10 2018, 10:08 PM) *


Factory water pump is all that Harry ran and he was told it was good enough for the sand rail guys.

Factory ECU, uses a MAP sensor in the manifold. Should be very reliable and depending on serial number of unit, can be data logged and tweaked with a Hondata $300 program/hardware.

For the fans I have an older SPAL pwm controller that I got dirt cheap due to a bad assembly procedure at the factory. They soldered a few capacitors too far off the board and the leads would break due to vibration. Easy fix.

or just going old school with a temp sensor and simple relays.

Sand rail guys aren't pushing water 16' in a loop. Their rads are mounted closer to the engine. My Audi pump was not up to the task. I don't have a fancy controller for my pump like Andyrew but I don't need it. Both of our cars run cool.

My fan controller is just a dual relay with a thermistor on the radiator. On temp is adjustible on a mini potentiometer for each relay. Simple and effective.

I hit up a junk yard for the Toyota plugs for the fan harness.
Mueller
Radiator came in today.

More importantly is that I got the 914 moved into the garage. Took all day to move and organize all that crap.

Removed axles and shifter tonight, hope to drop motor/transmission in the morning.

A few before pics of garage.

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maf914
Impressive looking radiator and fan set-up. Looks like you will need plenty of exhaust air outlet area from the front trunk. idea.gif
EdwardBlume
I know where you can get a 3.5 emblem... av-943.gif
Chris914n6
QUOTE(Mike Bellis @ Jul 11 2018, 06:11 PM) *

Sand rail guys aren't pushing water 16' in a loop. Their rads are mounted closer to the engine. My Audi pump was not up to the task. I don't have a fancy controller for my pump like Andyrew but I don't need it. Both of our cars run cool.

My fan controller is just a dual relay with a thermistor on the radiator. On temp is adjustible on a mini potentiometer for each relay. Simple and effective.

I hit up a junk yard for the Toyota plugs for the fan harness.

My Nissan pumped just fine. Ran the fans off the ECU and it kept itself cool. The hoses will cool 5-10F just being in the airflow under the car, so adjust the controller accordingly.
The fan terminals are a common size, I just bought crimp connectors for mine.
worn
QUOTE(maf914 @ Jul 12 2018, 04:28 AM) *

Impressive looking radiator and fan set-up. Looks like you will need plenty of exhaust air outlet area from the front trunk. idea.gif

Impressive moving stuff to make it work. That is back breaking challenging stuff, cause everything needs to find a home. Well done!
ClayPerrine
QUOTE(Mueller @ Jul 12 2018, 01:15 AM) *

Radiator came in today.

More importantly is that I got the 914 moved into the garage. Took all day to move and organize all that crap.

Removed axles and shifter tonight, hope to drop motor/transmission in the morning.

A few before pics of garage.



Reminds me of our garage. 10lbs of stromberg.gif in a 5lb bag. biggrin.gif
Mueller
A huge shout out to Cali914 (Harry)

Not only did he deliver the V6 to my home, he stuck around for hours helping me install it (I think he did more work than I did)


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sixnotfour
aktion035.gif Rock On Mike...
Chris H.
Wow that's great Mike. Looks like it fits pretty well. Did you get axles with it? Just curious if you are running stock CVs.
914forme
I know what would happen if I ran stock CVs wacko.gif

In reality since he is running the 901 he should play nice in first gear and have no real trouble.

Now with the torque he should be able to launch in 2nd gear the majority of the time and well that being done who knows.

My new attitude thanks to Mark is a running 914 and driving 914 is better than any 914 on jack stands, rotisserie or other form of none operation.

Now if only I applied that truth, soon, very soon......

Mike glad to see it coming along so quickly for you, If I was a bit closer I would be there with trans on my chest helping you get this thing together. aktion035.gif
Dion
Awesome stuff Mike. I had no idea you were going this route. Wow!
mb911
QUOTE(Dion @ Jul 13 2018, 12:13 PM) *

Awesome stuff Mike. I had no idea you were going this route. Wow!


agree.gif But glad you're working on the car. Gonna be great.
shoguneagle
WHEN ONE GOES TO THE "DARK SIDE", HE REALLY GOES ALL OUT. Great looking project that is a lot further along than I realized. Conversion looks great and very well done. Results of a frustrated "Garage Engineere".
Mueller
Busted out the heat gun today, didn't have enough time get real dirty so this little project was perfect for the short time slot.

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914forme
Your seams look really nice, mine where so full of crude, I think Hans was show Anton how to put ten pounds of seam sealer in a 2 pound space. I also took a MAP torch and heated the seam to burn out the crap. And even when I was welding them I still got stuff coming up into the weld puddle. headbang.gif
Mueller
Cut out the inlet and outlet holes for the cooling system.


Need to trim the valance, not sure if I need to cut the bumper or not. A few Subaru guys have not needed to cut the bumper so I might get lucky.

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Chris914n6
You have seen mine right? Air enters thru the fog grills and gets directed towards the center. I had to rivet a piece of plastic to the bumper bracket to block flow the wrong way. I also didn't cut between the holes. Cooling air volume in the sweet spot. You should be fine with what you have so far.

edit: added pics. No fogs obviously and 75 so horns under chassis.

IPB Image

IPB Image
tygaboy
Looking good, Mike!
Don't you just love the knock out punches? I've been wondering if I could get away without notching the bumper on my car so I'll be interested to see how your plan works out.
Take care and keep up the great work.
Chris H.
Great start. It's easy to cut more if you need to but that should be fine.

What's with those horns man biggrin.gif ?
tygaboy
Mike - I forgot to ask: What size holes are those? I have some dimple dies that you're welcome to borrow, if I have the right size.
That press is looks to be the same one I have and it should work fine, again, assuming I have the right size die.
Let me know...
Chris
Andyrew
You'll rely on your fan more than you would otherwise but I think that it'll still be fine smile.gif that Honda motor runs pretty cool being all aluminum. If you shroud your exit you'll have much better flow, and ducting or shrouding your entering air would increase your flow as well.
Dion
So this engine is going to have an equivalent of, if not more , of the power and of
a 3.2? Good god, that’s gonna be a rocket.
Keep at it Mike.
BIGKAT_83
QUOTE(tygaboy @ Jul 19 2018, 10:17 AM) *

Mike - I forgot to ask: What size holes are those? I have some dimple dies that you're welcome to borrow, if I have the right size.
That press is looks to be the same one I have and it should work fine, again, assuming I have the right size die.
Let me know...
Chris

The harbor freight punch set is for pipe sizes and most dimple die sets are for tubing sizes and won’t work.
914forme
agree.gif That being said these will work with the punches and press you have if you want to dimple dies them.
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